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Original profile tyres for 504? Availability?
- Thread starter BarryC
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O ok. So I guess it's better to stick with a tire that's close to 185/80 R14 in diameter such as 195/75 R14, 205/70 R14, etc.
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I suggest that you get your goals clearer. You told us that your wanted tyres of greater diameter for more ground clearance. Fine. The main issue would be making sure that you don't foul on bits of the 504 under heavy load or bumps or under cornering. This is an issue of width as well as diameter. Try measuring vehicle clearance gaps to get an understanding of what's feasible.
Then go to:
Tire Size Comparison
Tire size comparison the easy way. Use our tire size comparison calculator to compare diameter, width, sidewall, circumference and revolutions per mile.
Compare 185/80 with some alternatives of greater diameter & width to see how much vehicle clearance you'd need compared to the gaps you've identified.. 195/75 is identical in diameter & 205/70 is slightly smaller. Thus neither satisfies your stated goal.
Once you work out a size or two that look plausible, check out what tyres are available & do a bit of tyre review research to see if they suit the performance priorities which you have. If you drive mostly on unsealed roads then what's a suitable tyre will be different to what would be so for cold wet bitumen.
If your demand for more ground clearance means that such roads have been the vehicle's usual use, then I suggest that the problem might be sagged springs. If so, then apart from new springs, solutions might be: getting the existing ones retempered by a spring works or getting some circular disk spacers fitted under or over the springs to jack the car up a bit (A common practice in the sixties & seventies for dirt road rally vehicles.)
Cheers! Peter
Thanks for your reply! Yes the goal is to have more ground clearance but from what I have read on the internet, increasing the tire's diameter will affect the car's performance negatively. I have heard that even if you increase the diameter, it is advisable to do no more than 3% of the stock tire size. So, let's say that i want to increase the diameter by 30mm and it doesn't touch the fenders and by doing so i would get about 15mm ground clearance even though it's not that much and it is not that visible difference in height. So, if I want to have more ground clearance, the easiest way to do so is to put coil spring spacers( I can get about 30-90 mm). From what I have read it's not advisable to choose a tire size outside of the manufacturer's recommended sizes meaning I can't choose a random size such as 205/80 R14 which I would love to by the way. So, as you have suggested using coil spring spacers might be the easiest option even though it might damage the coil springs in the long run. Buying taller coil springs might be the best option of all.I suggest that you get your goals clearer. You told us that your wanted tyres of greater diameter for more ground clearance. Fine. The main issue would be making sure that you don't foul on bits of the 504 under heavy load or bumps or under cornering. This is an issue of width as well as diameter. Try measuring vehicle clearance gaps to get an understanding of what's feasible.
Then go to:
Tire Size Comparison
Tire size comparison the easy way. Use our tire size comparison calculator to compare diameter, width, sidewall, circumference and revolutions per mile.tiresize.com
Compare 185/80 with some alternatives of greater diameter & width to see how much vehicle clearance you'd need compared to the gaps you've identified.. 195/75 is identical in diameter & 205/70 is slightly smaller. Thus neither satisfies your stated goal.
Once you work out a size or two that look plausible, check out what tyres are available & do a bit of tyre review research to see if they suit the performance priorities which you have. If you drive mostly on unsealed roads then what's a suitable tyre will be different to what would be so for cold wet bitumen.
If your demand for more ground clearance means that such roads have been the vehicle's usual use, then I suggest that the problem might be sagged springs. If so, then apart from new springs, solutions might be: getting the existing ones retempered by a spring works or getting some circular disk spacers fitted under or over the springs to jack the car up a bit (A common practice in the sixties & seventies for dirt road rally vehicles.)
Cheers! Peter
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I had 205s on my 504 and they made the steering very heavy, plus I had to put washers between wheels and hubs to prevent the tyres rubbing on the body...they didn't quite make it.
Because my 504 had a saggy bum like so many others (1975 was a bad year for this), I bought a new pair of King Springs, but regretted it as they were quite stiff. This may not worry you as you are going offroad, but you may like to be aware of it.
If you were staying on the road but were sick and tired of the saggy rear end so many 504s get, my own recommendation would be to simply buy a pair of secondhand 505 rear springs. They don't sag, (as far as I know), and it's a cheap option too.
Graham Wallis is very knowledgeable and experienced so what he says can be counted on.
So is there any consensus here ? Taller springs, or spacers ?
Because my 504 had a saggy bum like so many others (1975 was a bad year for this), I bought a new pair of King Springs, but regretted it as they were quite stiff. This may not worry you as you are going offroad, but you may like to be aware of it.
If you were staying on the road but were sick and tired of the saggy rear end so many 504s get, my own recommendation would be to simply buy a pair of secondhand 505 rear springs. They don't sag, (as far as I know), and it's a cheap option too.
