GiSelle the GS Mechanical Refresh Mark 2

pottsy

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Steve, the inner cv was right back when I took that shot. The pipes are well clear of everything. I decided to do the loopy thing as it meant direct entry into the pipes and no fiddling around. They're all tied neatly out of the way at present.

And SHE'S ALIVE MARTHTER!

Motor runs sweetly with no dramas firing up. Obviously will be smoky for a wee while until I can drive her enough to bed in the new rings. A bit more attention to exhaust clamps and I can start putting some panels back on I guess.

So far so good!

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

wheelnut

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Congratulations on the start up. Going back to your earlier post regarding installing the motor with the Y piece on, ,Pottsy, I imagine that in the factory the engine , gearbox and suspension were installed into the subframe and then that whole unit was installed in the car. That way they would have done all of the clamps up without having to have triple jointed wrists. Ian
 

pottsy

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Spot on Ian. I found this video on YouFilm. I put in Citroen GS Assembly Lines and a rather grainy film came back of the process from the POV of several assembly line workers, overdubbed in English.

At 15:20 they're putting the front subframe in position on the jig, along with the rear sub and the joining pipes, all, presumably, in the right positions. Yes, it would have been a lot easier without extraneous stuff like bodywork getting in the way!

And interestingly, the claim of full protection for paint work from rust was certainly tested over 40 odd years!

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

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pottsy

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At Last! GiSelle is now back together and ready to get out in the thick of the traffic, except we can't, still locked down!

In any case, she seems to run fine, with minimal smokiness, but given the rings won't be bedded in for a while yet that's ok. I've checked timing etc and she's all good to go. Starts first kick and idles sweetly.

So far no noise from the gearbox at all, but once again we need to drive a bit to be sure.

A few other little bits and pieces got some lovin' as well while I reassembled. New rebound rubbers on the front and re-conditioned front legs with new seals and boots.

The exhaust finally gave in to my swearing and all is now leak free and quiet.

Front panels back on and after a wash (and a tidy up of the Shed) she'll be promoted to first cab off the rank in the driveway!

Thanks for the support throughout this rebuild. It's good to be able to bounce ideas off fellow loonies!

Cheers, Pottsy

And so the victorious Triffid army meandered across the plains en route to their next adventure. Only the bruised and battered gurblewackers remained to spin tales of the great battle!
The Leaders retired to mountain resorts with well stocked bars, the merchants counted their ill gotten gains, and Fred went outside to kick a tree!
 

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PeterMol

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At Last! GiSelle is now back together and ready to get out in the thick of the traffic, except we can't, still locked down!

In any case, she seems to run fine, with minimal smokiness, but given the rings won't be bedded in for a while yet that's ok. I've checked timing etc and she's all good to go. Starts first kick and idles sweetly.

So far no noise from the gearbox at all, but once again we need to drive a bit to be sure.

A few other little bits and pieces got some lovin' as well while I reassembled. New rebound rubbers on the front and re-conditioned front legs with new seals and boots.

The exhaust finally gave in to my swearing and all is now leak free and quiet.

Front panels back on and after a wash (and a tidy up of the Shed) she'll be promoted to first cab off the rank in the driveway!

Thanks for the support throughout this rebuild. It's good to be able to bounce ideas off fellow loonies!

Cheers, Pottsy

And so the victorious Triffid army meandered across the plains en route to their next adventure. Only the bruised and battered gurblewackers remained to spin tales of the great battle!
The Leaders retired to mountain resorts with well stocked bars, the merchants counted their ill gotten gains, and Fred went outside to kick a tree!
Congratulations pottsy. I feel a gs run coming when we get out of jail
 

pottsy

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You're a bunch of subversives!

I've just been for a walk, one of the only 5 reasons to leave home.

Because where I live is very hilly I elected to walk along the Yarra River walk, less than 5km from my home, but too far to walk to and from so a valid reason to use the car. A log book entry was kosher, and the drive to and from the car park from whence I journeyed out and back was very refreshing.

You really don't realise what a luxury it is having synchromesh on 3rd gear until you've lost and then regained it. Gearbox feels wonderful. Only down side is there's still a bit of a low level "zizz" which is speed dependent, but not gear dependent. I thought I'd nailed this when I found the output bearings on the drive flanges were noisy and the two I've put in came fresh from Citroen Pieces d"origine boxes, so I feel I should be able to discount them as the cause.

Diff bearings seemed fine, as did the main shaft bearings both ends. Front wheel bearings are new, and in any case the noise changeth not under cornering loads. Driveshafts have been stripped and re-greased. Not sure where else to look to be honest. That being said, it's not a big deal and it's great to have GiSelle back on the road again with way less smoke and a noticeable increase in power I reckon!

