Hoist instalation - 3 phase to single phase

[20FIVE]

Hi Aussie Froggers.

I have moved my dad's hoist into my shed which uses a 3 phase 2.2kw electric motor but I don't have 3 phase on the shed.

Can any electrical competent people advise what the best way to connect would be.

1) pay lots of money for a 3 phase connection plus wait forever for a tradie
2) replace the motor with a single phase unit - where's the best place to find them in Adelaide?
or 3) use a vsd invertor as seen on a number of sites when people need something for their cncs or lathes, such as below.

VEVOR VEVOR VFD Drive VFD Inverter 220V 2.2KW 3HP Frequency Drive Inverter Professional Variable Frequency Drive VFD for Spindle Motor Speed Control (2.2KW VFD) | VEVOR AU

Buy VEVOR VFD Drive VFD Inverter 220V 2.2KW 3HP Frequency Drive Inverter Professional Variable Frequency Drive VFD for Spindle Motor Speed Control (2.2KW VFD) at cheap price online, with Youtube reviews and FAQs, we generally offer free shipping to Europe, US, etc.

m.vevor.com.au

Thanks in advance.

 

[AlexB]

2) replace the motor with a single phase unit -

Caveat- I'm not an electrician...
First identify the speed and type of 3HP 415VAC 3 phase motor, for example could be
2 poles 2800rpm
4 poles 1400 rpm
6 poles 960 rpm

Then identify a 240VAC single phase of same mounting bolts, speed and HP, will most likely still need an electrician to wire 15amp connection to fusebox.
These guys in Melbourne might be able to help
https://cononmotor.com.au/product-category/three-phase-motor-415v/
https://cononmotor.com.au/product-category/single-phase-motor-240v/

 

[DoubleChevron]

I just replaced the entire thing .... it was $270 delivered.

VEVOR VEVOR Hydraulic Pump, 10 Quart Hydraulic Power Unit, Single Acting Dump Trailer Pump, 1.7 GPM Flow Rate, 3200 PSI Max Relief Pressure, AC 220V Hydraulic Pump for Dump Trailer Car Lifting | VEVOR AU

Buy VEVOR Hydraulic Pump, 10 Quart Hydraulic Power Unit, Single Acting Dump Trailer Pump, 1.7 GPM Flow Rate, 3200 PSI Max Relief Pressure, AC 220V Hydraulic Pump for Dump Trailer Car Lifting at cheap price online, with Youtube reviews and FAQs, we generally offer free shipping to Europe, US, etc.

www.vevor.com.au

 

[COL]

Your cheapest option will be the VFD, you will be able to control the hoist from the front of the VFD or make up a remote control the panel. You won't need the controls that are currently on the hoist.

You will need some basic wiring skills and be able to program the VFD to for either panel control or remote control, plus what ever other functions you require.

 

[COL]

Another thing that I have thought of if you down the VFD route is to look on the name plate on the motor. It is most likely a 400v wired in star or 230v wired in delta configuration. If it is this style of motor being 3 phase it will be wired in star configuration. To get better torque from the motor using a single to three phase converter you will be better off changing the motor to delta configuration.

If you don't understand this take the a pic of the motor name plate and also remove the motor terminal cover and take a pic of the connections and post on here.

 

[pugwash]

20 FIVE is in huston Texas ,so an adress in Melbourne isnt going ytp be of much help
,U S A use 110 ,so same principal applies , either change motor or fit an inverter ,

 

[seasink]

But he's shopping in Adelaide.

 

[schlitzaugen]

Don't replace the motor or rewire for single phase, you'll be losing a lot of power as Col pointed out.

Get a VFD, that's the ticket.

Vevor is here too and I am happy with their stuff (not a VFD).

 

[20FIVE]

Great, appreciate all the comments. I get back to the garage this weekend and will have a closer look at the motor to check the specifics.

Got a couple of cars desperately needing a check over and oil change.... just a little behind by about 15yrs since we left adelaide...... but now back!!

 

[20FIVE]

Yeap indee

But he's shopping in Adelaide.

Yeap Adelaide

Need to change my profile as repatriation and landing back home 3 weeks ago.

Looking forward to getting back into my cars...lot of catching up to do!!

 

[Matthew]

A suitable VFD is what you need makes synthesised 3 phase from single phase, just what is required. As its name suggests the variable frequency bit is for speed control. We (Australia) generally used the Y (star with neutral) for domestic. Delta is normally 11kV. Any industrial motor I have seen is star, same power just different to delta if such a thing was around. Sq root of 3 difference.

