Newbie DS23 Pallas EFI(ish)

Guido

New member
Bon jour all. I‘ve always wanted a DS and following the best advice, after a long period of extensive research, looking at many cars and thorough inspection by a DS expert, I have thoughtfully purchased one, one that is in the peak of condition which someone else has spent many hours and $ restoring to excellent condition.

Well actually that’s not quite true, in reality I was farting around online with no intention of buying anything, saw a scruffy (but hopefully somewhat sound) 1975 model auto DS23 in another state and had a quick chat to the very helpful seller and bought it. Currently arranging for it to be transported from Vic to Qld - if anyone here can recommend interstate transporter that wd be appreciated.

While I wait for it to arrive I have been reading up and it appears to me this forum looks like a good community, so hoping to pick a few brains if that’s ok. The DS will be car 5 for me so no pressure or hurry to make it work properly.

I’m planning to do most things myself (famous last words!?) so was hoping I cd be pointed in the first instance to the “go to” resources for DIY DSers. I will have to see what the reality is, but from chatting to seller it starts and drives and has minimal rust ;) The EFI has been replaced with an (SU?) carb, I’ll have to wait to see how much of the EFI gear remains (from pics retains EFI inlet manifold).

But it has no muffler/s at all, so Question 1 is: where is the best place to buy stuff like mufflers and other bits like that in Australia, or do people generally import them? I plan to only buy the front muffler and run pipes out rear (ie doing away with second Pallas muffler based on things I read online about it being prone to rust and being ripped off, and to save me a few $$$s).

Merci beaucoup in advance for any assistance.
 

tsharkey

New member
I saw that car and was very tempted - The EFI didn't worry me so much but the oil leak from the auto trans. When you bring back to life the EFI, watch for leaks, the D-Jet Bosch can be a fire hazard if not kept in check. Will enjoy watching you bring it back to life.
 

Guido

New member
Thanks. Depending on whats left of original EFI might make leap to 21st century EFI…so many options…yes have read up on the DS23 BW35 and encountered numerous “war stories”…caveat emptor!
 

faulksy

Member
Given how butchered the EFI system is, I wouldn't bother trying to recommission the D-jet system. The manifold is only part of the story, you need to check if the throttle body is still in place or if it was removed for the carby conversion. Parts for D-jet are expensive and at this age generally not worth the asking prices. There's a few companies in the Netherlands that have produced kits to convert the original setup to something far more modern and programmable. Also have a read around the megasquirt forum about converting D-jet cars. Most conversions have been done on Mercedes and Volvos but a few D series have been done.

Arm yourself with all the workshop manuals which can be downloaded from here https://www.dropbox.com/sh/tv0b25gpmd5ux8e/AAAhvSwJoeCeptJM3g7TENBQa
 

Guido

New member
Given how butchered the EFI system is, I wouldn't bother trying to recommission the D-jet system. The manifold is only part of the story, you need to check if the throttle body is still in place or if it was removed for the carby conversion. Parts for D-jet are expensive and at this age generally not worth the asking prices. There's a few companies in the Netherlands that have produced kits to convert the original setup to something far more modern and programmable. Also have a read around the megasquirt forum about converting D-jet cars. Most conversions have been done on Mercedes and Volvos but a few D series have been done.

Arm yourself with all the workshop manuals which can be downloaded from here https://www.dropbox.com/sh/tv0b25gpmd5ux8e/AAAhvSwJoeCeptJM3g7TENBQa
Agree, and great link! Unless it’s in a box in the boot the throttle body is history…
 

Buttercup

Member
For the more frequently needed parts you should ask Ian Steele, trading as Just Cits, at Maleny Qld. He knows everything that can be known about DS.
 

Dave

1000+ Posts
I know a Gent of the same (screen) name and location on another forum with a nice Fiat 124.

Lets see some pics of the DS! :)
 

Guido

New member
Only have pics from ad and too big to post so will have to work that out first. Working to transport Melb to Noosa if anyone has recommendations…
 

tsharkey

New member
Thanks. Depending on whats left of original EFI might make leap to 21st century EFI…so many options…yes have read up on the DS23 BW35 and encountered numerous “war stories”…caveat emptor!

