I agree, having now looked at the wiring diagram
It would normally form part of the wing loom connections, but appears to be floating free
Cheers
Chris
The "Blue Danube"
- Thread starter bleudanube
- Start date
I agree, having now looked at the wiring diagram
It would normally form part of the wing loom connections, but appears to be floating free
Cheers
Chris
Hi Sven,
Loving your work - well done...!
I don't have the manuals in front of me currently - IIRC yellow is high or low main beam...? HRE's advice is sound - turn on the lights and test with a multimeter. I'm sure that goes into the guard loom.
The loom into the LH guard often has unused female connectors depending on the options, brake pad warning, twin or single horns. It could also be one of those.
Don' forget the earth fly leads both sides (front of car) to the guard loom - attached to the bolts on the front cross-member. They are often left off after restorations.
Body adjustment is constant thing - there is no such thing as adjusting it and it's right.
I've always started at the rear guards and moved forward - then back again, then forward again.... You have the least amount of adjustment with the rear guards and often it's the twist of the panel that gets you.
When I say this I mean the height of the back of the rear guard relative to the height of the front of the rear guard - that determines the line of the panels to the front of the car. There is little to play with adjustment wise this way with the rear guards - often you get to the rear guards and have to readjust back as they can't be made to line up.
Double tape ALL the edges first. Fit the front bumper and valance and closing panels - with the bolts screwed up but loose if you know what I mean. You need to be able to move this assembly around.
First adjustment is with the panels without glass and all the other stuff - easier to do this way less chance of damage and no change of breaking glass when making adjustments.
You may be moving things a lot to make it all fit so it's better this way - just fit the locks and rubber mounting receivers on the front and rear guards.
Critical things to note.
1. Consistency in the gap between the side sill and door bottom inner side (where the bottom door rubber runs) - fit the bottom door rubber.
2. The vertical height of the doors against the body - for front bonnet alignment
3. The angle of the door against the body - for correct glass pressure against the rubber.
4. The height of the very front mounting point for the front guards - this meets the line down the side of the car dictated from the rear guards.
Leaving the front bumper and valance fully assembled but loose will allow you to push and pull it all.
Good luck with the spot where the bonnet meets the front door top - I've never been able to get that quite right with everything else in adjustment - even with NOS panels.
Once you have it all right without all the glass, trim, lights etc. then fit all that stuff and redo it all again - it will have changed, but the adjustments should be minor.
When fitting the glass use new plastic guides - they are cheap and easy to get.
The critical thing is not to shut the door with the window wound up without checking the alignment in the frame and angle of the window. The pressure of the glass on the rubber can be slightly adjusted by using the bolts each end of the door which allow the angle to be adjusted - more adjustment can be had via the shims on the hinge mounts.
Lastly - don't be afraid to push and pull the metal edges a little to get them to fit if you know what you are doing. Often the doors need a slight twist (eg. door mounted on car, lock end of door - push the top to the left and bottom to the right) to get a decent match.
Give me a call if you want to go through it over the phone.
Cheers,
Mark...
Loving your work - well done...!
I don't have the manuals in front of me currently - IIRC yellow is high or low main beam...? HRE's advice is sound - turn on the lights and test with a multimeter. I'm sure that goes into the guard loom.
The loom into the LH guard often has unused female connectors depending on the options, brake pad warning, twin or single horns. It could also be one of those.
Don' forget the earth fly leads both sides (front of car) to the guard loom - attached to the bolts on the front cross-member. They are often left off after restorations.
Body adjustment is constant thing - there is no such thing as adjusting it and it's right.
I've always started at the rear guards and moved forward - then back again, then forward again.... You have the least amount of adjustment with the rear guards and often it's the twist of the panel that gets you.
When I say this I mean the height of the back of the rear guard relative to the height of the front of the rear guard - that determines the line of the panels to the front of the car. There is little to play with adjustment wise this way with the rear guards - often you get to the rear guards and have to readjust back as they can't be made to line up.
Double tape ALL the edges first. Fit the front bumper and valance and closing panels - with the bolts screwed up but loose if you know what I mean. You need to be able to move this assembly around.