Any progress is good progress, and when it comes with tangible improvement, so much the better!

I have a Smile on me Dial!

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

simca1100

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disconnect the speedo cable and take it for a spin to see if you are right...
 
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DoubleChevron

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But you can do lots of radials too.
For me, 5km would limit me to just my road, plus 2 Tee intersections.
For most urbanites I'm sure you could do 100km without going along the same street twice.

He has perfect running in conditions. 5kms is heaps. residential streets.... no traffic ... get the motor nice and warm. Lots of full throttle acceleration down all back streets to bed the rings in ..... lots of engine braking for each give you sign ..... You could get the motor really nice and hot and progressively push it harder over say .... 1/2hour until your doing full throttle runs runs out to close to the redline. It'll probably only take half an hour to have the rings really nicely seated in :evil:
 

Robin Hoffmann

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You're a bunch of subversives!

I've just been for a walk, one of the only 5 reasons to leave home.

Because where I live is very hilly I elected to walk along the Yarra River walk, less than 5km from my home, but too far to walk to and from so a valid reason to use the car. A log book entry was kosher, and the drive to and from the car park from whence I journeyed out and back was very refreshing.

You really don't realise what a luxury it is having synchromesh on 3rd gear until you've lost and then regained it. Gearbox feels wonderful. Only down side is there's still a bit of a low level "zizz" which is speed dependent, but not gear dependent. I thought I'd nailed this when I found the output bearings on the drive flanges were noisy and the two I've put in came fresh from Citroen Pieces d"origine boxes, so I feel I should be able to discount them as the cause.

Diff bearings seemed fine, as did the main shaft bearings both ends. Front wheel bearings are new, and in any case the noise changeth not under cornering loads. Driveshafts have been stripped and re-greased. Not sure where else to look to be honest. That being said, it's not a big deal and it's great to have GiSelle back on the road again with way less smoke and a noticeable increase in power I reckon!

Any progress is good progress, and when it comes with tangible improvement, so much the better!

I have a Smile on me Dial!

Cheers, Pottsy.
Here you go Ray. With your experience doing engine rebuilds this one/these should be a piece of cake!! Double the fun!!


Cheers, Robin
 

pottsy

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Wow Robin, that's a project and a half. Now given I have a 1220cc and 1015cc engine available, which would you put in the back? 'Twould be a beast to drive in any case.

I took GiSelle for another therapeutic drive today, still within my 10km radius and had a brisk walk along the Diamond Creek at the turn around point. Then I took her shopping as well. All kosher so my conscience is clear.

Best thing was NO smoke on start up and the sweetest gear change ever. I don't know how long the euphoria will last, but I'm pretty chuffed that I've recovered a robust 3rd gear synchro at the very least.

She's got a few little weeps under the bonnet somewhere though, which I guess I'll chase next time I put her up on the hoisty thing.

Apart from that, she starts first turn of the key and seems to have way more gruntys than before. Front end is quiet and suspension is supple.

All in all, I plan to enjoy driving her more just as soon as we can do it without ending up on a respirator!

So cheers, and once again, thanks for all the moral support while I did this work.

Next project crosses the Channel. It's a 1430cc fire breathing beast of a Mini engine. I've only ever worked on the small bore versions, 998 and 1098cc jobbies. This motor was built by a Guru here in Melbourne who has since gone to the Great BMC Garage in the sky.

It was in a Mate's Moke and went like a rocket, as you can imagine in an overgrown go-kart. It did the big explosive decompression thing by dropping a couple of valve springs and valves into the reciprocating bits, all at full noise at a Motorkhana.

No 3 son bought the remains for his Van and I've volunteered to rebuild it. New pistons & rings, and a rebuilt head, will go some way towards bringing it back to the dark side.

A fun piece of work. Feeling quite satisfied at having achieved accurate machining of 110 thou off all four new pistons because the block has been decked.

More anon, even though it's not French!

Cheers for now. Pottsy.
 
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pottsy

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There's always something else!

A bloke I used to work with was so close to being an alcoholic you could use his emissions to fuel a rocket. He used to describe his life as "Lurching willy-nilly from one crisis to the next!" I begin to understand him after all these years.

Having put a couple of short drives under GiSelle's belt, so to speak, I'd noticed a bit of an oily smell now and then. Naturally I put this down to residual scunge cooking out of the odd niche or two I hadn't cleaned. But then I noticed a measure of oily incontinence where she'd been sitting in the driveway. Not wanting to embarrass the lady, I thought a gentle relocation on to the hoist for changing of the front wheels would be a suitably discreet opportunity to also examine her for leakage.

