Top hits #3: Citroen's Goddess

Uga Boga said:
They may spend the most on R&D, doesn't mean they have the MOST innovative R&D team.

Citroen has probably been the most innovative out of all marques, well known to take the plunge/risk with new ideas etc.. :citplak: :citplak: :citplak:

Remember who brought you fuel injection (first car to use it was the DS?), FWD - Traction Avant (;)), hydropneumatic suspension, power steering, high pressure braking, disc brakes, semi automatic gearbox etc... :D

Shane, help me get out of this one!!
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The DS was the first mass-produced French car to have EFI. Don't some 404's have EFI too? Hmm... I'm sure there'd be a pre '69 car with EFI, there'd have to be.... it's a Bosch system after all, so I'm thinking maybe something German? :wink2:
 
Yep you're right!

The DS and ID powerplants evolved throughout its 20 year production life. The initial 1911 cc three main bearing motor (carried forward from the Traction Avant) of the DS19 was replaced in 1965 with the 1985 cc five bearing motor of the DS19a and called DS20 from Sept 1969. The DS21 was also introduced for model year 1965. This was a 2175 cc, five main bearing engine. This engine received a substantial increase in power with the introduction of Bosch electronic fuel injection for model year 1970 making the DS one of the first mass-market cars to use electronic fuel injection.

http://www.citroen.com.au/cms/default.asp?action=article&ID=20463
 
donat said:
The DS was the first mass-produced French car to have EFI. Don't some 404's have EFI too? Hmm... I'm sure there'd be a pre '69 car with EFI, there'd have to be.... it's a Bosch system after all, so I'm thinking maybe something German? :wink2:
Click to expand...

The 404 had a Kugelfisher fuel injection option - a mechanical system not EFI, as far as I remember.

One of the first cars with petrol injection (leaving diesel engines aside) was the Mercedes Benz 300 SLR in about 1954, as had their GP cars then - mechanical of course. As for EFI I'm not sure but Benz/VW were pretty early in there. Remember the Type 3 VW 1500 for example?

No doubt someone will be definitive shortly!

Cheers

John
 
As much as I admire what Citroen did, they didn't actually INVENT any of these ideas (except possible the Diravi steering?).

The front-wheel-drive and unitary-construction Traction was based on American design, the Cord. In fact Citroen paid for the rights to the manufacturing technique. High-pressure hydraulics were lifted straight out of aircraft technology. I think disk brakes may have been too, and first used by Jaguar on a racing car.

Citroen had the guts to bring these things to a mainstream car and sort out mass production techniques. At the time they thought the DS might be 5-10 years ahead of the game! What happened.... :cry:

Chris
 
Anyone know when the Yanks put injection into the Corvette? that may be mechanical but I know they had it early. :confused:

Matt
 
mattg: 1957 - I suppose for the '58 "model year" 283in³ capacity, mech injection. Many were back-engineered as it wasn't a perfect system. A DS Safari is a nicer car...
 
Uga Boga said:
Shane, help me get out of this one!!
Click to expand...

Here's a few points to get your teeth into:

--plastic usage (ie: roof, cooling fan, dash)
--center point steering
--a strong central 'hull' which on which the body panels are only a decoration
--front track wider than the rear (aid high speed stability)
--worlds first truly clutch free manual
--massive inboard disk brakes
--braking distribution to rear dependant on weight
--hydralic suspension
--fully powered steering (as opposed to Power Assisted Steering PAS)
--usage of lightweight aluminium panels (bootlid, roof, bonnet)
--usage of lightweight plastic panels (roof, rear window etc...).
--They also had built:
---DS's with zero body roll
---DS's that leant into corners like motorbike
---DS's that followed the road without driver input

Come on, this is a tiny simple list off the top of my head. There is literally hundreds of unique points about the DS.

seeya,
Shane L.
 
chris said:
As much as I admire what Citroen did, they didn't actually INVENT any of these ideas (except possible the Diravi steering?).

The front-wheel-drive and unitary-construction Traction was based on American design, the Cord. In fact Citroen paid for the rights to the manufacturing technique. High-pressure hydraulics were lifted straight out of aircraft technology. I think disk brakes may have been too, and first used by Jaguar on a racing car.

Citroen had the guts to bring these things to a mainstream car and sort out mass production techniques. At the time they thought the DS might be 5-10 years ahead of the game! What happened.... :cry:

Chris
Click to expand...

http://paulmages.ifrance.com/

This website (if you can read French) is an interesting way to find out the history of Citroen's hydropneumatic suspension and might change your opinions on whether or not Citroen's Bureau d'Etudes invented anything. :crazy:
 
Sergetov said:
... only Mercedes would then have airbags, ABS brakes etc etc.
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Just curious. When did MB first use ABS? Jensen had them in 1967 on the full-time 4wd FF.
 
DS Video

I looked at the DS video provided at the beginning of this thread and it really makes you appreciate how much courage Citroen had at that time to bring a car like this to market. Whether they originated the various features or not I think everybody would admire their bold decisiveness.

Carl
 
turning headlights, the Tatra T-87 supposedly had a central turning headlamp in the thirties..
tatra2a.jpg
 
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