First adjustment is with the panels without glass and all the other stuff - easier to do this way less chance of damage and no change of breaking glass when making adjustments.
You may be moving things a lot to make it all fit so it's better this way - just fit the locks and rubber mounting receivers on the front and rear guards.
Critical things to note.
1. Consistency in the gap between the side sill and door bottom inner side (where the bottom door rubber runs) - fit the bottom door rubber.
2. The vertical height of the doors against the body - for front bonnet alignment
3. The angle of the door against the body - for correct glass pressure against the rubber.
4. The height of the very front mounting point for the front guards - this meets the line down the side of the car dictated from the rear guards.
Leaving the front bumper and valance fully assembled but loose will allow you to push and pull it all.
Good luck with the spot where the bonnet meets the front door top - I've never been able to get that quite right with everything else in adjustment - even with NOS panels.
Once you have it all right without all the glass, trim, lights etc. then fit all that stuff and redo it all again - it will have changed, but the adjustments should be minor.
When fitting the glass use new plastic guides - they are cheap and easy to get.
The critical thing is not to shut the door with the window wound up without checking the alignment in the frame and angle of the window. The pressure of the glass on the rubber can be slightly adjusted by using the bolts each end of the door which allow the angle to be adjusted - more adjustment can be had via the shims on the hinge mounts.
Lastly - don't be afraid to push and pull the metal edges a little to get them to fit if you know what you are doing. Often the doors need a slight twist (eg. door mounted on car, lock end of door - push the top to the left and bottom to the right) to get a decent match.
Give me a call if you want to go through it over the phone.
Cheers,
Mark...
I agree, having now looked at the wiring diagram
It would normally form part of the wing loom connections, but appears to be floating free
Cheers
Chris
Usually, yes. It is possible the harness tape- originally cotton with no adhesive- has finally rotted away. I see that on Ds even when just about everything else is by-the-book perfect.
Yah, I've just sorta learned this stuff by osmosis. On a late D Pallas, there will be 7 connections at the passenger side fender. If you're lucky, the color sleeves haven't all gone to the approximate color of gray mud. Even if, a test light reveals a lot rather quickly.
The color scheme as laid out in Paris:
Green = low beam
Yellow = main high beam
Mauve = auxiliary high beam (the swivelling lamps)
Red = marker or parking lamps
Purple = turn signal
Gray = brake pad warning (in your case, on the passenger side)
Blue = town horn (passenger side only)
White = country horn and trip for air horn if you have it (again, passenger side only)
Look to the owner's manual for what fuses are what at the boxes- the European systems use 4 or 6 fuses, the US cars make do with only 3.
The first five colors repeat for both sides. If you're poking around at the light connections and find a brown sleeve, that's earth. They gang together in the harness, then terminate at a ring terminal immediately to the side of the hood catch at the frame rail on either side. They do go through a 4mm connector just before the ring, make sure that's made or you will wind up with some really strange lighting issues.
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Thanks guys for the electrical advice... Assume for now it has something to do with the headlights on the left hand fender. Once I get to that I will check it out in more detail...
Not much happended this weekend as we went away until Sunday afternoon... However still got a few little things done. Pulled the front seats out, ready to go to the upholsterer and gave the seat adjusted a quick spruce up.
Quick question: is it normal that the adjusters are both on the same side, not mirror reversed? I.e the slider knob is always on the right hand side of the seat, whether driver or passenger... Normal? Or do I have two driver seats?
Anyway, not that it makes much of a difference...
Also got my (hopefully) final parcel from Der Franzose in Germany: The main item being the decor strip set. Interestingly some are pre-bent and don't have any fastener holes or else at all... So will have a think whether double sided tape will be sufficient. after all most modern car trims are all glued on... But I also remeber reading about the forum's thoughts on fasteners at the ends at least - would be nice though to avoid drilling holes into newly painted panels...
The rest of the shipment were internal door handles, mud flaps, bonnet mats, lots of little rubber knobs, stickers and the like... Always nice to get new goodies!