Agree 10000% re BW35 ..... If it was manual, I would have bought it
 

IDear

New member
I'd suggest that the owner attaches a card to the dash explaining that the engine must be started to activate the braking system and to raise the height so it won't do damage underneath. Also explain how to open the bonnet so they don't use a crowbar.
The Citroen that Ron Purvis had transported from the outback made it back to Brisbane OK. Sitting up high on the ramp, the bloke got in and decided to let it roll back .............. no need to start the engine. All went well as it was moving down the truck ramps, then put his foot on the brake button .............. no response. It sped across the yard and smashed into a FWD damaging both vehicles.
Enjoy the '23
Michael
 

Guido

New member
I'd suggest that the owner attaches a card to the dash explaining that the engine must be started to activate the braking system and to raise the height so it won't do damage underneath. Also explain how to open the bonnet so they don't use a crowbar.
The Citroen that Ron Purvis had transported from the outback made it back to Brisbane OK. Sitting up high on the ramp, the bloke got in and decided to let it roll back .............. no need to start the engine. All went well as it was moving down the truck ramps, then put his foot on the brake button .............. no response. It sped across the yard and smashed into a FWD damaging both vehicles.
Enjoy the '23
Michael
Yes I believe that’s why it is now “nil exhaust”…
 

Armidillo

1000+ Posts
I don't know if this guy (or his friends) have any experience with transporting Citroens, but he (and his associate Lou) move caravans etc. around on single-deck semis/B-doubles - they delivered our van safely from the Sunshine Coast to Armidale. Being a small operation, you can talk directly to the driver to provide advice/offer suggestions/get updates.

Steve Watts Transport
0418 329 017
cheekysteve@bigpond.com

Downside is that presumably costs are higher than would be the case for a double-deck car transporter driven by an uncaring gorilla.
 

harrisson_citroen

Thank God for my Hydroen
Hi Guido,
I have the same model as you. Until last year I lived in Coolum Beach, not far from Noosa, but found the lifestyle of the rich and famous all too boring for my liking, so came back to Brisbane for that little je ne sais quoi of Gritty Qld lifestyle.
Anyway, the bw35 23ie is a great car, don't worry about the old blokes who've been ranting about them for the last 50 years! They're still cross they had to pay 3 times the price of a Holden Belmont when new and found out it had the same autobox, that it was hot in summer (sic) and it all went downhill from there. 50 years later, FIFTY YEARS, there are two things that really reliable in my DS23: the electronic injection and the bw35!
 
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Guido

New member
Hi Guido,
I have the same model as you. Until last year I lived in Coolum Beach, not far from Noosa, but found the lifestyle of the rich and famous all too boring for my liking, so came back to Brisbane for that little je ne sais quoi of Gritty Qld lifestyle.
Anyway, the bw35 23ie is a great car, don't worry about the old blokes who've been ranting about them for the last 50 years! They're still cross they had to pay 3 times the price of a Holden Belmont when new and found out it had the same autobox, that it was hot in summer (sic) and it all went downhill from there. 50 years later, FIFTY YEARS, there are two things that really reliable in my DS23: the electronic injection and the bw35!
Bon jour. Happy to learn from others varied experiences :)
 
Hi Guido,
I have the same model as you. Until last year I lived in Coolum Beach, not far from Noosa, but found the lifestyle of the rich and famous all too boring for my liking, so came back to Brisbane for that little je ne sais quoi of Gritty Qld lifestyle.
Anyway, the bw35 23ie is a great car, don't worry about the old blokes who've been ranting about them for the last 50 years! They're still cross they had to pay 3 times the price of a Holden Belmont when new and found out it had the same autobox, that it was hot in summer (sic) and it all went downhill from there. 50 years later, FIFTY YEARS, there are two things that really reliable in my DS23: the electronic injection and the bw35!
Only because the original or near new owners paid for the abysmal build quality to be rectified. These things did not get the reputations they have for no reason. They were deeply flawed in both build quality and the extreme evolution of a design that placed more heat and mechanical stresses onto components that were not designed for the loadings. As an old bloke, I KNOW my rantings are valid.
We are standing on the shoulders of our grandparents. Current owners are living with the hard work, frustrations and expenditure that those "old blokes" invested all those years ago. Doubtless a survivor should be treasured, but not without recognition of the blood, sweat, tears, invention, upgrades, modifications and disappointment ( and dollars ) that allow a survivor to now BE a survivor. It has NOTHING to do with your childish statements about Holden Belmonts. It has to do with a design icon that was degraded by added on or bought in componentry. These automatic things failed IN PERIOD, some not even making it through the then 12 month warranty period. Have you not heard of porous castings and mixing transmission and final drive fluids ? shattered camshaft pulleys and cooked engine mounts ? fractured and brittle insulation on wiring harnesses, battery cases with insufficient wiring on the relays to allow easy removal/replacement of a simple battery, cracking subframes on front suspension mounting points ...
If we are becoming pedantic, the B/W automatic was NOT French in origin, and the Bosch Jetronic fuel injection is German sourced.
DSs were NOT all created equal.
 
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