EV alternatives

[2353]

A C130 with its high flotation landing gear could easily land at Scone airport. You can barely see where one's been on a grass airstrip let alone a paved one. They need 3000 ft fully loaded, Scone's airstrip is 4606 ft.
There's one major "problem" between the two Dessault Falcons they ended up using and the C130.
Can anyone guess what that is

I'm sorry but I would suggest the RAAF has far greater awareness of the capacity of its planes and the airports they are asked to use than those that were not involved in the decision on what to fly into Scone.

I'm assuming you have a source to demonstrate that the photos above are from the aircraft in use with the RAAF as you are implying?

 

[Greenpeace]

I'm sorry but I would suggest the RAAF has far greater awareness of the capacity of its planes and the airports they are asked to use than those that were not involved in the decision on what to fly into Scone.

I'm assuming you have a source to demonstrate that the photos above are from the aircraft in use with the RAAF as you are implying?

You should really brush up on your research skills.
But anyway I'm here to help until you get the hang of it.
I've included a couple more shots of the Dessault's interior, you can see the four seat dining bay and the polished timber dividers from the previous photo I put up, in the background.
The Hercules have several different seating arrangements depending on the nature of the mission, I've included a couple more layouts for you to look at to help expand your knowledge. You can see some of the red jump seats (that are in use in the firefighters picture) in the first photo I put up, folded against the side of the aircraft when a different seating arrangement is being employed.
The only problem with the C130 is it is not listed on the RAAF's fleet as an "executive jet".
IE, it's good enough for military personnel, evacuees, refugees etc, but beneath the standards of those who have their snouts in the taxpayer's trough.
Heaven forbid there is a natural disaster around Scone way, but rest assured when there is, the Hercules will be more than welcome at Scone airport.

 

[Greenpeace]

Further to the two jet fiasco, a quick Google shows a SAAB 340 turboprop can be readily chartered at short notice. The SAAB has a seating capacity that is greater than the two Dessault Falcons combined. The SAAB consumes fuel at 400 to 450 kgs per hour.
The Dessaults EACH consume fuel at a rate of 1020 kgs per hour.
REX Air and Virgin both have regular flights to Scone utilising the SAAB 340, so no BS excuses about "the plane's too big for the airport".
Of course again, the biggest "problem" with the SAAB is?

 

[David S]

The airport runway wasn't strong enough for one larger plane -> Source.

I hope your posts on how to repair vehicles are better researched.

Yes, all that was known, but I thought even you would see the oddness of flying 1 PM, 2 x federal ministers (Bowen and Husic) and their hangers-on from Canberra to make a media appearance to promote a renewable energy initiative (that I'm sure will be promoted again and again before next September). Then there were all the media types there to cover it who had to get there somehow and I doubt the carpark was full of EVs. I've heard the reasons, but perhaps Bowen might have been better to take an electric car to the nearest train station and eventually catch an electric train back to his destination in Sydney.

In the interests of honesty and transparency, the number of carbon miles and actual emissions expended on this type of promo trip should be captured and reported. Perhaps expressed as the number of equivalent years of driving a typical private car so we know how long some of these people should really be walking instead of being flown by RAAF and driven by Comm cars?

I'm happy to be alerted to any errors I might make, but it is rather desperate of you to try to attack me using something you've not done once in the past year and probably have not done over a very much longer period.

 

[David S]

SAAB 340 is a fine aircraft to fly on. I've been in a few over the years. The seating can be a little tight and they typically do lack a cocktail bar and silver service!

 

[2353]

SAAB 340 is a fine aircraft to fly on. I've been in a few over the years. The seating can be a little tight and they typically do lack a cocktail bar and silver service!

They're a little noisy too - but they have a certain 'olde world' niceness to them, down to the former ashtrays in the armrests.

 

[2353]

I'm happy to be alerted to any errors I might make, but it is rather desperate of you to try to attack me using something you've not done once in the past year and probably have not done over a very much longer period.

Reasonable point - while I have had a Renault *Grand Scenic) and 2 Peugeot 308s in the past, at present I don't own a French car. There has been noting come up uin the respective manufacturer forums that I can knowledgeably comment on for some time. Rather than spread misinformation I would prefer to contribute where I know or can source accurate and factual information.

The e308 or Megane E Tech will be considered next time around.

 

[DoubleChevron]

Reasonable point - while I have had a Renault *Grand Scenic) and 2 Peugeot 308s in the past, at present I don't own a French car. There has been noting come up uin the respective manufacturer forums that I can knowledgeably comment on for some time. Rather than spread misinformation I would prefer to contribute where I know or can source accurate and factual information.

