Two new racecars in NZ
- Thread starter Frans
- Start date
The way its mounted looks fine, I like the rose joints. Will send a PM with a few thoughts.
Hi All,
Racing again tomorrow at Pukekohe. No tyres in stock so I got an old one from the dump to replace the de-laminated one from Taupo for tomorrow. Not expecting records to tumble during the day. :wink2:
So much has happened in the mean time that I haven't had the time to post. Will see next week.
Frans.
Racing again tomorrow at Pukekohe. No tyres in stock so I got an old one from the dump to replace the de-laminated one from Taupo for tomorrow. Not expecting records to tumble during the day. :wink2:
So much has happened in the mean time that I haven't had the time to post. Will see next week.
Frans.
Good luck Frans. We spent a day there in 1974 watching Jim McKeown's 911 dicing with a Cologne Capri. Great circuit! Still plan to see you in November somehow or other.
Cheers
Cheers
Hi Frans,
How did you go?
Henry
How did you go?
Henry
Hi All,
As mentioned before, a lot has happened. Being a bit philosophical and trying to get to answers for all the questions. I have raced the car now for 9 years. In that 9 years I had relative minor issues. (not like rods through the block etc.) I finished many more races than DNFs. This has taken it's toll on a lot of stuff that normally doesn't get attention like the baffles in the sump and the marathon stint I had at Taupo last month was very demanding. This was the first time out there since the rebuild and comparing my lap times on the transponder history, I have improved the time on the International circuit with 3 seconds. From a 1:59 to a 1:56. Many of you will know how much 3 seconds actually is.
Remember how I complained above the oil pressure drop? I decided to take the sump off and weld a bung in to take a sender unit to see what the oil temp is up to. When I took it off I was greeted with a huge surprise. Part of the baffle of the windage tray has vibrated off and the the crank picked it up. Well, the plate is about the size of my hand and the crank rolled it to the size of a golf ball and in the process separated it into 4 pieces as well. My fancy pistons got hammered from below and the bit of the sleeves that protruded into the crank casing got knocked off as well. This damage happened on no.1 & 2 cylinders and only 2 weeks away from the next race.
I talked to a few people and I got to hear that if a piece of mild steel plate is bent 90 degrees for the mounting tab it WILL brake at the bend. Just a matter of when. It should have radius where it is bent. I then made a new one and changed my mountings so that they are not bent at all. I used a bit of extruded aluminium angle which is a bend in its natural way to mount to the oil pump and then the baffle mounts to the aluminium without a bend at all. Now we will have to see if the aluminium can be up to it.
Worst of all, this issue has still nothing to do with the drop in oil pressure. I have fitted the oil temp gauge now as well.
Regards, Frans.
As mentioned before, a lot has happened. Being a bit philosophical and trying to get to answers for all the questions. I have raced the car now for 9 years. In that 9 years I had relative minor issues. (not like rods through the block etc.) I finished many more races than DNFs. This has taken it's toll on a lot of stuff that normally doesn't get attention like the baffles in the sump and the marathon stint I had at Taupo last month was very demanding. This was the first time out there since the rebuild and comparing my lap times on the transponder history, I have improved the time on the International circuit with 3 seconds. From a 1:59 to a 1:56. Many of you will know how much 3 seconds actually is.
Remember how I complained above the oil pressure drop? I decided to take the sump off and weld a bung in to take a sender unit to see what the oil temp is up to. When I took it off I was greeted with a huge surprise. Part of the baffle of the windage tray has vibrated off and the the crank picked it up. Well, the plate is about the size of my hand and the crank rolled it to the size of a golf ball and in the process separated it into 4 pieces as well. My fancy pistons got hammered from below and the bit of the sleeves that protruded into the crank casing got knocked off as well. This damage happened on no.1 & 2 cylinders and only 2 weeks away from the next race.
I talked to a few people and I got to hear that if a piece of mild steel plate is bent 90 degrees for the mounting tab it WILL brake at the bend. Just a matter of when. It should have radius where it is bent. I then made a new one and changed my mountings so that they are not bent at all. I used a bit of extruded aluminium angle which is a bend in its natural way to mount to the oil pump and then the baffle mounts to the aluminium without a bend at all. Now we will have to see if the aluminium can be up to it.
