Pottsy, Amid a grey near cyclone induced weather lockdown, as well as community recommendations to stay home, it was refreshing to read of your adventures. Thanks for your stylish writings.
Good to read this Pottsy. Best wishes.Well as the original poster I feel I should make comment here. Moby has had two occasions when he's got hot under the collar since all of the earlier discussions.
The first was on a gentle re-enactment of the 1968 London to Sydney marathon. It was hot, dusty and we went up the back side of Mt Buffalo with the temperature gauge looking to return to zero the hard way. Nothing I could do seemed to alleviate the situation other than stopping a while,. having a relaxing chat and cuppa then continuing. The situation was relatively unresolved all the way back home to Melbourne from Nowra. Problem was solved when I started investigating and found the thermostat had done some gymnastics and turned sideways in the hose. See, that extra clamp IS needed!
Second time was on the first day of the 50th Anniversary Southern Cross Rally. After a couple of autocrosses and a spirited drive up the Whitfield road, once again the temperature was "of concern". Just after starting out from Melbourne I'd picked up my Navigator and we'd noticed some coolant weeping from the driver's side of he engine. In went a container of Leak Stopper, I forget the brand, working on the premise that it should at least slow down any egress of coolant for the duration of the event. At Mansfield after that first day of overheating I drained the coolant intending to check the thermostat. It was then I found the inline filter I'd installed way back when, and cleaned before this event, was clogged! The leak stopper stuff had faithfully stopped the coolant from going through all the holes in the filter! Left the filter element out, replaced the coolant and Moby performed flawlessly from then on.
I've since re-instated the filter and check it regularly. At this date the old bugger is still soldiering on doing the odd drive in the dirty stuff and being immensely enjoyed.
I reckon there must be other threads revived after longer periods, but happy to take the record if not! Curious how it popped up though!
Cheers for now, Pottsy.
Welcome Gaz - from the UKHi this is my first input to a thread though I have been following Aussiefrogs for a few years. I have a 1974 D Special which I am close to getting back on the road after a 20 year rest and home to rats etc. I am only the second owner of the car having purchased it in Bellingen in 1985. The original owner bought it new in Adelaide ( Chateau Moteur??) and interestingly it was supplied new with BMW 2002 bonnet vents fitted in the bottom of the front wings and with the the sealing rubber below the windscreen removed! He was an industrial design engineer for Planet Lamps and commuted between Bellingen and Adelaide in the car for at least a couple of years without any issues, and I never had any overheating issues with it, mostly country running.
It is still basically original, although I have replaced water pump, radiator, thermo, hoses,belts,heater radiator, tyres etc as part of refurbishment. Hope to have it on the road and reregistered fir Cowra Citin.
I also have a 95 Xantia 2,0I registered, two good Xantia 16V series 2, 2 hail damaged Xantia S2, and a 2004 C5 HDI wagon.
Over the years other Citroens have been a 1973 GS 1070 wagon, a 1954 Big 15, and Renaults have included 16TS(2),R10,R8(2),R4(4).Dauphine, and a 750. and also a Simca 1000.
I am based at Gunning in NSW.
Cheers,
Gaz
Welcome to the froggie pond Gaz-good luck getting the Special on the roadHi this is my first input to a thread though I have been following Aussiefrogs for a few years. I have a 1974 D Special which I am close to getting back on the road after a 20 year rest and home to rats etc. I am only the second owner of the car having purchased it in Bellingen in 1985. The original owner bought it new in Adelaide ( Chateau Moteur??) and interestingly it was supplied new with BMW 2002 bonnet vents fitted in the bottom of the front wings and with the the sealing rubber below the windscreen removed! He was an industrial design engineer for Planet Lamps and commuted between Bellingen and Adelaide in the car for at least a couple of years without any issues, and I never had any overheating issues with it, mostly country running.
It is still basically original, although I have replaced water pump, radiator, thermo, hoses,belts,heater radiator, tyres etc as part of refurbishment. Hope to have it on the road and reregistered fir Cowra Citin.