The e308 or Megane E Tech will be considered next time around.

that's interesting, you would consider the electric version of anything with the existing battery technology? Do you only plan to keep it for the length of the lease I'm not attacking you, I'm genuinely interested

 

[2353]

that's interesting, you would consider the electric version of anything with the existing battery technology? Do you only plan to keep it for the length of the lease I'm not attacking you, I'm genuinely interested

Short answer is yes and the EV will be an outright purchase (it won't be an option for me to lease cars in a few years time).

Somewhat longer answer is that I have a 56volt battery mower that is over 10 years old (it was bought at Masters well before Woolies were talking about shutting them down) which is still on the original battery. The mower gets a fair bit of use as I live in South East Qld. There is little if any degradation that I can see - I still usually get the yard mowed on one battery unless the rain stopped me mowing for a couple of weeks - I push on regardless rather than raising the level of the mower which means the mower works hard.

There are quite a number of early model Leafs still getting around and if the battery has been replaced and not economically viable - no one would do it. Some taxi drivers have told me they are getting 600,000km plus on their hybrid batteries without a problem. In my job I travel a bit so have asked taxi drivers in a number of cities how their hybrids are running. I was recently in Sydney and was quite surprised at the number of 'grey import' Toyota hybrid people movers were driving around with taxi plates on them.

I currently drive a plugin Hybrid which is 2 years old and the only problem I have had with the car is remembering how to get the petrol tank open when I need to - most of my driving is well within the 50plus km EV range.

 

[Greenpeace]

Short answer is yes and the EV will be an outright purchase (it won't be an option for me to lease cars in a few years time).

Somewhat longer answer is that I have a 56volt battery mower that is over 10 years old (it was bought at Masters well before Woolies were talking about shutting them down) which is still on the original battery. The mower gets a fair bit of use as I live in South East Qld. There is little if any degradation that I can see - I still usually get the yard mowed on one battery unless the rain stopped me mowing for a couple of weeks - I push on regardless rather than raising the level of the mower which means the mower works hard.

There are quite a number of early model Leafs still getting around and if the battery has been replaced and not economically viable - no one would do it. Some taxi drivers have told me they are getting 600,000km plus on their hybrid batteries without a problem. In my job I travel a bit so have asked taxi drivers in a number of cities how their hybrids are running. I was recently in Sydney and was quite surprised at the number of 'grey import' Toyota hybrid people movers were driving around with taxi plates on them.

I currently drive a plugin Hybrid which is 2 years old and the only problem I have had with the car is remembering how to get the petrol tank open when I need to - most of my driving is well within the 50plus km EV range.

Just offering my experience, not doubting yours.
12 years ago my wife came home from Bunnings with a 4 stroke petrol mower that was on sale for $229 IIRC (can't tell you the brand, it's a f#cking mower, who gives a rats', it's red though ). I was happy with the old 2 stroke one I had (kept the mozzies away), but she likes buying sh#t.
Our yard is a sh#t show, scattered with half chewed tree branches and dog bones from the Mastiffs. I just run over everything. My ex son-in-law offered to mow the lawn once when I was away, and didn't know our water meter was above ground inside the fence, (hidden amongst the weeds), and he mowed that off level with the pipework.
I've never done anything to the mower, no plug, no oil change (and I've never had to top it up), the air filter fell off once when I got too close to the fence, (I have to admit I knocked the dust and grass out of it before I clipped it back on). I ran a grinder over the blades once (after the water meter incident), but that's it. The tank holds 1 litre of petrol, it starts first pull every time, and I get 3 to 4 mows out of a tank (depending on how wild I let the grass and weeds get).

I rarely get in a taxi, but funnily enough the last one I got in was a Toyota Camry hybrid, when I flew to Sydney in 2019 to buy the Berlingo.
I asked the Indian driver what it was like (turned out he actually owned it) and he said "it's 2 years old and the battery is f#cked". Because it was a taxi, the battery wasn't covered by warranty due to the kms travelled, he said a new one (at that time) was $7K and he wasn't going to worry about replacing it.

Going back to when Falcons were the go to for a taxi fleet, 600,000 to 800,000 kms was the norm before selling them off to the public. I had a number of friends that were owner/drivers, and they all ran Falcons. Generally, other than normal servicing, the only mechanical issues they had were rear suspension bushes, (oh and replacing bumpers after the inevitable bingles).
Private Falcon buyers would never get the same kms as a taxi would without having mechanical problems, so a taxi driver's experience with a "new energy" vehicle is not necessarily going to be the same as private individuals' either.

My wife has had a number of new petrol cars, from various manufacturers. She kept them between 4 and 6 years and averaged 20,000 kms a year.
I can say hand on heart, that she had never had to have a repair done on any of them.
She now has a company car, and her employer will not authorise EVs for remote rural use.

