EP80 transaxle oil

Sunroof said:
No Redline never gave syncro problems that I have yet to discover, but neither does VMX 80 and why pay such a high price for oil when the much cheaper Castrol does the same job? The diff whine is there regardless of the oil used. So I will pull out the gear box, change all the oil seals, that are leaking expensive Redline everywhere, and adjust the diff to hopefully get rid of the whine. The only problem with Redline for every day use is the cost for what I see as no gain. Perhaps the expensive is justified for competition use as Alan has explained.
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Re synchros, that's what I thought too. Fair enough re the cost! I'm leak free and change every 6 years or so (maybe 30,000 km, most these years seeming to be cross-Australia trips!!) so the cost per km is small. You've reminded me of the pain of changing that selector rod seal with the gearbox in place and no hoist...… :) Thanks for the reply.
 
Hi All,
I don't have a recommendation but I was interested in what redline recommend re 1970 renault 10 transaxle.
reply came back....
[FONT=&quot]Rob,[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Thank you for contacting Red Line Oil, in your Renault transaxle where an EP gear oil is called for the 75W90NS would be recommended. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Our EP/GL-5 gear oils contain a copper deactivator so are safe with any brass, bronze or copper components. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]This appears to be available at super cheap for $142 per 4 and a half litres.
Cheers
rob
[/FONT]
 
Sunroof said:
No Redline never gave syncro problems that I have yet to discover, but neither does VMX 80 and why pay such a high price for oil when the much cheaper Castrol does the same job? The diff whine is there regardless of the oil used. So I will pull out the gear box, change all the oil seals, that are leaking expensive Redline everywhere, and adjust the diff to hopefully get rid of the whine. The only problem with Redline for every day use is the cost for what I see as no gain. Perhaps the expensive is justified for competition use as Alan has explained.
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Does the same job?

Um, in both my 330 R10 transaxle & in my Renault Estafette based Djet transaxle, my situation went from no problems to mechanical abrasion & steel dust in the oil within a short time. VMX 80 caused a problem in each case. Redline might not fix it but it might plausibly stabilise the situation (although Castrol Classic EP 80W has noticeably cured audible symptoms in the 330 box).

I'd stop using VMX 80 unless you want the problem to get worse.
 
Hmmmm. Food for thought. Or should that be "oil for thought".
 
Speaking of food.

Appears no one has tried the EP 80 Banana Skins yet?

:banana:

I just wanted use the banana emoji :banana:
 
4cvg said:
Does the same job?

Um, in both my 330 R10 transaxle & in my Renault Estafette based Djet transaxle, my situation went from no problems to mechanical abrasion & steel dust in the oil within a short time. VMX 80 caused a problem in each case. Redline might not fix it but it might plausibly stabilise the situation (although Castrol Classic EP 80W has noticeably cured audible symptoms in the 330 box).

I'd stop using VMX 80 unless you want the problem to get worse.
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Hi Peter

Just out of interest what oil was you using in your transaxles before you use VMX80?
 
I have been using the Redline Lightweight Shockproof in various gearboxes and diffs. Generally Redline recommend this oil for dog type gearboxes and moderately loaded diffs. After speaking to some drivers maybe 15 years ago ( I was a Scrutineer for many years) using their cars on the track, many being dedicated race cars that had normal type synchro boxes, and a couple of dog boxes, I found many were using the Lightweight Shockproof.

None were sponsored by Redline, but they continued to use the oil even given the expense, and I expect if there were failures because of the oil the word would have gotten around. Certainly Redline are not recommending or dismissing its use synchro boxes, but would recommend one of their MTL series oils for our use in transaxles.

Given I have been using this oil for about 15 years in various 318, 330 and UN1 gearboxes seemingly with no problems, I think it works well, although second gear synchro in the 4CV is a bit slow, but it was slow from the beginning on the VMX80 as it was built from the best of second hand parts.

I have not seen any great amount of metal particles after draining, but admit given the colouration of the oil the particles would be hard to pick. The oil really clings to the gears. I had a gear failure in a 1970 Triumph Bonneville (dog type) box that I had rebuilt. The gear had been the only new one I had fitted to the box and had been over hardened and so the teeth were brittle. I had drained the box and found the broken gear, leaving it all assembled. I was sour about the gear failure, and left the bike for three years for it to consider what it had done. Three years later the "Smurf Blood" was still clinging to and protecting the gears. It doesn't wash out easily.

I will continue to use the oil as I have no reason to change, but please don't take this as an endorsement, given its use in our transaxles is not generally supported by Redline.
 
