Reconditioned engine commissioning after sitting

A

andrewj

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Fellow Frogger
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Hi Everyone,

The engine is not french, but all going to plan, the vehicle in question will see service towing around many french cars!

I've purchased an ex-army Isuzu reconditioned engine to go in a landrover perentie.
It has presumably been sitting for many years, so I am wondering, do I simply fill it with oil and turn it over a few times by hand? Or are there other precautions I should take incase the bearing have dried out?

Cheers,
Andrew
 
That is pretty much what I would do. Maybe give it a few turns by hand to prime the oil galleries and potentially use a run-in oil (if any info/signs suggest that is not run in). Before all that, I would also liberally squirt some WD40 down the cylinders, you know for startup.
 
Yes sounds OK. Although I might skip the WD40 and just spray some thin oil instead. The WD might remove any oil that was put on there for storage. I like the hand turning but you will need to ease it over compression (hopefuly ?) for each cylinder. Careful do not get too much oil into the inlet/ combustion chambers or it might hydraulic it.
The engine should have been sealed up for storage after it was recoed.
WD40 is not an aid for starting either as it is hard to burn. Just prime the fuel pump and injectors fully and it should go without any :cool: thing extra if you can feel the compression is good.
Jaahn
 
Take it from someone who has tried. You cannot hand turn that engine without relieving the compression.
 
jaahn said:
Yes sounds OK. Although I might skip the WD40 and just spray some thin oil instead. The WD might remove any oil that was put on there for storage. I like the hand turning but you will need to ease it over compression (hopefuly ?) for each cylinder. Careful do not get too much oil into the inlet/ combustion chambers or it might hydraulic it.
The engine should have been sealed up for storage after it was recoed.
WD40 is not an aid for starting either as it is hard to burn. Just prime the fuel pump and injectors fully and it should go without any :cool: thing extra if you can feel the compression is good.
Jaahn
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I have recommended WD40 because I use it. Not as a starting aid, but because new rings need to bed in. If there is any oil in there, you've blown it. They'll float, polish up and you lose compression. I have a friend who is building and racing his own top fuel dragsters and that is what he does on each engine rebuild. You don't let it sit, you just squirt it in when you're ready and go for the key. It will burn up very well whilst providing a minimal amount of lubrication just as the pistons start to move. The oil pump should take over then. I have always done that on my engines and so far so good.

Oh, and if the engine has been rebuilt and the cam has not been run in, you need to do that as well. Have a look around for the details but you need the lobes well lubricated with assembly lube and you need to run the engine for about 20minutes at varying RPM somewhere between 2-3000. Don't let it idle or your cam is toast. This will work harden the lobes. Fail to do it and you will probably get 500km out of your new cam.
 
Its probably been fogged down if its ex-military? If so, you can probably just fire it up and use it :)
 
The running engine was sprayed with oil "fog" internally before shutting down. More oil fog will exit the exhaust. It's to coat every part for storage. Injectors wouldn't have been pulled though.
 
schlitzaugen said:
I have recommended WD40 because I use it. Not as a starting aid, but because new rings need to bed in. If there is any oil in there, you've blown it. They'll float, polish up and you lose compression. I have a friend who is building and racing his own top fuel dragsters and that is what he does on each engine rebuild. You don't let it sit, you just squirt it in when you're ready and go for the key. It will burn up very well whilst providing a minimal amount of lubrication just as the pistons start to move. The oil pump should take over then. I have always done that on my engines and so far so good.

Oh, and if the engine has been rebuilt and the cam has not been run in, you need to do that as well. Have a look around for the details but you need the lobes well lubricated with assembly lube and you need to run the engine for about 20minutes at varying RPM somewhere between 2-3000. Don't let it idle or your cam is toast. This will work harden the lobes. Fail to do it and you will probably get 500km out of your new cam.
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Thats mostly an issue with American V8 stuff especially and most things with solid lifter pushrod set ups. Not so much an issue if it has roller followers though, like most stuff these days. Not familiar with this particular engine so can’t comment too much.