Just out of interest, if you virtually never put petrol in your present hybrid how do you stop the fuel that's in it from going off?

 

[2353]

She now has a company car, and her employer will not authorise EVs for remote rural use.

Interesting - my employer has a mandate to have a 100% EV passenger fleet in the next few years. I took one to the South Burnett from Brisbane recently and it cost $15 (and a few cents) to recharge in Kingaroy, so say $31 for the round trip. The Corolla Hybrid I took on a previous trip cost around $50 to fill up after the round trip. You can now get small EVs for the same price as a well speced Corolla Hybrid and the servicing costs can be significantly less.

Just out of interest, if you virtually never put petrol in your present hybrid how do you stop the fuel that's in it from going off?

The petrol tank has a vacuum system. When I do remember where the filler release button is and press it, the vacuum is released for a maximum of 20 minutes. The filler door only opens after the tank is depressurised and the screen in the car tells you to either wait or the tank is open.

By the way, my mower cost significantly more than your $300 (from memory it was about $500), however since purchase it has cost me $30 every few years for a new blade. Naturally I don't mow when its raining so the power to recharge the battery is free from the solar panels (and I have the monitoring on the panels to verify that). A new battery when required is under $400 if I can't find or couldn't be bothered finding someone to repack it when I need to. The only other thing that can go wrong with it is the motor - and it's not unusual to get decades from an electric motor.

 

[DoubleChevron]

Short answer is yes and the EV will be an outright purchase (it won't be an option for me to lease cars in a few years time).

Somewhat longer answer is that I have a 56volt battery mower that is over 10 years old (it was bought at Masters well before Woolies were talking about shutting them down) which is still on the original battery. The mower gets a fair bit of use as I live in South East Qld. There is little if any degradation that I can see - I still usually get the yard mowed on one battery unless the rain stopped me mowing for a couple of weeks - I push on regardless rather than raising the level of the mower which means the mower works hard.

There are quite a number of early model Leafs still getting around and if the battery has been replaced and not economically viable - no one would do it. Some taxi drivers have told me they are getting 600,000km plus on their hybrid batteries without a problem. In my job I travel a bit so have asked taxi drivers in a number of cities how their hybrids are running. I was recently in Sydney and was quite surprised at the number of 'grey import' Toyota hybrid people movers were driving around with taxi plates on them.

I currently drive a plugin Hybrid which is 2 years old and the only problem I have had with the car is remembering how to get the petrol tank open when I need to - most of my driving is well within the 50plus km EV range.

different battery tech ... sound like Nimh. not lithium . How do you phones, Ipads, computers, power tools with lithium batteries last? About 5 -> 8 years right ? At least there battery isn't $20,000+++ to replace

to put this into perspective .... the 407 poogoe my wife drives. it would be heading onto 3rd battery replacement. So rather than faultless reliability over decades, I would have spend many, many, many, many, many, many times the cars value on replacement batteries by now. Probably $40,000+ in the time we have owned it.

I just don't see it. But it sure will be interesting to see if it works out for you

I linked this a few pages back. He was really excited to get this tesla to repower an early GM electric ute.

These batteries are the ones 20years is claimed for. see how nearly every battery pack he lifts out looks to already be leaking quite a bit.

If I end up with an electric car here (which I don't ever see happening), it will not be stored or charged anywhere near the house or shed, it'll probably live over in the back corner of the paddock. that way if it torches off, it hopefully won't hurt anyone

 

[Greenpeace]

Interesting - my employer has a mandate to have a 100% EV passenger fleet in the next few years. I took one to the South Burnett from Brisbane recently and it cost $15 (and a few cents) to recharge in Kingaroy, so say $31 for the round trip.


By the way, my mower cost significantly more than your $300 (from memory it was about $500), however since purchase it has cost me $30 every few years for a new blade. Naturally I don't mow when its raining so the power to recharge the battery is free from the solar panels (and I have the monitoring on the panels to verify that). A new battery when required is under $400 if I can't find or couldn't be bothered finding someone to repack it when I need to. The only other thing that can go wrong with it is the motor - and it's not unusual to get decades from an electric motor.

Yeah, no, she does remote rural, not Kingaroy.
For some reason her employer doesn't want their solo female employees trying to find somewhere to charge an EV (then sit and wait for however long it takes) in towns like Cherbourg, Woorabinda, Cunamulla etc.
I'll leave it up to you to connect the dots.

With your mower's $400ish replacement battery cost, (an EGO mower I presume) you've sort of said why many are reluctant to buy an EV.
If and when my petrol one finally chucks a conrod or something, I can still buy a brand new, complete 4 stroke mower at Bunnings for $249.

