more power

D

daniel the r12 nut

Member
Fellow Frogger
Joined
Jul 19, 2001
Messages
170
Location
melb vic australia
i need more power need suggestions or some info . i have suspension an exhaust sorted . the motor is a 1.4 motor fully rebuilt 2 yrs ago .
now i need more power cannot have sidedraft weber insurance not allowed but extractos also look very messy or ones i saw did .
so if anyone has cam specs or anything that can help me please .
 
You need to track down a R18/Fuego Turbo engine.

That'll make things fun.

Or just stick a worked 16TS lump in it.
 
Reno17:
You need to track down a R18/Fuego Turbo engine.

That'll make things fun.

Or just stick a worked 16TS lump in it.
Click to expand...
A R5 turbo engine would probably be a better fit (same block design) and there are plenty of power-ups for these in the UK. R12 + 200 hp = .....nevermind
 
Motor Improvements in Brighton Road can grind your R12 cam to several different grinds depending on the performance you may want. You may have to modify the valve guides to allow for the increased lift. The head responds well to a good port and chamber modification. A pity you can't run a DCOE! Oh well, the cam and a worked head will make it fun to drive.

Go for it!
 
if you are going to be running a mild cam with standard carb you will find an improvement in fuel economy as well as a by product
not up on the the engine you are using but if it has a secondary throat on the carb it may be an idea to run slightly larger jets in that side
especially if you are going to clean up the head a bit
 
this is alll good now i need to no something else the difference form, a 1289c motor which has weber32 dir carbie but i don t now differences in the jet sizes because the 1.4 motor which i have has similar carbie but the basics of the carbie are the same but a few suttle differences but in manuel which is a factory book said there are differnent jets. however i cannot see the model spec in the book for the 1.4 carbie . why i nned to this is because my carbie is a 1289 cc but my motor is 1.4 motor any help be good
 
JY Dog:
Motor Improvements in Brighton Road can grind your R12 cam to several different grinds depending on the performance you may want. You may have to modify the valve guides to allow for the increased lift. The head responds well to a good port and chamber modification. A pity you can't run a DCOE! Oh well, the cam and a worked head will make it fun to drive.

Go for it!
Click to expand...
Hey Junk Yard! Do you know of any specific mods to the ports/chambers that work? I know a bit about heads, and have modded a few. I assume that the inlet valve is too shrouded by the chamber wall, but wasn't sure how much can come off the deck to recover the CR. Any hints? What about the narrow exhaust ports? Are these worth opening out, and is there enough meat to do so? Any info. appreciated !!!

Stuey
 
hey daniel
we at autoparis have built up hot 1.4's our latest one we bulit was for a openwheeler...
this had a cam, head work, balanced, twin dcoe's and extractors on it, thats what you need!!!!!!
there is only so much you can make a little weber do!!!!! :)
i think you need to go to another insurance company as well :)
regards paul.
 
depeche mode:
hey daniel
we at autoparis have built up hot 1.4's our latest one we bulit was for a openwheeler...
this had a cam, head work, balanced, twin dcoe's and extractors on it, thats what you need!!!!!!
there is only so much you can make a little weber do!!!!! :)
Click to expand...
You've just described generally the standard accepted route to extra power on just about any non-injection 4 cylinder since the 50's. Could we have some specifics about head work and cam grinds please?

Stuey

<small>[ 18 September 2003, 11:30 PM: Message edited by: Stuey ]</small>
 
depeche mode:

there is only so much you can make a little weber do!!!!!
Click to expand...
If you want to retain the stock manifold to keep it "looking" legal, you can fit the following bigger carbies on the R12 manifold (although you may need to do a little bit of filing to clear the throttle butterfies):

-Weber 32/36 DGV or DGAV or DGEV. These are a progressive carb and have a 26mm venturi in the first throat and a 27 in the second. You can have the second throat venturi bored to 31mm to get a nice combination of power and economy. The DGAV has a conventional auto choke, while the DGES has a simpler electric auto choke. I think these carbies are about $450 new or $60 second hand if you get a DGAV from a 2 litre Cortina or Escort. There is also a similar carb called the 32/36DFV and a Holley copy of it, usually refered to as the Holley 180. The great thing about the DFV and the Holley 180 is that they will match up to the stock R12 air filter without much work, whereas the DGV/DGAV needs a different aircleaner.

-Weber 38DGAS. These have both 38mm throats opening at once. they have 27mm venturis, so the economy isn't two bad. I think you can also get a DGES version with an electric auto choke. I think they're about $600 new.