 

[bob]

aaah, never used these converters, but, will he need to treat the thing like a generator and get something with at least double the motor plate Watts to allow for starting up ? Bit like the compressor extension lead.....
Bob

 

[DoubleChevron]

regardless of which way you go .... Does your shed have reasonable wiring? I don't really care about the 15amp powerpoint myself. If your have heavy enough wiring to the shed and aren't drawing additional power loads through it at the same time as the motor starts (its the startup current that'll get you) ... you should be fine. Well my compressor is 15amp .... and its going on 25years old now and has never given me a seconds grief being plugged into 10amp power points of my choosing.

 

[Greenpeace]

My 4 post, 4 tonne hoists came from the factory with 10 amp plugs. My shed doesnt have power so I run a 20m, 10 amp extension reel off the house.
The reel has circuit breakers built into it and the hoists haven't tripped them yet. My little 100 amp arc welder does though (if I try and run too long a weld).

 

[Matthew]

Considering motors are considered to draw upto 6 times nameplate on startup I suggest you look at specs, you can get one that is run close to its rated limit but make sure it can handle startup, most should. Whilst a 10A extension lead works it needs to stay in good order to do this watch out for corrosion on plug and sockets. Loose / high resistance joints never end nicely.

 

[COL]

Considering motors are considered to draw upto 6 times nameplate on startup I suggest you look at specs, you can get one that is run close to its rated limit but make sure it can handle startup, most should. Whilst a 10A extension lead works it needs to stay in good order to do this watch out for corrosion on plug and sockets. Loose / high resistance joints never end nicely.

This is the case when you start the motor DOL, with these VFD's they can be made to soft start so you don't get that huge start up current.

 

[DoubleChevron]

My 4 post, 4 tonne hoists came from the factory with 10 amp plugs. My shed doesnt have power so I run a 20m, 10 amp extension reel off the house.
The reel has circuit breakers built into it and the hoists haven't tripped them yet. My little 100 amp arc welder does though (if I try and run too long a weld).

They might be 2hp motors ... not 3hp .... which would work fine(but be slower). There is no way I'd run my compressor or hoist motors through a long extension lead! The voltage drop would be huge, especially at startup! The hoist and compressor will dim lights usually when they cycle on.

 

[COL]

They might be 2hp motors ... not 3hp .... which would work fine(but be slower). There is no way I'd run my compressor or hoist motors through a long extension lead! The voltage drop would be huge, especially at startup! The hoist and compressor will dim lights usually when they cycle on.

Voltage does not determine the speed of an AC electric motor, the lower the voltage the more current that will be drawn. What governs the speed of AC electric motors is number of poles in the motor and the frequency of the AC power.

My extension leads are made up from flex that has 2.5 mm Sq conductors which is the same size as the wiring to your GPO's. If you purchase hardware store extension leads you may suffer from voltage drop issues because most of these are either 0.75 or 1.00 mm Sq conductors.

 

[Greenpeace]

They might be 2hp motors ... not 3hp .... which would work fine(but be slower). There is no way I'd run my compressor or hoist motors through a long extension lead! The voltage drop would be huge, especially at startup! The hoist and compressor will dim lights usually when they cycle on.

When I made my rolling front driveway gate and associated framework, I ran 50m of 10 amp lead off the house and did all my arc welding out there.
Nothing happened that shouldn't have.
Not sure of the hoists motor ratings, I'm out at present, but I wouldn't say they are exactly slow at lifting a car up. I'll have a look when I get home.

 

[jaahn]

Great, appreciate all the comments. I get back to the garage this weekend and will have a closer look at the motor to check the specifics.

Got a couple of cars desperately needing a check over and oil change.... just a little behind by about 15yrs since we left adelaide...... but now back!!

Hmm sounds like a 240V(230 ?) replacement unit like Shane's might be the cheapest and easiest and if slower, who cares ? IMHO.

I have used VSRs previously back at work for smaller three phase motors on lab equipment. They are great ! Soft start if you want, variable speed control and other useful things too and can be set up to use 3 phase or single. So handy we set up a roving unit that we could use for various rigs we had, and we used it for speed control for sensitive testing. We had a hydraulic high pressure multi pump unit, 10000PSi that we used on Enerpac rams for applying high forces for destructive testing. Having speed control on the motor meant we could run at a wide range of controlled speed just with simple electronic button control instead of as previously using oil flow restriction with metering valves.

But as I remember it the cost then was not cheap. But times change.
Jaahn