Peugeot 406 Coupe Advice

[Philby]

Hi Froggers,

First up, I'm a Renault guy so please go easy on me.

My son has his heart set on a 2002 manual V6 406 coupe with 180,000 km on it to use as a daily driver. We took a test drive this morning and met the owner, who is a Pug enthusiast. He has restored the car from a pretty diabolical state of neglect including a fully re-upholstered leather interior. He was very open about the pros and cons of the car in its current state. The car presented well and all the electrics and aircon seemed to work fine. The engine was strong and accelerated smoothly to high revs. My main reservations were:

• there is a small oil leak from the back of the engine that the owner has had a couple of attempts at having fixed, only for it to return after a few months. Oil leaks only get worse, not better, so this one bothered me a bit.
• the gear knob is loose and comes off in the hand. Not sure if there's an easy fix for this.
• the steering and road feedback felt kind of loose. It's not what I was expecting for a car that is famous for pin-sharp handling. The tyres were near new Michelins so I don't think tyres were the issue.
• it had never had a new clutch

I'm aware that older cars need some ongoing maintenance, but is there anything about these issues that screams 'money pit' and 'walk away'? Are these things easily fixable? BTW, I'm in Melbourne and Auto Paris and Alpine Affaire are my local repairers for the Renaults. The 406 has had most of its recent maintenance done at Bayside Peugeot.

Thanks for any insights.

 

[Armidillo]

For what it's worth, my 406 SV sedan (2000, so a D9) has the same mechanicals as the coupe. It has done 345,000 on, AFAIK, original engine, clutch, gearbox and drive shafts.
I bought it about 9 years ago with about 240,000km on speedo. It had been a country car, so it was perfectly believable that it should have been fairly original at that point.

I'll list work done since I've had it:
*Spark plugs & coils (one per plug) - I use Iridium plugs, so only need replacing every 100,000km
*Timing & accessory belts, plus water pump and all pulleys and tensioners replaced
* Crankshaft & camshaft oil seals replaced, + Cam boxes resealed at same time. After 50,000km, cam boxes are leaking again...
*Cooling fans replaced
*Alternator replaced with a 2nd hand one - power steering pressure sensor leaked P/S fluid on it.
*Starter motor replaced (recent)
*Brake disks, pads, & flexible lines replaced.
*Throttle position sensor - was throwing a code
*O2 sensors - this was to try and stop the 'Antipollution fault' msg. PP2000 says it's down to catalytic converters ageing, but thought new sensors might help
*I did replace the brake master cylinder soon after buying the car, but I believe that was misdiagnosis. It failed rego because brake pedal sinks under your foot, but new M/C didn't fix it. I believe it's the ABS unit leaking internally. Has never got any worse - I just take it to a different place for rego checks.
*Shock absorbers - sadly previous owner had replaced originals with Lip, which are underdamped and leaked - replaced with Record
*I believe some suspension bushes were replaced when Lip shocks went in - I've not had any issues with bushes or ball joints
*ARB Drop links front and rear - old ones weren't too bad
*Ignition switch (not lock barrel). If air con stops working I replace the ignition switch. Replacement units don't last as long as originals, so have had to do it 2 or 3 times, but it has always fixed the aircon!
*Door locking problem turned out to be a signal wire broken internally.

It looks a long list, but most is normal maintenance. I haven't listed changes of oils, fluids & filters (don't forget the pollen filter!!).

We have several registered vehicles, which is why it's only done 100,000km in almost 9 years. To be fair it has been off the road from time to time while waiting for parts, but it's my car of choice when I want to get somewhere quickly and safely.

I live in Armidale, so it does mostly country running. I imagine city commuting would be a whole different ball game, especially as a young man may not be able to resist the odd traffic light derby.

Many parts are NLA from PSA/Stellantis, but mechanical parts are available from Spareto and Alvadi in Estonia (among others). 1 week delivery time to country NSW is fantastic - but how do you get to work while you are waiting?

I've no doubt the restorer has done a great job, but it's still a 20 year old car and is going to need more maintenance than a newer car. Is your son planning on doing much of the maintenance himself? He could certainly learn as he goes (as I have done).

Internal trim parts like a gear knob may have to come from a wreckers or be turned up on a lathe. I fitted a generic one from Autopro to a Xantia.

Re steering - tyre pressures might be wrong, wheel alignment might be out. You don't say which Michelins - some such as Primacy LC are a long life tyre, and not a great handling tyre. However I would get an independent mechanic to have a look over it - e.g.. NRMA or equivalent report. Maybe bushes/ball joints are past their best, and they may pick up other issues you've missed.

 

[Armidillo]

Well that would have to be the longest post I've ever typed on my phone!

I forgot engine mounts & a gear change cable - the old engine mounts were so out of shape the mechanic thought I'd supplied the wrong ones!