Graham Wallis is very knowledgeable and experienced so what he says can be counted on.
So is there any consensus here ? Taller springs, or spacers ?
Oh ok. Thanks for getting back to me. How about these type of coil spring spacers? I ordered them a few weeks ago from ebay. I think they might damage the coil springs on the long run? What do you think?
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So, I guess the widest tire i can get is 195 without changing rims/wheels. That answers 1 of my questions which was how wide can I go. And the other question i have is, my current tire is 185/80 R14 with an Outside Diameter(OD) of around 652 mm, how much taller can I go without hitting the fenders and other components of the car. If I choose to get 195/80 R14, would be that cause other problems besides taller gearing, is it recommended to do so? Or is it better to stick with 185/80 R14 (or 195/75 R14 something closer in diameter) and use coil spring spacers instead? I will also look for 505 coil springs as you have suggested. I appreciate your response.
If the lack of ground clearance is caused by sagging springs, then fix the root cause - don't muck around changing other components in the hope that it might help.
Trying to mask symptoms by changing something else is like putting Bars Leaks in the radiator, or sawdust in the gearbox - a temporary fix that will likely lead to further problems down the track.
As for your coil spring "spacers" - these appear to be coil spring compressors - used in dismantling the Macpherson strut suspension. A coil spring spacer looks like what you would logically expect - a big fat washer!
Trying to mask symptoms by changing something else is like putting Bars Leaks in the radiator, or sawdust in the gearbox - a temporary fix that will likely lead to further problems down the track.
As for your coil spring "spacers" - these appear to be coil spring compressors - used in dismantling the Macpherson strut suspension. A coil spring spacer looks like what you would logically expect - a big fat washer!
That looks like a good coil spacer compared what i ordered online. But it doesn't mention the diameter. Actually the car has good ground clearance, I just wanted to have it lifted a little more.
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Correct. I had wider rims made specially so I could fit 205s.
Perhaps you should visit a tyre place and ask ? Can't hurt. I seem to remember that the answer I got was counterintuitive....something like 185/80 R14 being a higher tyre than a 195/75 R14.
The thing to do would be to stand them both on the ground together and compare heights.
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Would have been touching the STRUT body?
Good to know that I cannot go any wider than 195. Yes 185/80 is a little bit taller (about 5mm) than 195/75 R14 but the difference is not that significant. But is it ok if I put 185/80 R14 on the front and 195/75 (or 80) R14 in the back? I will go to the tyre shop and ask them but in the meantime let me know. Thanks!
Ok that makes sense or coilovers which are the safest but too expensive.
[QUOTE="dty, post: 1830246, member: 29Oh ok. Thanks for getting back to me. How about these type of coil spring spacers? I ordered them a few weeks ago from ebay. I think they might damage the coil springs on the long run? What do you think?
[/QUOTE]
I think given the nature of a coil spring being a downward spiral, and this product being metal on metal, I would be more concerned whether these style of spacers would remain in place?
I came across these spacers, they certainly seem to have more merit than the metal ones. You have to measure your coil spacing at full suspension drop to get the right size but I note at the bottom of the page it states the car will be 1/2" to 1 1/2" (13 to 38mm) higher after installation.
Your proposed 30mm taller tyres are only going to lift the car 15mm anyway, and have a negative effect on acceleration and hill climbing ability.
I presume your location in your details is correct? If you are venturing out of town regularly, hill climbing ability might be an important consideration?
[/QUOTE]
I think given the nature of a coil spring being a downward spiral, and this product being metal on metal, I would be more concerned whether these style of spacers would remain in place?
I came across these spacers, they certainly seem to have more merit than the metal ones. You have to measure your coil spacing at full suspension drop to get the right size but I note at the bottom of the page it states the car will be 1/2" to 1 1/2" (13 to 38mm) higher after installation.
Your proposed 30mm taller tyres are only going to lift the car 15mm anyway, and have a negative effect on acceleration and hill climbing ability.
I presume your location in your details is correct? If you are venturing out of town regularly, hill climbing ability might be an important consideration?
Front shock tower spring base will limit tyre height. I run 195R14 on 505 series 1 alloy wheels and there is only a 10mm gap here. In the rear, be careful with taller springs. The driveshaft boots do not like being stretched and tear easily when drive shaft angle is changed much passed what is standard.
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Yes, I bought an ex bash 504 parts car with every boot torn.
When I was running taller rear springs, on full droop the drive shaft would hit the trailing arm. Some slight manicuring with the angle grinder helped, but in the end replacing drive shaft boots with my eyes closed was not a talent I really needed. Back to standard height, but stiffer spring. Maybe I should put my tool box on a diet.
Ah ...yes. That's right. It was only 28 years ago...how could I have forgotten ? (Suddenly I feel so old)
