Stalls at low revs

nJm:
My 505 is the same. It has to be tuned up every 5000kms, otherwise it runs quite rough and you definately notice a drop in performance.

The mechanic I use says they are just like that - very sensitive engines that go out of wack easily. :
Click to expand...
This goes totally against my experience with the pushrod Pug engines. Maybe it's symptomatic of those fitted with anti-pollution equipment, the solex TMIMA carby and the later types of Ducellier distributors.

The earlier engines with a manual choke, Ducellier M48 distributor, no anti-pollution equipment, and no cold air pipe, seem to go just as great when out of tune as when in tune. the only difference being is that when out of tune they are hard to start on a cold morning, whereas when in tune they fire instantly (after pumping the accelerator 2 times).

My suggestions are:
-do a hose audit
-ditch the Solex TMIMA for either an early Solex SEIEA (if you can find one without too much wear in the butterfly shafts), or a Weber
-fit a brand new M48 dissy
-use NGK or Bosch spark plugs
-fit good quality spark leads (or copper cored ones, if you don't have a radio)

In my experience your engine should then run great, with economy in the 9.5-11 litre per 100km range on the highway, and 11-13 in the city, while being capable of pulling atleast 6500rpm without protest.

They got this basic engine design right in the late model 404, and any of the extras they added to the exterior of the motor on later models just detracted from its excellent reliability.
They always seem to go best when returned to a simple spec. I just got my simplified 505 running the other day, and it looks like a 404 under the bonnet and runs sweet as.

Dave

<small>[ 31 August 2002, 09:43 PM: Message edited by: fiveohs ]</small>
 
Alan,

Interesting to read what you said - it was the previous owner of P504 Services in Sydney who said not to worry about fixing the warm air intake.

The economy of the 504 is reasonable... about 9L/100km on the highway with 5 of us in it and luggage, and about 12-13 in the city. It is an auto though.

It improved remarkably when we reconditioned the carby. It's had a Webber of some sort since we bought it, that P504 put on it because apparently it's much easier to tune.

I don't know that much about our 504 though - unfortunately it just sits in the carport most of its life now :( I do know it always starts first go, even on dead cold winter mornings and as long as you use the choke it drives perfectly, even from cold.

Derek
 
Hi Dave,

I'm not actually sure which hoses I can get rid of, is there anything in the Haynes manual? The TMIMA carb has to stay for now, I don't have any free time or spare cash. What would be a better choice though, Weber or Solex SEIEA?

How much would a new M48 dissy cost? Also, where do you recommend I buy new spark leads? Regan's said they can get a box set for my car, so it would be whatever Peugeot specify I'd imagine?

thanks,
Nick
 
M48 Distibutors are $150 at European Auto Imports, Box Hill.
I fully agree with Dave's advice.
My carby 2.2 STI is running better since I changed the cam belt and fitted a Solex SEIEA. It is extremely tractable and will pull up hills at 1800 rpm in 5th with a full load.
Second barrel operation is not right, however,I must get an exhaust gas analyser and see what it is doing.

Graham Wallis
Regards Graham Wallis
 
That sounds very impressive! Mine tends to stuggle below 2400rpm on hills.

Where whould I find an SEIEA carb? Would I need to get one off a recked pug, or could I just go to a parts shop and ask for one? If I need to get one off a car, which model/year of pug were they fitted to?

thanks in advance!

Nick :)
 
nJm:
That sounds very impressive! Mine tends to stuggle below 2400rpm on hills.

Where whould I find an SEIEA carb? Would I need to get one off a recked pug, or could I just go to a parts shop and ask for one? If I need to get one off a car, which model/year of pug were they fitted to?

thanks in advance!

Nick :)
Click to expand...
The Solex SEIEA was the carb fitted to 2 litre 504s up until June 1976. If you go to a Pug Wrecker who happens to have lots of them, then you should be able to find atleast one low mileage one without too much wear.

The advantages of the Solex SEIEA over a Weber are:
-can be put straight on the 505 inlet manifold without having to file it out at all
-fits up to the 505 aircleaner
-already jetted to suit a standard Pug 2 litre (although putting a richer jet in the second throat wouldn't hurt, and may help prevent any possible pinging, you can get a 160 jet (1.6mm)from the second throat of a 1980 model 505 TMIMA, or you can drill it out with a 1/16" drill bit (1.59mm)), you can put the second jet from your TMIMA in it, if the drilled out jet turns out to use too much fuel.

Any good quality 8mm spark leads should be OK (most local parts stores will have some of various lengths).

As far as hoses go this is all you need (everything else can go):

-the hoses going to the fuel pump and carby (of course)

-Vacuum hoses:
-hose from brake booster to inlet manifold
-small hose straight from dissy to carby
-hose from carbon canister (charcoal filter) to inlet manifold (or carby)
-hose from heater controls vacuum reservoir black round thing near air con pipes behing battery on frame rail) to inlet manifold. Most of the T pieces can be eliminated, when you've got just these 4 hoses.

-Water hoses:
-radiator hoses (of course)
-heater hoses (big ones that go into fire wall behind back of head and join the water pump and the side of the head)
-manifold heating hose from end of inlet manifold to T-piece in heater hose, or to extra connection on water pump (if it has one). You don't really need the other water hoses going to that plate thing under the carby, although you might want to leave them, just so it looks all connected (if you keep them, then replace them with new ones, because they are probably the original ones, -same goes for all other water hoses).

-Breather hoses:
-hoses from oil filler cap to inlet manifold and air filter (although I've found that it works OK just with the one to the air filter)

The little plastic valve thingy that sticks out of the end of the inlet manifold with three vacuum lines going to it can be replaced with a plug, or you can cut the plastic off it, fill it with putty, stick a spade terminal in it, and run a wire from it into the firewall, so it looks like it's doing something important(i.e. it doesn't look like you've disconnected something). If that thingy controls the exhaust gas recirculation, and you want to keep it, you may need to leave it (I can't remember, I'll have to check).

It's often a good idea to leave the exhaust gas recirculation (EGR), because that's one of the things that the EPA looks for if they inspect your car. The same might apply for the pulse air valves between the head and exhaust manifold, although I have a feeling that not all cars in 1982 had them, so you might be able to ditch them too (check before removing them).

My 505 doesn't have the EGR or pulse air valves at the moment, but I might have to fit them (atleast the EGR probably) before having the car inspected to change the engine number.

I'll be in the Melbourne area in early october, so we can probably meet up and I can show you my engine, and you can have a drive of it to see how it goes.

Dave

<small>[ 01 September 2002, 09:23 PM: Message edited by: fiveohs ]</small>
 
Not really sure why the brother in laws 505 is running so quickly out of tune. He doesn't know as he gets it tuned by a mechanic. Thanks for the advice that has been posted, I will pass it on.

Craig a_drink
 
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