-Holley 350 (need an adaptor plate). Alot of people think these are too big, but they only have 38.1mm throats with 30.2mm venturis. The key to tuning them properly for a small engine is to fit a restrictor jet kit to the power valve circuit. If you don't, the stock power valve system will still be giving enough fuel for a 3-4litre engine. I think you can get these holleys for about $150 rebuilt second hand.

-Weber 34ADM from an XE/XF Falcon. These are a progessive carb with two 34mm throats with a 27mm primary venturi and a 29mm secondary venturi. Again you have to change the power valve jet or they will use too much fuel, because the standard power valve jet is for a 4.1 litre engine. The XF carb is supposed to be more reliable than the XE version (which has a funny variable idle jet on the first throat). They both have some funny anti-pollution attachments, but they do have a nice electric auto choke. Agin these are abotu $60 from wreckers.

Dave

<small>[ 19 September 2003, 08:16 AM: Message edited by: davemcbean ]</small>
 
ok cool thanks paul i wil come see you soon however my insurance is just fine as i do not think many companies would have agreed value of 4000 dollars on a 12 . howver the cam an headwork thing has me interested . the extractor thing not so interested as ones i ve scene you have to cut into the body if yours are beter im interested thanks .
 
Thought of an EFI system? While I love the twin DCOE Webers on my 1.4 in my R10, there might be a chance for an EFI system. Not sure of bonnet clearance though. I know Colliers use a Camira based EFI manifold on their 16TS powered NSW motorkhana winning car.. goes like hell. I suspect though that it might be too tall to fit under the R12 bonnet.

As for extractors, given the heat coming off them I was advised to use the standard R12 exhaust manifold in my 10 as they are fairly thick (or at least much thicker than the set of extractors I had on my 10S engine) and hence reduce the heat transfer and they do actually flow quite well if matched properly to the exhaust ports.

If you want the jet sizes for various R12 carburettors I think I have them here somewhere.
 
Graig that would be great the carbie sizes and also i need to know about the r8/10 taillights u have as i havesomeone i no who is hooting up a 10 so if u can email me the deatils of carbeies etc forward to danielther12racer@hotmail.com thanks
 
Carby info..
you say Weber 32 DIR, from what car.. ie what 32DIR?

From what I can see, in France the 1289 based cars had Solex or zenith carbies, except R1177 and R1337. For those two carsm there was a 32DIR21, 32DIR21T, 32DIR39, 32DIR39T, and 2302-2306. the DIR 39s were in auto cars.

The 12 with the 1397 were the R1179, R1338 and R1261.

The manual 1179s and 1338s used the 32DIR65, the 1261 and 1338 (yes, 1338 repeated) used a 32DIR40T.

For the 32DIR65 you have as follows:
Choke tube: 23
1st barrel idling:
Main: 127
Idling: 55
Air compensating: 170
Emulsifier: F57

For 2nd barrel:
Main: 120
Idle: 60
Air compensating: 110
I think the emulsifier is then F6.. all the rest is the same as set as below:
Mixture Centraliser: 3.5
Accelerator pump: 50
Needle valve: 1.75
Level: 7
Travel: 8
Initialie throttle opening butterfly angle. 1.15
Throttle opening defuming valve closed: n/a
Mech. part-open setting: 5
Pneu. part-open setting:6

for the 32DIR 40T:
barrel 1:
130, 55, 170
barrel 2:
140,60,170
Accelerator pump 55
Initiale opening butterfly angle 1.0
Throttle opening defuming valve closed: 0.45
Mech. part-open setting: 4.5
Pneu. part-open setting: 7

Have emailed the guy about availability of the rear lights to make sure they have amber indicators as there is the possiblity of them having red indicators from the time when they had the yellow front lights. Will reply on that when I know.
 
Seems ok to me. Its a Magnetti Marelli Monopoint system feeding a C3G engine (847 style) of 1239cc, 5 bearing (C), parallel valves with injection (3), G(1201-1275cc). I'm sure with a Twingo manual and some French lessons you could sort it out. I have the Haynes Twingo manual (we have a 1996 Twingo Benetton), its not printed in English.
 
ok my car was a 1289 cc engine then i changed to 1397 from a virage but kept the same carbie from the 1289 on it . now a have a 1397 cc carbie i wanna put on it however it has extra vacumn pipes on it . Can u just swap the jets from one carbie to other without much hassle a i have overhauled very few carbies ever being a injected car wolrd now
 
I've just been running an express with an engine from a r11 tse (C2J 1.4) with a weber twin downdraught carb which with no other mods gave me 72bhp and torque like a diesel.the car's is now just for parts so if the jets are of any use let me know.....
Weber 32DRT
primary venturi 23
secondary 24
Main primary jet 107
Main secondary jet 105
primary idle 47
secondary idle 70
This engine is great fun,specially in an old van with a JB3 5 speed box.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top