I also have a 95 Xantia 2,0I registered, two good Xantia 16V series 2, 2 hail damaged Xantia S2, and a 2004 C5 HDI wagon.
Over the years other Citroens have been a 1973 GS 1070 wagon, a 1954 Big 15, and Renaults have included 16TS(2),R10,R8(2),R4(4).Dauphine, and a 750. and also a Simca 1000.
I am based at Gunning in NSW.
Cheers,
Gaz
Check these simple things out, and also....make sure you are not running those incredibly HOT sparkplugs. Those short reach types make everything run too hot. Check which kind should be used...and try a cooler plug.
Hi. I know that this is an old thread that has been resurected, and it was a good read.overheating....
Hi potts...
I had a similar problem with my first car. The spark plugs were too hot in the heat range department. I'd make sure that the plugs you are using are actually the correct heat range, as the difference that makes is a major player. ( Or was in my case).
Hi John W,Fascinating thread this! From what I understand, the size of openings to admit air isn't very important, rather it is the size of the space into which the air is moving and also the pressure differential that allows ready outflow of air.
Consider some of the aerodynamic vents that Costin put on streamlined body shells in the 50s-60s.
All of the rear engined Renaults (of which I've had a few over the last 35 years) cool well but only if the shrouding around the engine is fully in place. If, for example, the undertray is removed, hot weather causes trouble, but if they are in place the air all moves through the radiator and out the back of the car in a low pressure area.
I suspect that the issue is exactly what some of these latter posts say, that is a need to let more air out from the area behind the radiator, so that the air pressure in that area is lower. Some elegantly styled grills in the right place might be the go, or some experimenting with the length of that undertray, or both.
Assuming the water pump is at the hot end, the sensor should be about right (the Renault 16TS has the best I can think of, bolted to the head by the exhaust manifold, so measuring cylinder head temperature).
I'm no DS expert, but it does sound as if the original fan was OK! By contrast, with much care about airflow, the Renault 16 fan rarely comes on except when stationery.
I like the idea of discretely enlarging the slot behind the bonnet.
Best of luck (oh, and I can't make Philip Island this year but 2007 is pencilled in)
Cheers
I'll be happy to take the manuals off your hands and find suitable custodians!Hi John W,
Noticing your role as R 750 Coordinator I still have a fairly pristine copy of Scientific Magazines Service Manual for Renault 750-760 1948-1953 Revised and reprinted May 1962 by The K G Murray Publishing Co Sydney if you or anyone is interested in it.I also have an Intereurope Workshop Manual 141 for Renault 16-16TS-16TA in perfect condition. By the way I had my D Special in Perth from 1997 to 2001 but never had it registered. I was in the Citroen Car Club and Lorenz Borg did quite a bit of work tidying it up and putting it back together for me before it was shipped back East. Letr me know if you would like these manuals.
Gaz
PottsyThe radiator is a three row unit (I just went and looked)
I'm going to run it tomorrow with the electric fan built into the shroud, and the ducting installed as well. I strongly suspect that the thermostat was already dodgy and was pushed over the edge when I installed the electric fan. (It allowed things to get hotter before cutting in so may have caused the problem)
Anyway, I'll come back with more data once I've tried it out.
Thanks for all your input so far chaps. This is what such a forum is all about.
As far as running without the thermostat. I anticipated it would have arrived by now. I planned on running through a couple of warmup cool down cycles with no thermo just to help flush the system through.
Assuming the new part arrives tomorrow (and it had better!) the whale will have all new coolant to go with the new bottom & heater hoses, the new cap, the new overflow catch bottle, the cleaned radiator and the new thermostat.
If it still overheats I'll begin to believe the theory about the Cessna propeller being needed to suck the air up rather than the air being forced through it. If that's the case it'll be back to the mechanical fan and shroud and a few swear words from me every time I can't hear the music over the noise at cruising speed!
Either that or the two 9 inch fan option, but that may have to await funding.
Cheers, Pottsy.