All indications appeared to be that the hydraulic pump was resenting the recent attentions to the reciprocal bits and had decided to shed some LHM in a sneaky way. To investigate, I dug out yet another bullet in need of tooth marks and proceeded to remove the headlamps, headlamp panel and front fan shroud so I could get a gander at the pumpy thing.

It's easy to say that, of course, it's another thing to achieve it. First hurdle was the fact that the bonnet release cable had jumped out of it's slot meaning I had to resort to nefarious means to pop the lid. That's now fixed and hopefully won't happen again.

Second hurdle came when removing the shroud. The feed line to the pump is attached to the shroud at the bottom. Can you get to it in situ? Of course not! One has to release the shroud, gently lift it up enough to be able to undo the cable clip, and all without destroying the hose or the pump boot! OK, Mr Citroen, enough already!

So, once the chien could view the lapin, it was noticeable that there were traces of oil from above the pump area, implying that I was being unfair to the pump. Closer inspection guided me toward the oil feed line to the driver's side cylinder head. Believe it not, there was the occasional drip from within the locating clip!

Yes folks, the bit of vibration absorbent rubber inside the "p" clip had rotted away and eroded the pipe.

I know it's not going to be fun to fix this. I could clean, cut and braze or solder in situ perhaps, but I'm reluctant to do so. If I have to pull it out anyway, I'll use the spare pipe assembly I happen to have, and renew all of the absorbent clamp linings at the same time. So probably the inlet manifold and some associated bits have to come off again! Ah well, it's not like I don't know how to do it by now!

I guess one good thing out of all this covid lockdown farrago is that I found this issue before it became a tow truck job, and also, that I've got the opportunity to fix it.

Soldier on chaps! Pottsy.
 

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wheelnut

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That's a bit of a bugger, Pottsy. it's almost impossible to spot those little things when you're in the process of getting it all together and running again. I hadn't thought of accessing through the headlight, so while it might make the wrist twisting a bit more difficult, it will certainly save a bit of time. And I'm pleased to hear that your not going to do the sleeve and braze repair. There were a couple of those on Gaston and they only caused stress points so I had to change the whole line. Better to replace it with one you have. Cheers. Ian PS Is GiSelle coming to Cowra in March?
 
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Buttercup

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May I respectfully suggest that you guys don't shy away from repaired steel tubes.
However there are good repairs, and crap ones.
I suggest that brazing rarely leads to a good repair.

A similar process, 90% as strong, but 240 degrees cooler, is 45% silver solder.
Brazing can very badly affect the steel of the component, and it can look quite messy and lumpy.
SS is ideal for sleeve repairing steel tubes. However, it does require a high level of cleanliness, and therefore removal, blowing through and wire brushing.

I urge any car restorer or maintainer, but particularly those working on cars with 462m of hydraulic piping, to invest in the required materials for 45%SS.
Because it is 240 degrees cooler than braze, you can do small parts with a LPG torch without Oxy. I do use LPG + Oxy 'cos I cut steel as well, but you don't have to for SS. Don't use flux coated rods. Use bare sticks and a pot of silver brazing flux ( aqueous paste) and brush it liberally around the area.
Silver solder does not fill big gaps, so joints need to be reasonably close, but it does wick in very well, so design the joint with good material overlap.
Look at old fashioned lug and tube construction of bicycles.... cheap ones were brazed, 'cos the steel was little better than mild, but the very best racing frames were very high spec steel and silver soldered.
I still ride a Reynolds 531 frame that I built with 45% silver solder in the '70s.
It's as good as the day it was built.
 

pottsy

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Jeez Ian! I'm good, but not that good. I removed all the headlamp panel, not just one light. I wasn't planning on keyhole surgery! (Reminds me of the story of the mechanic and the gynaecologist!)

Bob, I'm with you on the silver soldering, except I've never done it. If I had to repair the crook one I probably would have a go, but so far the spare is looking good, and it will be well buffered and supported by sections of fuel hose in the clips.

Here's a closeup of the crook bit. It's very slightly cracked and what was left of the clamp action was reducing the drip to an ooze. Thinking back to when I reassembled the motor, I took this particular clip to be attached to the pipe as it didn't move like the others. Should have thought about it a bit more, but I assumed (!) it was soldered (or brazed) on and used it as a reference point for the other mountings.

Could have been worse, it could have been urinating out and blown up my nicely rebuilt motor!

Beer O'Clock I reckon.

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

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