S16 Rebuild

M

Mingus

Member
Fellow Frogger
Joined
Oct 6, 2011
Messages
262
Location
Sydney/Southern Highlands
Dismantling today...

It was overheating when I bought it but now can't truly figure out why.
Head looks clean. Gasket didn't look busted either and it didn't look compromised. No oil in water and no water in oil. There was a new water pump installed. There thermostat seemed alright (and when placed in boiling water, did open a fraction). Oh well, doesn't matter now. Off to the reconditioners for a quote.

There was about three brief stalling points in the take down. One: I didn't see the sump bolts recessed in the AC compressor mounts and almost banged them out (lucky those two bolts held up for a couple of big whacks). Two: Getting the gearbox to come free (I didn't take out the clutch pin/nylon bush), and Three: sitting the bastard on it's side from the crane.

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Good work. Getting that oil return tube out of the block can be difficult. It will mushroom if you try to bash it out. Use some heat on the block and something soft.
 
Out the top or the bottom preferential? I reckon down is less distance for it to tunnel through. Or maybe I'll give it to the shop for them to take it out...
 
Knock it from the bottom - the pipe has a bulge which interference fits into the hole on the block. It comes loose with a heat gun and a bit of tapping with a hammer.
 
A couple of things I want to consider before I start putting it back together.

Should I baffle the sump? I saw Peter T had a few options. Would the welded plate be good enough for street use without the other options (mine has a windage plate)? In my current S16 those left bends surge oil like crazy and the rattle and hopping that come from it is terrible if I forget to wait for pressure (plus the big bearings must hate me).

Reconditioner said the head is about 3 thou warped, cylinders are in need of hone and new rings (though I'm not sure that's his final diagnosis as I only spoke to him early on).

What are peoples thoughts on silicone hoses and hose clamp style? Worth the $ or a use the originals?

What I've bought so far from memory:
Engine Mounts x 3
Stabiliser Links
Ball Joints, Tie Rods, Sway Bar Bushings, ARB Bushings etc
Peugeot Front Shocks
Rear Shafts/Bearings for Rear Beam rebuild
Brake Repair Kit x 2 (Guide bolts, dust covers, Piston Dust Cover etc)
Timing Belt Kit
Gaskets, Head Bolts etc
Tyres blah blah
 
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Hi Mingus, I just put a set of samco hoses in my S16 last weekend. Note that the kit only covers the top hose, the return hose from the oil cooler and the short hose between the thermostat housing and the metal pipe that goes to the top hose. There are also two heater hoses, but these do not have the bulkhead attachment.

On the overheating my experience has been that it is normally the thermostat. General symptoms are on a coldish day it won't go above about 70deg but on a hot day it will run at 100, and get to 110.

The other issues I've had have been a failed Bitron unit (under the left gaurd), and a failed temp sensor, in both those cases the fans would not come on (except when aircond was on). It would generally overheat whilst idling in traffic.

Air in the system will also cause overheating.

Doesn't your sump already have a baffle in it? Mine did from the factory... though maybe you want something more..

Tony.
 
lion5 Workshop Manuals, Service, Car Repair, Haynes Manuals Online Download - It's essentially peugeot service box but with all the documentation and labour instructions that is chargeable via publicservicebox that's in the procedures section. It 12gb file actually provides all information for all peugeots and must run in Windows XP, but they provide a VMware to run XP virtually on a newer system (I have win7).
 
Wintermute, yeah those figures about your temps run true for me too in my current s16, but I have a feeling the thermostat has been removed. The temps rarely get so cold here that it's necessary for a thermostat. It takes a little longer to warm up and it can run cold coming down bulli pass but to be honest, it's another thing that may go belly up further down the track that requires a bit of effort to get to, so I'm considering leaving it out on the rebuild. I actually find the engine runs a bit better a bit below normal running temp. $250 for 5 hoses...hmmm - Did you buy from the UK? I like the idea that they're less prone to cracking - as I've a leaky hose give me grief before and require a good half day to get to fix by cutting short and getting a plastic extender.

Wait! The sump from my 95 s16 is baffled - just checked. Why is it then that my 94 (first phase s16) has pressure issues. Maybe just not enough oil! Ha. Unless the very first phase s16 doesn't, or maybe someone changed the sump, I'm not sure, I've never had it off to see internally.
 
I got mine from samcosport.com.au but it was $356 not $250 (the hose clamps were an additional $40). Note that you will almost certainly not be able to source a top hose for an S16 from anyone other than samco. I think the original Peugeot ones (just the one hose) were over $400 when they were still available.

The samco hose clips are better quality than any I have seen before. They are very heavy (much thicker than normal) and very smooth. Worth the money I would say. As for the silicon hoses, for me it was basically a case of they were the only hoses I could find! Here are the details of what I got http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/peugeot-forum/115527-s16-radiator-removal.html#post1323310

There are still five other hoses that samco doesn't have for the S16.
The dual Bottom hose (mine only came with one of the two) counting that as two. The small one is a bit of an issue as it is a different size on the block end. I need to investigate what size that end is.
The other hose that runs from the bottom of the radiator to near the thermostat (I replaced mine years ago with some standard heater hose).
a very small hose behind the thermostat (probably only an inch long) which is just a joiner.
a U shaped hose near the bottom of the block close to where the bottom hose connects. Not sure of the size of this one either.

Mine are all original so now 20 years old... I think I need to do something about them at some point!

Note you should never see the temp going above about 95 if everythings is working properly. I wouldn't be so certain that you are running without a thermostat. What I think happens is that the thermostat fails in such a way that it opens early hence not getting up to temp when cold. I drove from Newcastle to Sydney in the winter and it did not go above 70 deg! BUT I believe that when it does get hot, it doesn't open fully, leading to overheating.


Tony.
 
I'll have to have a good read of your radiator removal thread Tony.

Got the 5206 TE pair for $322 - 3-4 week wait though. Also, I managed the samco set for $250 delivered from Sydney. Got lucky there! I'm not sure if I'll pay $40 plus postage ($18!) for the clips or source another brand (most likely a pack) for my other hoses too. I know the samco onces are set for the hose diameter. For my other hoses I'm sure I'll do the same, either use some of my originals from either car or buy some generic hosing.

Wurth looked pretty nice but who knows where to get them. Tridon are pretty standard? Norma? Gates?
Anyone have a good brand or supplier??
 
My new bottom hose is gates. It looks decent enough (but only had the one hose, the 3/8" one was missing). Searches I've done in the past on the original pug part numbers have only turned up the gates bottom hose. I found out about the samcos from fedgrapes :)

Ah I see you meant hose clamps... I got some reasonable ones years ago for my Morris from Robbos spares, but I don't know what brand they were. I figured that there were 11 clamps in total for the samcos which worked out at less than $4 each, and the shipping was free as my order was over $200 in total with the hoses. If I bought clamps at repco or super cheap they would proabably run to at least $3 each anyway. Not sure if anyone sells the samco clamps in Sydney. I'll try and get to the Tyre kicking day next weekend, and I can bring along the heater hoses and clamps if you want to check them out.

Tony.
 
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