Worst of all, this issue has still nothing to do with the drop in oil pressure. I have fitted the oil temp gauge now as well.
Regards, Frans.
Then..... I went racing last Saturday. The car was going well until the radiator hose popped off and he overheated a bit. From memory the heater hose popped off previously as well and that happened with a leaking head gasket after a few races. I got back and refitted the hose and refilled the water and it went all well, for a while. Then I heard this terrible noise from behind like extreme detonation and a loss of power. So I pulled off, a DNF, got towed back after the race and waited for the engine to cool off. I withdrew as well not wanting to try again and push my luck.
With a cold engine I refilled the water and started the car. Holy smoke, the water was pumped out underneath the exhaust extractor. A blown head gasket, and did it blow! Looks like I can achieve many things others can't like this one.
How do you like that. Fortunately the sleeves is still beautiful with no score marks or any damage whatsoever.
Regards, Frans.
With a cold engine I refilled the water and started the car. Holy smoke, the water was pumped out underneath the exhaust extractor. A blown head gasket, and did it blow! Looks like I can achieve many things others can't like this one.
How do you like that. Fortunately the sleeves is still beautiful with no score marks or any damage whatsoever.
Regards, Frans.
The oil temp is a problem, I had the opportunity to see that it goes way into the red under normal race conditions and that is creeping up to 150 degrees C.
I will make a plan to mount the oil cooler elsewhere or build a scoop or something like that but it is way too hot.
At the moment I blame the temperature for the oil pressure drop.
Frans.
I will make a plan to mount the oil cooler elsewhere or build a scoop or something like that but it is way too hot.
At the moment I blame the temperature for the oil pressure drop.
Frans.
Wow, that is blown alright!! Out of interest, how far proud of the block face are the sleeves? Always an interesting question, for me at least. Sump debris is fantastic! Bad luck.
I've had two attempts at a heat shield for the alternator on my Citroen CX and both have failed completely due to cracking under vibration and disappeared completely. The mount for my cruise control receiver near the magnet on a driveshaft failed the same way. Tricky and shows I'm a geologist not an engineer!! I'm thinking I should make them lighter not heavier or very much heavier!
Cheers
I've had two attempts at a heat shield for the alternator on my Citroen CX and both have failed completely due to cracking under vibration and disappeared completely. The mount for my cruise control receiver near the magnet on a driveshaft failed the same way. Tricky and shows I'm a geologist not an engineer!! I'm thinking I should make them lighter not heavier or very much heavier!
Cheers
So before all this happened and I was bored stiff I started playing with an oil pump. I came up with a plan to make a high volume pump easily as you should know by now that it is hard for me to buy something that I can make. The dental floss budget you know.
I came up with this prototype. Sacrifice one free wheel gear and cut it in two. I increased the one by 10mm and the other by 12 mm to get an idea. I will use an aluminium spacer plate of 10 mm or 12 mm as you can get that in a standard thickness and then the pickup will bolt onto the bottom. Then a plan will be made to shorten the pickup or I can use a different one because those pickups came in a few lengths as the sump depth varied over the years.
The above photo shows the 10 mm addition which is connected by recessed screws.
The above photo shows the other free wheel gear that will go in back to front so that the connection screws does not actually do a lot but that the gears actually drive themselves.
The above photo shows the protrusion, one of 10 mm and the other of 12 mm and that is where the spacer will be.
The above photo shows the recessed screws holding them intact.
So that was my mouth full of what happened here lately and answering Henry's question of "how did it go?"
Regards, Frans
I came up with this prototype. Sacrifice one free wheel gear and cut it in two. I increased the one by 10mm and the other by 12 mm to get an idea. I will use an aluminium spacer plate of 10 mm or 12 mm as you can get that in a standard thickness and then the pickup will bolt onto the bottom. Then a plan will be made to shorten the pickup or I can use a different one because those pickups came in a few lengths as the sump depth varied over the years.
The above photo shows the 10 mm addition which is connected by recessed screws.
