GiSelle the GS Mechanical Refresh Mark 2

Buttercup

Member
Years ago I have done it both ways.
My first GS, I took the motor out leaving the gearbox in.
Second one, the whole lump.
It's too long ago to remember if one was better than the other.

The engines in my 2 modified 2CVs tend to get handled with the gearbox attached.
They come out before each Raid, to check, straighten, strengthen the chassis, and tidy things up a bit.
I haven't separated the boxes off for quite a while, but one will have to soon as 3rd synchro is gone.
One of these years we'll get another Raid.......
 

Citquery

New member
Chris, the October is simply because I don't reckon it'll go back in the car until then.
(I lie, actually I meant to write August but had a brain fade!! :) )
Not too much evidence of brain fade in the main game, Pottsy.

Great work; informative and entertaining write-up: thank you!

Chris
 

wheelnut

Member
Hi Pottsy. As you know I have recently done it both ways, and quite close to each other so can compare. I think you mentioned that you had installed the clutch plate with a spiggot shaft, so that would be accurately centred, in which case I would suggest gearbox first and engine second. Ability to do up the drive shafts and the brake hydraulic lines at close quarters from the front rather than the underneath or over the engine is a real plus. I notice that you have the gear selector linkage in - I seem to remember that that would need to come out to get the engine and box back in as one.
Either way you have still got a do those bloody Y pipe front unions in situ. The first time I heated and bent an 11 mm ring spanner to reach in and get the nuts, but the second time I welded the bolts into one cap, and positioned it so that I could finally tighten the nuts with a deep socket and long extension from above, beside the gearbox.
I also suggest that you make up a wooden block with a suitable recess as a spacer to allow you to jack up the front of the gearbox to a suitable angle to receive the engine without damaging the clutch cable housing. Ian
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Thanks guys. Some food for thought.

Ian, I know I have to take out the selector again but wanted to make sure all the gears were findable first. I used the input shaft from the gearbox to align the clutch so I don't anticipate any consumer resistance in that quarter anyway.

I suspect it may be easier to do gearbox first, for the reason given, but once I sort out the return lines with some new hose I guess it will be just as easy to chuck the whole in the hole, so to speak.

I've got a couple of new exhaust clamps that have the bolts captive on one half, so I'm hoping the bloody y pipe will bend to my will at last!

Since I'm doing this on a hoist, arranging a means of supporting the gearbox at the right angle is relatively easy with the jacking plate. I know, I'm boasting! :)

Thanks Chaps. I think I see the way forward! Oh, and thanks for the kind words, Chris.

Cheers, Pottsy
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Once again answering the questions no-one else ever dared to (or wanted to) ask!

Yes, the weight of the gearbox assembly, complete with calipers etc fitted. Want to guess first?

The return lines are most of the way towards being checked and replaced. The main return from the nylon gathering point down near the brake controller was replaced yesterday. It wasn't leaking as far as I can tell but there were signs of weepage. This may have been looseness of the clamp or a latent cracking of the 46 plus years old rubber but a new section of fuel hose with a protective section over it where the assembly passes behind the sub frame should address it in any case. The smaller tubes are also replaced with loops of fuel hose and new clampage. The last one to address is the main one from the regulator down to the aforementioned gathering point. This may need a size changer created to adapt but I'll move on to that before replacing the whirly bits in the hole.

I've decided to go with the whole assembly as one before re-fitting. It gives me a bit more control over the insertion of the gearbox bits into the motor this way. But letting the engine and gearbox play Mummies and Daddies will have to wait for a day or so while I deal with another task, editing a monthly magazine for a Car Club.

In the meantime, here's the weight of the gearbox in pictorial form!