Another question: I remeber the front wheels rubbing on the hydraulic covers... So I want to restrict the steering angle. From the manual it appears easy: just adjust the end caps on the steering rack. But which way? I am assuming the winding the caps in (i.e. Turn them counter clockwise) will limit the angle? And that winding them out would increase the rubbing... Right? How much does one full turn change the angle? A lot? Or is it just trial and error, keep turning them in until the wheel doesn't rub anymore? Guess I have to wind them the same amount each side? Or are the independent of each other?
Until next week... Sven
Not much happended this weekend as we went away until Sunday afternoon... However still got a few little things done. Pulled the front seats out, ready to go to the upholsterer and gave the seat adjusted a quick spruce up.
Quick question: is it normal that the adjusters are both on the same side, not mirror reversed? I.e the slider knob is always on the right hand side of the seat, whether driver or passenger... Normal? Or do I have two driver seats?
Anyway, not that it makes much of a difference...
Also got my (hopefully) final parcel from Der Franzose in Germany: The main item being the decor strip set. Interestingly some are pre-bent and don't have any fastener holes or else at all... So will have a think whether double sided tape will be sufficient. after all most modern car trims are all glued on... But I also remeber reading about the forum's thoughts on fasteners at the ends at least - would be nice though to avoid drilling holes into newly painted panels...
The rest of the shipment were internal door handles, mud flaps, bonnet mats, lots of little rubber knobs, stickers and the like... Always nice to get new goodies!
Another question: I remeber the front wheels rubbing on the hydraulic covers... So I want to restrict the steering angle. From the manual it appears easy: just adjust the end caps on the steering rack. But which way? I am assuming the winding the caps in (i.e. Turn them counter clockwise) will limit the angle? And that winding them out would increase the rubbing... Right? How much does one full turn change the angle? A lot? Or is it just trial and error, keep turning them in until the wheel doesn't rub anymore? Guess I have to wind them the same amount each side? Or are the independent of each other?
Until next week... Sven
I think adjusters are normal Sven. No knowledge on rack but wouldn't you wind them in clockwise to reduce movement?
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You bought stickers hahahaha :roflmao: :roflmao:
:roflmao: :roflmao: :crazy:Cheers
Chris
Ooops.. That's what I meant: turn them "in" ,i.e. Clockwise....
Que?
Yes, stickers.... What am I missing Chris? For airfilter, LHM, oil, etc...
Yes, stickers.... What am I missing Chris? For airfilter, LHM, oil, etc...
Que?
Yes, stickers.... What am I missing Chris? For airfilter, LHM, oil, etc...
Stickers is what I do, now supplying Citroen Classics UK. . . full range for DS/ID/CX and then some.
You could have picked a set or two when you drop by to pick up the steering column spring compressor :wink2:
Cheers
Chris
Attachments
Geeez.... Feeling a bit silly now. Totally forgot that you are the sticker whizz. Well, I don't have all of them....
haha, just pulling your chain. . .
(I don't think I have ued that expression since High School) 
I'd be interested in the quality of the oppositions product if you haven't already fitted them :wink2:
Cheers
Chris
Hey Sven,
This update on the Citrothello site is very timely given your state of play
DS 23 IE BVH PALLAS 1974 RESTAURATION INTÉGRALE 13. | Citrothello
Refitting all panels and components in sequence - as an aside you may see a small glimpse of a radio face provided by a little aussie bleeder
Cheers
Chris
This update on the Citrothello site is very timely given your state of play
DS 23 IE BVH PALLAS 1974 RESTAURATION INTÉGRALE 13. | Citrothello
Refitting all panels and components in sequence - as an aside you may see a small glimpse of a radio face provided by a little aussie bleeder
Cheers
Chris
I want that stamp!!
sob.
erased forever on respray fender...
does anybody know what that tub of grease is M. Citrothello daubs on everything in sight that might corrode? :wink2:
sob.
erased forever on respray fender...
does anybody know what that tub of grease is M. Citrothello daubs on everything in sight that might corrode? :wink2:
Not sure about Othello, but Mark (DS21bvh) has recommended 'Moly Grease' for those areas - he may see this and confirm :wink2:
Cheers
Chris
Still have one that I haven't stuck on... will show you...