15 years eh? It's been an interesting thread Alan!!

Have you ever broken an energiser spring in a synchro hub, out of interest?

Cheers
 
COL said:
Hi Peter

Just out of interest what oil was you using in your transaxles before you use VMX80?
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Penrite multigrade GL4 (or GL4'+?) something or other (no longer available - the one that promised no brass attack)
 
alan moore said:
I have been using the Redline Lightweight Shockproof in various gearboxes and diffs. Generally Redline recommend this oil for dog type gearboxes and moderately loaded diffs. After speaking to some drivers maybe 15 years ago ( I was a Scrutineer for many years) using their cars on the track, many being dedicated race cars that had normal type synchro boxes, and a couple of dog boxes, I found many were using the Lightweight Shockproof.

None were sponsored by Redline, but they continued to use the oil even given the expense, and I expect if there were failures because of the oil the word would have gotten around. Certainly Redline are not recommending or dismissing its use synchro boxes, but would recommend one of their MTL series oils for our use in transaxles.

Given I have been using this oil for about 15 years in various 318, 330 and UN1 gearboxes seemingly with no problems, I think it works well, although second gear synchro in the 4CV is a bit slow, but it was slow from the beginning on the VMX80 as it was built from the best of second hand parts.

I have not seen any great amount of metal particles after draining, but admit given the colouration of the oil the particles would be hard to pick. The oil really clings to the gears. I had a gear failure in a 1970 Triumph Bonneville (dog type) box that I had rebuilt. The gear had been the only new one I had fitted to the box and had been over hardened and so the teeth were brittle. I had drained the box and found the broken gear, leaving it all assembled. I was sour about the gear failure, and left the bike for three years for it to consider what it had done. Three years later the "Smurf Blood" was still clinging to and protecting the gears. It doesn't wash out easily.

I will continue to use the oil as I have no reason to change, but please don't take this as an endorsement, given its use in our transaxles is not generally supported by Redline.
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thanks Alan. My current plan is to try it in the Djet.
 
JohnW said:
15 years eh? It's been an interesting thread Alan!!

Have you ever broken an energiser spring in a synchro hub, out of interest?

Cheers
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No have never seen a broken one, but have seen them worn down to maybe 2/3rds of the original thickness. They do get soft sometimes.
 
Thanks Alan. That's encouraging given the amount of serious use yours have had... I know they do break sometimes and shatter gearbox casings if they fall out and lodge between teeth. Apologies for short thread hijack.
 
JohnW said:
Thanks Alan. That's encouraging given the amount of serious use yours have had... I know they do break sometimes and shatter gearbox casings if they fall out and lodge between teeth. Apologies for short thread hijack.
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As I have remarked before, threads are like conversations & should go where participants wish to send them.

Is there a source of 330 energiser springs? I had thought not but plausibly the R8/A110 market would warrant remanufacture.
 
JohnW said:
Thanks Alan. That's encouraging given the amount of serious use yours have had... I know they do break sometimes and shatter gearbox casings if they fall out and lodge between teeth. Apologies for short thread hijack.
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As I have remarked before, threads are like conversations & should go where participants wish to send them.

Is there a source of 330 energiser springs? I had thought not but plausibly the R8/A110 market would warrant remanufacture.
 
4cvg said:
As I have remarked before, threads are like conversations & should go where participants wish to send them.
Is there a source of 330 energiser springs? I had thought not but plausibly the R8/A110 market would warrant remanufacture. /QUOTE]

Thanks Peter. Fair comment re threads.

I have chased the 330 energiser springs at length (a few years ago) and found just one new genuine Renault set (which are in my spare gearbox now). I bought another set from Jacques, but they turned out to be second-hand but quite good condition. My French friends don't know of any source of new ones. They'd be easy to make commercially but would need to be precisely the correct steel and dimensions. I'd agree that there ought to be a market for hundreds of them although I'm not sure most owners realise the possible outcomes of breakage. They are the same for literally millions of gearboxes.
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After all this talk about Castrol VMX80 oil and its suitability for Renault transaxles.

Well today I decided to take a sample from my transaxle in my !976 Renault R12.

The oil has been in the transaxle for nearly 2 years and travelled 3600 Km.

I do motorkhanas in this car so it does not get an easy life.

There is some discolouration in the oil as can be seen on the attached pic but can't see any real evidence of any metal particles

The pic shows a sample from my transaxle and also a sample from the container that I filled the transaxle from.
 

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