 

[Armidillo]

I should emphasise that my ES9J4S engine, at 345,000km, still has good compression and uses no oil or water (the amount that weeps out of cam boxes is not measurable on the dip stick). Never touched the exhaust system.

The weakest part of these cars seems to be the 4HP20 auto transmission - but mine (& the one you've looked at) are manuals. The manual box is very strong (but likes an occasional oil change to keep gear changes smooth).

 

[Philby]

Hi Armadillo.

Thanks for your very helpful and thorough reply .

It's a good point you make about urban driving in the 406 coupe. It felt luxurious and comfortable on the freeway but much less so driving around in traffic. I don't think it would get out of 3rd gear for 90pc of driving in Melbourne. For this reason, I decided not to go through with the purchase.

The ad only lasted 1 more day. Hopefully the new owner lives in the country and can give it plenty of open road kms!

 

[Armidillo]

Shame to pass it up - but if your son needs to have one single car that will just go every day, then he needs something a lot newer - just don't ask me to recommend anything (although a Corolla would likely do the job). Maybe you could find him a modern Renault?

Just to skite a bit, I have just completed a solo 1,500 km round trip from Armidale -> Port Macquarie (via Oxley Highway) -> Brisbane (Pacific Highway/M1) -> Armidale (New England Highway). Totally trouble-free and good fuel economy - has now done 348,550 km (but there's someone on here that has an early HDi D9 406 that has done about 650,000km and is still going strong!!).

Only issue is that I should have bought more expensive radiator fans (the cheap new ones vibrate at high fan speed). The car doesn't like Brisbane - I was having to turn the air con off so the roaring and vibrating of the cooling fans would stop.

Achieved 910 km on a single tank during the trip. Filled with 98 RON at Laurieton (S of Port Mac), then drove up the M1 and into Brisbane (overnight stop at Maclean), up to Enoggera, over Mt Cout-tha, then out past Ipswich, through Warwick (overnight stop at Warwick) and finally refilled at Tenterfield.

This included hours of sitting at 110km/h on the M1, then driving in Brisbane, getting over Cunningham's Gap etc. To be fair, I topped it up just as full in Tenterfield as I had at Laurieton - took 75 litres!! I believe that's 8.25 litres/100km - not great by modern standards I know, but it's a 3 litre V6!! At end of the 200 km trip back to Armidale, the trip computer indicated that I should get 1,100km out of current tank (but soon changed it's mind with a bit of town driving). So the new O2 sensors may be helping.

 

[lowpugV2]

In regards to the coupe handling. I don't think it was ever "pin sharp" I clearly remember how disappointed I was when I drove a fairly new one back in 2006... Steering felt light but handling was nose heavy and fairly lifeless. Remember thinking it would make an excellent cruiser, but it wasn't for my younger self. I bought a 306 xsi instead, that did make an excellent urban daily.

 

[Philby]

In regards to the coupe handling. I don't think it was ever "pin sharp" I clearly remember how disappointed I was when I drove a fairly new one back in 2006... Steering felt light but handling was nose heavy and fairly lifeless. Remember thinking it would make an excellent cruiser, but it wasn't for my younger self. I bought a 306 xsi instead, that did make an excellent urban daily.

Thanks, that's really good feedback. 'Nose heavy and lifeless' is a pretty accurate description for what I experienced. I should have researched more before I went for the test drive so my expectations weren't so high.

Roundabouts are a highlight in my Clio, but the 406 did not enjoy them. On the freeway, it was exactly the opposite.

 

[Philby]

Shame to pass it up - but if your son needs to have one single car that will just go every day, then he needs something a lot newer - just don't ask me to recommend anything (although a Corolla would likely do the job). Maybe you could find him a modern Renault?

Just to skite a bit, I have just completed a solo 1,500 km round trip from Armidale -> Port Macquarie (via Oxley Highway) -> Brisbane (Pacific Highway/M1) -> Armidale (New England Highway). Totally trouble-free and good fuel economy - has now done 348,550 km (but there's someone on here that has an early HDi D9 406 that has done about 650,000km and is still going strong!!).

Only issue is that I should have bought more expensive radiator fans (the cheap new ones vibrate at high fan speed). The car doesn't like Brisbane - I was having to turn the air con off so the roaring and vibrating of the cooling fans would stop.

Achieved 910 km on a single tank during the trip. Filled with 98 RON at Laurieton (S of Port Mac), then drove up the M1 and into Brisbane (overnight stop at Maclean), up to Enoggera, over Mt Cout-tha, then out past Ipswich, through Warwick (overnight stop at Warwick) and finally refilled at Tenterfield.

This included hours of sitting at 110km/h on the M1, then driving in Brisbane, getting over Cunningham's Gap etc. To be fair, I topped it up just as full in Tenterfield as I had at Laurieton - took 75 litres!! I believe that's 8.25 litres/100km - not great by modern standards I know, but it's a 3 litre V6!! At end of the 200 km trip back to Armidale, the trip computer indicated that I should get 1,100km out of current tank (but soon changed it's mind with a bit of town driving). So the new O2 sensors may be helping.