But spot on wrt to ring bed in. Brand new engines do not live a long happy life if babied. Engines in general do not like to be babied too much…

Dont idles engines for long. Don’t idle a brand new engine as the rings won’t key in and it will glaze and burn oil. Don’t beat on it, but load it up. Same with any engine that’s old too -don’t sit around “warming it up”, it needs to be driven and warmed up fast, otherwise the rich cold mixture washes oil off the bore.

I’ve not gone as far as wf40 on the bores, just left it at the smear of oil during assembly. But I’ve made sure I’m ready to drive on first start and to get it out and loaded a bit after the initial start basic checks to make sure I didn’t screw something up and coolant/oil/fuel isn’t pissinf out somewhere :)
 
I heard of a brand spanking new Megane RS the dealer sent off to have windows tinted. For whatever reason, the tinters somehow left if idling for several hours - probably pulled the key card and didn’t notice the engine was still running.

The engine was stuffed. Massive oil consumption from then on….
 
It's an OHV engine. Here are the specs.

isuzu.jpg
 
I just trust my friend. Used his method and never had any problems. I guess it may be okay to just go for the key if you just assembled your engine yesterday, but in my case I had long gaps sometimes between steps in building engines (I guess I am a weekend warrior). That said, my friend assures me he builds his engines and the next day he's at the track.
 
It's not rocket science, remove spark plugs, (not sure about the modern FI engines, nevertheless, switchng off fuel pump would not be a bad thing) and crank motor over until full oil pressure is obtained and oil is transmitted to every inch of that motor.
Once that happens, spark plugs in, ignition on, start it up and run it in.
John
PS: On assembly, standard practise is to ensure that all components are well lubricated until engine's starts and it's lubrication takes over.
 
schlitzaugen said:
I just trust my friend. Used his method and never had any problems. I guess it may be okay to just go for the key if you just assembled your engine yesterday, but in my case I had long gaps sometimes between steps in building engines (I guess I am a weekend warrior). That said, my friend assures me he builds his engines and the next day he's at the track.
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It is your choice. BUT your friends engines are special for specific racing needs. "who is building and racing his own top fuel dragsters" These engines need to GO straight off the first start and then full power for some seconds then nothing. It would be interesting to know how many 1/2 miles it does in its life. Possibly only several miles in total before a total rebuild. I read somewhere those engines only do several hundred revs in total for the whole race ??? Work it out for yourself, say 6 seconds at 6000RPM is say 360 revolutions plus a bit of idling ?? :rolleyes:

I think this diesel engine is wanted to last a couple of hundred thousand Ks before it needs anything. I say use oil not WD40 and do a proper start and run-in procedure.
If you want to hand turn it before starting then break a hacksaw blade into pieces and break/grind off the teeth, then insert a piece under the exhaust rocker on the valve tip and that will decompress it just enough but not lift the valves very much to touch anything.:dance: I have used this to pump water out of flooded diesel tractor engines in an emergency using the starter, after the sump etc was drained.
Jaahn
 
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I coat liners and bores with Inox rather than WD40, after washing/scrubbing post honing. When installing the rings, I use heaps of engine oil, so the Inox gets swept away anyway. Then, when turning the engine over to fit the cambelt, check timing etc., any oil on the liners is then swept away by the rings anyway. Anyone who only uses and trusts WD40 is living in fantasy land.
 
Thanks everyone for all the suggestions and advice.

A quick update:
The engine (yes, it is a 4BD1) arrived Friday last week and is in the car and going. The engine came complete with all accessories including a new clutch - it had at least been run before being boxed up, and even had diesel in the pump. I got a mechanic to put it in for me as I am completely overloaded with work at the moment, and the raid car is still in pieces :rolleyes:

Jumped in and took it for a run over some winding roads through the hills to the south, then back via the highway. Runs beautifully with substantially less vibration and fumes than the previous unit. The gear shift is also lighter, so suspect that the old clutch was dragging slightly.
 