Assembly Time! The first coloured panel in on....
Pulling things apart is certainly always easier than trying to remember how things go back together, in what sequence and what nuts and bolts go where.... But half the fun!
spent a few hours rooting around putting the bloody radiator condom back together... It was a pain to pull apart, and even more so to reassemble it! It was my first go at bifurcated rivets - not the easiest suckers to intall, especially in confined spaces like the shroud...
But the result turned out quite well!
The second part (after the pesky rivets) were the staples. They actually went in ok after drilling out the holes in the straps. I was quite happy with the result... And then realised I put the vinyl sleeve onto the outside of the top frame, not from the inside - thought it was a little tight. So I had to pull the whole frame apart again, lucky I glued the felt onto the frame as well..., NOT!
Just in case: here the rivets, from Bunnings...
The Sunday was occupied adding the wheel arch covers, the radiator shroud and the air ducts, as well as the front valance - my first blue metallic panel! Looks fantastic! The blue with the white wall tyres, the black frame and the golden bolts... Very nice, really like the combo!
Beats me... Sorry for the photo being upside down (again).
Needed some fine finger work to get all the screws for the air ducting in place. Normally I guess they are being installed before the shroud and valance panel goes on, but I couldn't remember which bit goes where, so it was a bit tight. anyway, all good now, bolts still left loose, to enable adjustment.
Next will be the front bumper and some more ancillaries like horns, then onto the side panels.
no good news from the upholsterer: he can not find the right fabric...
does anyone know of a supplier of the blue velour fabric in Australia? Might ring around a few more trimmers to see whether they can help... Worst case I might have to get seat and door trim covers from Citro-Toon. But not really what I like to do.
so, any help would be appreciated!
Sven
Pulling things apart is certainly always easier than trying to remember how things go back together, in what sequence and what nuts and bolts go where.... But half the fun!
spent a few hours rooting around putting the bloody radiator condom back together... It was a pain to pull apart, and even more so to reassemble it! It was my first go at bifurcated rivets - not the easiest suckers to intall, especially in confined spaces like the shroud...
But the result turned out quite well!
The second part (after the pesky rivets) were the staples. They actually went in ok after drilling out the holes in the straps. I was quite happy with the result... And then realised I put the vinyl sleeve onto the outside of the top frame, not from the inside - thought it was a little tight. So I had to pull the whole frame apart again, lucky I glued the felt onto the frame as well..., NOT!
Just in case: here the rivets, from Bunnings...
The Sunday was occupied adding the wheel arch covers, the radiator shroud and the air ducts, as well as the front valance - my first blue metallic panel! Looks fantastic! The blue with the white wall tyres, the black frame and the golden bolts... Very nice, really like the combo!
Beats me... Sorry for the photo being upside down (again).
Needed some fine finger work to get all the screws for the air ducting in place. Normally I guess they are being installed before the shroud and valance panel goes on, but I couldn't remember which bit goes where, so it was a bit tight. anyway, all good now, bolts still left loose, to enable adjustment.
Next will be the front bumper and some more ancillaries like horns, then onto the side panels.
no good news from the upholsterer: he can not find the right fabric...
does anyone know of a supplier of the blue velour fabric in Australia? Might ring around a few more trimmers to see whether they can help... Worst case I might have to get seat and door trim covers from Citro-Toon. But not really what I like to do.
so, any help would be appreciated!
Sven
Attachments
Hi Chris, Sven,
I use moly or nickel anti sieze when assembling on the threads...
Cheers,
Mark...
Very impressive you did the staples on radiator air intake Sven! Even Signor Othello uses rivets!
After viewing his latest resto load up!
Effort!
After viewing his latest resto load up!
Effort!
Cheated a little by using "normal" household 12mm staples that one can bend by hand... The original ones were tough as nails, so mine are more for show, but will nonetheless hold the whole thing together - not that there is much force on the shroud...
I considered that Sven but thought they'd rust so settled for Stainless wire - which kinda looks like staples. Just round. and thinner. And not like staples at all really.
"Thats the best show I've ever seen Statler...."
"Thats the best show I've ever seen Statler...."