I've tried suggesting a modern Renault to him. He likes the older RS Clio's and Megane's but they're taking on collectible status now, and non-trashed examples are fetching silly prices.

He was drawn to the styling of the 406 Coupe, and I can see why. It's still a head turner all these years later. Definitely one of the prettiest cars on the road. Unfortunately there's the practical aspect to consider, especially as a daily urban driver.

 

[seasink]

I haven't driven a 406 coupe, but this talk of steering is interesting to someone who has driven Citroens. Cits are made "nose heavy and lifeless" yet perform well.

Large sedans aren't meant to be sports cars, but even the little DS3, a very good sports model, has less steering feel than its rivals.

 

[pugrambo]

I don't know where this lifeless bit comes in as everytime i drive my sons HDi i pass people through round a bouts with ease while others are dumbfounded

 

[STALLED]

Thanks, that's really good feedback. 'Nose heavy and lifeless' is a pretty accurate description for what I experienced. I should have researched more before I went for the test drive so my expectations weren't so high.

Roundabouts are a highlight in my Clio, but the 406 did not enjoy them. On the freeway, it was exactly the opposite.

Having owned a 182 and a 406 - I totally understand what you mean.

The 406 has infinitely more roll, less grip and steering feel, but is stll fun and capable. You just have to remember that a Clio is one of the best FWD chassis of all time.

 

[Armidillo]

I don't know where this lifeless bit comes in as everytime i drive my sons HDi i pass people through round a bouts with ease while others are dumbfounded

It's probably even more surprising when I flick the 605 through a roundabout .

 

[lowpugV2]

For what it's worth, I don't think a 406 coupe would be a bad daily, but fuel costs and maintenance would creep up... And don't scrape or crack the front bar...

What about a Megane gt220 hatch? Bit frumpy but good to drive and not as harsh as the full rs models.

 

[Ikenna351]

406 V6 Manual fuel consumption is not that high. As for heavy front end, not as heavy as the successor (D2).

The V6 manual version is not a sport car, but still remain the best friendly fun quickest Saloon Peugeot produced from late '90s till around 2016 (yes, better than petrol W2 508), depending on what you are after. Road handling is not as good as the successor. If you are looking for a car to improve your driving skills, you have found one. Not a hardcore car for corners.

As a Saloon 406 V6 Manual user, nothing negative with using one daily. The problem that comes with daily use is addiction to push hard for fun every second behind the wheel (hard to resist).

As for the Coupé V6 version, I haven't driven a manual one long enough to compare with Saloon version (drove one for about a minute on an untared rough road). However, I have driven the 2.0 of it and auto version and found the auto version uninspiring to drive all day. In fact, I have driven 3 of the V6 Auto version and don't look forward to another opportunity to drive them. Quick? Yes, but no goosebumps.

Mine is 22 years old and he is the quickest V6 Peugeot I have, also the most fuel economical V6 Peugeot. About 95% electricals currently on the car came with the car from new. Engine, gearbox, Alternator, Compressor, Variable ratio steering pump, headlights, rear lights, leather interior, door cards, roofliner, all AC components, steering rack, remote control, etc, are still intact (from 0km mileage to over 230,000 km current mileage). No major component on that 22 year old car has failed. Not even a single fuse has cut from new.

Main downside of 406 V6 Coupé manual is the bumpers (very fragile), followed by electric seats (better if you find the manual front seats).

I would do it all over, if I had to choose between D9 406 V6 Manual Saloon (ES9J4S) or a W2. Friendly, fun & lowest maintenance cost Peugeot in my fleet.

Lion-King Monk

 

[eoin27]

I have a 2003 406 coupe auto for about 3 years now. The 4HP20 auto box is a delight once it’s been serviced and the ES9J4S is nothing short of a work of art. Despite changing just about every serviceable part on the engine, the dreaded catalyser ageing warning persists. I could just map it out of the ECU but feel this won’t solve any underlying issue.

Regarding the 406 coupe being a daily, I think they’re so rare and getting rarer, I would only keep mine as a second car. I’ve only covered 4,000km in 2 years. The handling is fantastic compared to a mid 00s Camry but terrible compared to a hot hatch. It’s a motorway cruiser and does what it’s supposed to do very well.

 

[Stephen Murray]

Nothing wrong with the handling of a 406 coupe (the very last of them). I have been on a couple of rallies in mine and although I tend to use it as a GT I was surprised at how nimble it is. Its not a big car and so has plenty of oomph pulling out of tight corners ( and mine is an auto). As a young bloke, would I have it as a daily?? Absolutely!!! Being sensible is for old farts. Maintenance is easy enough, the bumpers are crap so if you prang it they aren't easy to find but life is short, why drive an ugly practical car! When I was a young bloke my dad and much older brother made me buy a pig of a 403 - my friends had Monaro's etc. Nuff said.