jaahn said:
It is your choice. BUT your friends engines are special for specific racing needs. "who is building and racing his own top fuel dragsters" These engines need to GO straight off the first start and then full power for some seconds then nothing. It would be interesting to know how many 1/2 miles it does in its life. Possibly only several miles in total before a total rebuild. I read somewhere those engines only do several hundred revs in total for the whole race ??? Work it out for yourself, say 6 seconds at 6000RPM is say 360 revolutions plus a bit of idling ?? :rolleyes:

Jaahn
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A Top Fuel engine is fully rebuilt after every 1/4 mile pass, (well actually it's a 1000 foot pass now for Top Fuel).
If it does make it to the end of the strip in one piece, it's pretty well f#cked anyway.
Making 20 bhp per cubic inch tends to be a bit hard on things.
Every pass uses around 50L of nitromethane at roughly $17 per litre AUD.
They give the engine a quick warm up in the pits before they tow it to the start line. They have to change the oil after the pit warm up because it is contaminated with significant amounts of fuel.
They obviously change the oil again after they make the pass, because it's full of fuel again.
Quality 70WT nitro oil is around $30 per litre AUD, they have around a 12L oil capacity, so 24L of oil per warm up and run.
So just in fluids alone, each pass costs around $1500 AUD. Then there's 16 spark plugs every pass, at around $200 per set AUD, if you shop around.
When everything is factored in, fuel, oil, plugs, tyres, engine rebuild parts, transport, mechanic's wages, crew chief's wage, driver's salary, meals, accommodation, etc, EVERY PASS costs anywhere from $10K USD for a privateer, to $50K USD for a professional team, it's a multi million dollar proposition per year if you want to take it seriously.
A competitive turn key car costs around $750,000 AUD and a complete engine is around $90K, a top team carry several spare engines with them..
That's why they have sponsors.
Maybe you can do it "on the cheap" in Aus.🤔
Yeah, nah, no you can't.
A couple of fairly well off brothers I know, tried to run an old retired Top Fuel funny car without sponsorship, just for "a bit of fun".
They had quite a lot of privateer experience in lesser drag racing categories.
Their little adventure didn't last long, they very quickly started running short of $$$$.
They got that tight with their money that they tried to do two passes without rebuilding the engine in between, and totally destroyed it. They retired from T/F after that.🤷‍♂️
 
Greenpeace said:
A Top Fuel engine is fully rebuilt after every 1/4 mile pass, (well actually it's a 1000 foot pass now for Top Fuel).
If it does make it to the end of the strip in one piece, it's pretty well f#cked anyway.
Making 20 bhp per cubic inch tends to be a bit hard on things.
Every pass uses around 50L of nitromethane at roughly $17 per litre AUD.
They give the engine a quick warm up in the pits before they tow it to the start line. They have to change the oil after the pit warm up because it is contaminated with significant amounts of fuel.
They obviously change the oil again after they make the pass, because it's full of fuel again.
Quality 70WT nitro oil is around $30 per litre AUD, they have around a 12L oil capacity, so 24L of oil per warm up and run.
So just in fluids alone, each pass costs around $1500 AUD. Then there's 16 spark plugs every pass, at around $200 per set AUD, if you shop around.
When everything is factored in, fuel, oil, plugs, tyres, engine rebuild parts, transport, mechanic's wages, crew chief's wage, driver's salary, meals, accommodation, etc, EVERY PASS costs anywhere from $10K USD for a privateer, to $50K USD for a professional team, it's a multi million dollar proposition per year if you want to take it seriously.
A competitive turn key car costs around $750,000 AUD and a complete engine is around $90K, a top team carry several spare engines with them..
That's why they have sponsors.
Maybe you can do it "on the cheap" in Aus.🤔
Yeah, nah, no you can't.
A couple of fairly well off brothers I know, tried to run an old retired Top Fuel funny car without sponsorship, just for "a bit of fun".
They had quite a lot of privateer experience in lesser drag racing categories.
Their little adventure didn't last long, they very quickly started running short of $$$$.
They got that tight with their money that they tried to do two passes without rebuilding the engine in between, and totally destroyed it. They retired from T/F after that.🤷‍♂️
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Sounds like a total waste of time to me. About the only benefit is that it gets the crowds there to watch.
 
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