The above photo shows the other free wheel gear that will go in back to front so that the connection screws does not actually do a lot but that the gears actually drive themselves.
The above photo shows the protrusion, one of 10 mm and the other of 12 mm and that is where the spacer will be.
The above photo shows the recessed screws holding them intact.
So that was my mouth full of what happened here lately and answering Henry's question of "how did it go?"
Regards, Frans
I know its not nice to think about but when you had the sump off did you see anything unusual with the bearings? the oil temp still seems high after you fixed the windage tray issues, it could be more than just the cooler location.
JohnW The sleeve protrusion is .004" plus the little ridge that I cut in another .004".
Bustamif.... checked big ends and mains and they where all okay. The cooler location is on top of the gearbox crossmember where I am sure it is useless for getting any airflow. All it does now is increase oil volume. Me and Ross had alook when it was on his hoist and there is a way of fabricating a type of funnel to scoop air and sort off compress it and the feed it to the cooler. One will have to be careful not to make the scoop too low as it might get damaged with an off.
Frans.
Bustamif.... checked big ends and mains and they where all okay. The cooler location is on top of the gearbox crossmember where I am sure it is useless for getting any airflow. All it does now is increase oil volume. Me and Ross had alook when it was on his hoist and there is a way of fabricating a type of funnel to scoop air and sort off compress it and the feed it to the cooler. One will have to be careful not to make the scoop too low as it might get damaged with an off.
Frans.
Thanks Frans. Interesting. I've just bolted a Dauphine Gordini head down (annealed copper base rings of course) and had them all 6-8 thou before tightening. I reckon that will leave 2-4 thou protrusion after the copper rings squeeze the 4 thou I've measured. Geckoeng reckons 8 thou, which is therefore, after squish, the same as your 4 thou. Am I paranoid about this? Probably! 
That's quite a head gasket of yours....
That's quite a head gasket of yours....
Some useless info for those interested.
I made a list of mods or specs that I have done on the race car. Started in the front and worked the way to the back from what I can remember but the list will be about 99% complete.
Frans.
I made a list of mods or specs that I have done on the race car. Started in the front and worked the way to the back from what I can remember but the list will be about 99% complete.
Frans.
Hi Frans,
Quite a list!
That'd be HDPE tube not PVC I think. "Black poly" is it not? PVC has a low softening temperature.
Cheers
Quite a list!
That'd be HDPE tube not PVC I think. "Black poly" is it not? PVC has a low softening temperature.
Cheers
Frans,
You left out that super effective exhaust system. Are the suspension coils not shortened?
What front anti roll bar are you using?
I know your list is just the obvious basics, because I know there are many more detailed mods involved, some are: window glass-to- perspex lightening
plus other body lightening, negative camber inducing off-centre bushes, shorter rear axle limit straps(chains), etc, etc. I think it will take a long time to recall / record all the not so obvious mods, some of which have taken considerable thought and effort to apply. And I think it's great!
Henry
You left out that super effective exhaust system. Are the suspension coils not shortened?
What front anti roll bar are you using?
I know your list is just the obvious basics, because I know there are many more detailed mods involved, some are: window glass-to- perspex lightening
plus other body lightening, negative camber inducing off-centre bushes, shorter rear axle limit straps(chains), etc, etc. I think it will take a long time to recall / record all the not so obvious mods, some of which have taken considerable thought and effort to apply. And I think it's great!
Henry
Frans,
Have you considered using the later type oil pumps fitted to R5s? Jeff Bee used one in his big-bore R1135 motor to good effect.
Is your current oil pump a Gordini pump which has the longer gear set over a standard R8?
If not, these 2 off the shelf items may help you, and be whole lot less work than what you are considering. (I know, you like doing it yourself at the lowest possible cost)
Have you considered using the later type oil pumps fitted to R5s? Jeff Bee used one in his big-bore R1135 motor to good effect.
Is your current oil pump a Gordini pump which has the longer gear set over a standard R8?
If not, these 2 off the shelf items may help you, and be whole lot less work than what you are considering. (I know, you like doing it yourself at the lowest possible cost)