And yes John, Long Live the White Wonders! (Mine should have the sign writing for the Peugeot Re-Run happening in the next couple of weeks. Can't wait to see the looks on the Lemmings in their more recent whitegoods as I cruise past in a replica rally car from the past!)
Hmmm. I must pay more attention to history. That being said there is a lot to be learned from getting the original components working as intendedWow. It's amazing when an aged thread gets revived, derailed and augmented all in the space of a week or so.
Can I point out that my original discussions, attempts at solution and conclusions were all taking place in 2006!
Since the latest issue, detailed in post 60, the Great White Whale has behaved with a total lack of peccability. Several jaunts in rally guise have shown he can still keep his cool quite well.
At the risk on inflaming passions best left relocated to another thread, I suggest that the forced air flow at highway speeds is nowhere near that we would normally expect. Whatever the reason, the DC3 propeller does its thing effectively and well, and, realistically, no-one is going to notice a change in performance of a few hp in such a leisurely velocipede anyway.
The electric fan was consigned to a shelf in 2006, and the water pump was also replaced that year and as explained in previous posts, I have an inline filter, sort of an expensive and prettier version of the inserted stocking, which has only clogged the once.
So thanks for all the support and ideas, even if they're mostly about 15 years overdue!
Cheers, Pottsy
It has been mentioned before but what I do - - learnt from guru Lance from DS Motors is use a stocking about 6 inces long on the top hose. The stocking is drawn into the radiator and will not clog. In my early days and probably because I was driving D Models that had had many issues I would end up with a bit less than a golf ball size of granules every time I had a look.Well as the original poster I feel I should make comment here. Moby has had two occasions when he's got hot under the collar since all of the earlier discussions.
The first was on a gentle re-enactment of the 1968 London to Sydney marathon. It was hot, dusty and we went up the back side of Mt Buffalo with the temperature gauge looking to return to zero the hard way. Nothing I could do seemed to alleviate the situation other than stopping a while,. having a relaxing chat and cuppa then continuing. The situation was relatively unresolved all the way back home to Melbourne from Nowra. Problem was solved when I started investigating and found the thermostat had done some gymnastics and turned sideways in the hose. See, that extra clamp IS needed!
Second time was on the first day of the 50th Anniversary Southern Cross Rally. After a couple of autocrosses and a spirited drive up the Whitfield road, once again the temperature was "of concern". Just after starting out from Melbourne I'd picked up my Navigator and we'd noticed some coolant weeping from the driver's side of he engine. In went a container of Leak Stopper, I forget the brand, working on the premise that it should at least slow down any egress of coolant for the duration of the event. At Mansfield after that first day of overheating I drained the coolant intending to check the thermostat. It was then I found the inline filter I'd installed way back when, and cleaned before this event, was clogged! The leak stopper stuff had faithfully stopped the coolant from going through all the holes in the filter! Left the filter element out, replaced the coolant and Moby performed flawlessly from then on.
I've since re-instated the filter and check it regularly. At this date the old bugger is still soldiering on doing the odd drive in the dirty stuff and being immensely enjoyed.
I reckon there must be other threads revived after longer periods, but happy to take the record if not! Curious how it popped up though!
Cheers for now, Pottsy.
I have the original shroud in placeThis is an old thread & haven't read more than page 1.
1. Leave all shrouds in place.
2. The thermostat is fine, leave it alone.
3. If the engine is NOT BOILING & losing coolant it is NOT overheating.
4. The temps talked of on this car are fine but we don't use *F any more.
5. Boiling point in that system is 212*F but with a 7# cap is raised to about 233*F.
6. Buy a good high CFM 16" fan from Davies Craig not cheap stuff off ePay.
7. When the engine is hot just squeeze the radiator hose & it feels solid & hard to squeeze it means the coolant system is under pressure, as it should be.
8. Squishy means the pressure cap is not working.
9. That raises the boiling point.
10. Never remove a radiator cap if pressure is present as you are likely to get severe burns from superheated steam.
11. Use a fan switch set @ about 90*C to turn fan on.
Too much worry about nothing abnormal.