 

[David S]

Current Victa picked up from a throwout across the road over a decade ago. Priceless other than a few dollars for a carby o-ring. It doesn't really object to salvaged stale fuel and a few people have given me their cans of fuel after they went electric - doing my bit for recycling and the planet here! Conversely, one neighbour reverted to petrol and all the mowing contractors I've encountered use petrol gear for instant refuelling. It's a case of choosing equipment that best suits the task and pattern of use.

 

[2353]

How do you phones, Ipads, computers, power tools with lithium batteries last? About 5 -> 8 years right ?

That comparison is like comparing a Volvo bus with a Volvo car. They both do the same job - but there are a number of differences in the specifications and duty cycles.

For some reason her employer doesn't want their solo female employees trying to find somewhere to charge an EV (then sit and wait for however long it takes) in towns like Cherbourg, Woorabinda, Cunamulla etc.

So you don't charge the car in those places - you charge in Kingaroy for Cherbourg, Rockhampton/Dingo/Emerald for Woorabinda and while you might have to charge in Cunnamulla, the Qld Govt 'Electric Superhighway' got there some time ago (<- link to Plugshare entry). The car I charged in Kingaroy (a Kona) went from around 30% to 100% in a little over an hour (so you charge while having a meal). And if your good wife works for the Queensland Government, their staff are supposed to stop every two hours for at least 15 minutes, are required to have meal breaks and their fleet managers have an EV mandate so her Department will be getting electric cars sooner rather than later. You can probably guess how I know.

It's a case of choosing equipment that best suits the task and pattern of use.

Correct - while no change is always an option, it frequently isn't the best one.

 

[Greenpeace]

So you don't charge the car in those places - you charge in Kingaroy for Cherbourg, Rockhampton/Dingo/Emerald for Woorabinda and while you might have to charge in Cunnamulla. The car I charged in Kingaroy (a Kona) went from around 30% to 100% in a little over an hour (so you charge while having a meal). And if your good wife works for the Queensland Government, their staff are supposed to stop every two hours for at least 15 minutes, are required to have meal breaks and their fleet managers have an EV mandate so her Department will be getting electric cars sooner rather than later. You can probably guess how I know.

She doesn't work for the QLD Government.
Her driving isn't as simple as nipping out from Kingaroy to Cherbourg and back. She does long remote circuits.
Given she has to be mindful of where and when she fills her ICE car with its 900 km range, I'll stick with her assurances that at this point in time an EV would be as useful to her as a screen door on a submarine.

 

[DoubleChevron]

That comparison is like comparing a Volvo bus with a Volvo car. They both do the same job - but there are a number of differences in the specifications and duty cycles.

\

Not really, it is the same technology. the same chemical soup inside a shell. For example, find a lead acid battery, those things all are similar with lifespan regardless of size.

I'm not trying to talk you out of it. I think if you want an electric car ... Go for it !!! Someone like you would be well aware of any drawback (and positives they have) so i doubt you would have any problems

 

[Bruce H]

I took one to the South Burnett from Brisbane recently and it cost $15 (and a few cents) to recharge in Kingaroy, so say $31 for the round trip. The Corolla Hybrid I took on a previous trip cost around $50 to fill up after the round trip

What do you think of the Kona v’s the Corolla hybrid for that sort of trip? I’ve been watching the Qfleet auctions, wondering whether I should buy one of the many Corolla hybrids they’re selling, but have only seen Kona electrics come up in one auction so far. At the moment they are still selling for more than I want to pay, given that the price of new EV’s are coming down.
The Xantia can easily cost me $100 in petrol for the 600k round trip to Brisbane, where I currently get any repairs done, much more if I can’t find a cheap petrol station.

 

[DoubleChevron]

What do you think of the Kona v’s the Corolla hybrid for that sort of trip? I’ve been watching the Qfleet auctions, wondering whether I should buy one of the many Corolla hybrids they’re selling, but have only seen Kona electrics come up in one auction so far. At the moment they are still selling for more than I want to pay, given that the price of new EV’s are coming down.
The Xantia can easily cost me $100 in petrol for the 600k round trip to Brisbane, where I currently get any repairs done, much more if I can’t find a cheap petrol station.

600km ... so two days while waiting for chargers with an electric car I don't rekcon distances are the forte of electric cars. staying within range of home so it can be recharged each night is the go obviously they can do long distance, but who wants the stress and worry of finding working chargers etc...

 

[lowpugV2]

She does long remote circuits.
Given she has to be mindful of where and when she fills her ICE car with its 900 km range

This is exactly why we need a mixed fleet. I'd say that's more than fair use of an ICE (and probably diesel) where the urban dwellers or people that do very routine longer journeys closer to population centres then EV can work.

The idea that's all EV or nothing doesn't make sense.