Cheers, Pottsy
 

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pottsy

1000+ Posts
Had a bit of chance to play today so I've successfully combined the twirly bit with the whirly bit into one. As I left the shed both were lighting up a smoke! ( :) )

The (difficult to access) return lines are now all replaced with new rubber fuel hose. OK, not fair dinkum Citroen, but should last at least as long as the original. I also found the high pressure line feeding the front height corrector had been repaired by brazing at some stage. While this wasn't obviously leaking I figure now is the time to sort it out while I can even see it, let alone work on it, so I dug out a replacement pipe from my Stash. I'll clean it up and install it first chance, then it's Heigh Nonny No on to the insertion of the propulsion podule into the mobility module.

More news as it comes to hand. And now, back to our sponsor!

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

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pottsy

1000+ Posts
Bob, I tend to agree.

One amazing thing is that it was obviously effective and, as far as I can tell, it wasn't leaking.

Even more amazing is that it was totally hidden until I de-greased and pressure washed the engine bay.

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

DoubleChevron

Real cars have hydraulics
Had a bit of chance to play today so I've successfully combined the twirly bit with the whirly bit into one. As I left the shed both were lighting up a smoke! ( :) )

The (difficult to access) return lines are now all replaced with new rubber fuel hose. OK, not fair dinkum Citroen, but should last at least as long as the original. I also found the high pressure line feeding the front height corrector had been repaired by brazing at some stage. While this wasn't obviously leaking I figure now is the time to sort it out while I can even see it, let alone work on it, so I dug out a replacement pipe from my Stash. I'll clean it up and install it first chance, then it's Heigh Nonny No on to the insertion of the propulsion podule into the mobility module.

More news as it comes to hand. And now, back to our sponsor!

Cheers, Pottsy.

I haven't seen anyone manage a nice repair with fuel line before. The re-enforcement inside the line usually causes issues with routing and pressure against any joiners causing them to fail. Well done :dance:
 

forumnoreason

1000+ Posts
I've been wrangling that plastic joiner with the motor in. Its a pig. the hose within a hose join is straight out fiddly and tres difficule! argh. easy to do with no merde in the way.
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Thanks for that Peter. I actually have the proper Citroen flaring squidger myself as well but it's good to know where there's another one in case mine decides to hide! (Prob in company with a tribe of 10mm spanners! :) )

Since I had a good (unbrazed) version of the right pipe I don't need to re-manufacture anyway.

Cheers. So did your purchase happen?
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Well if ever I earned a beer, today is it!

Yesterday I fitted the newly re-conditioned and painted front suspension legs and triple checked all the pipes were (a) out of the way and (b) secure.

After due consideration I decided to insert the Propulsion Podule into the Mobility Module in a single unit. I figured it came out that way, it can bloody well go back in that way. And so today it proved to be. A relatively straightforward process once the correct angle of the dangle is ascertained. Crikey it's tight!

A large sigh of relief was expelled once the engine mount and gearbox mount bolts were inserted and tight. At least then the bloody thing can't fall out!

So then came the worst job I have ever tackled on a car. After some 50 odd years of doing just about anything automotive and/or mechanical, the fitting of the exhaust to this car came close to beating me! I imagine it's easier when just fitting mechanicals on a subframe out of the car, and in fact the pictures in the manuals show exactly that. But when the steering rack, subframe and gearbox combine to thwart, it's NO FUN!

I finally came up with what I think was a clever solution. I attached a ratchet strap along the length of the exhaust pipe and slowly hauled it in to apply compression to the 5 (count 'em!) flares that need to be clamped. Once they were positioned, three of them are pretty easy to attach. Those two up beside the box of cogs, however, require a degree of mechanical dexterity previously only required to perform keyhole surgery on an ailing hamster! (Don't ask!)

So the exhaust is on, the tools are packed away and the XXXX Cold Gold broached! In the meantime the podule and module can go ahead and get re-acquainted and do whatever comes naturally to a red-blooded French Couple!

Salut! Pottsy.

" 'ullo ma cherie. Where 'ave you been? Fancy a little 'ow you say, Rumpy Pumpy?"
" You naughty Garcon. Not without a cold glass of LHM and une petit morceau du fromage! "
 

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Ken W

1000+ Posts
Now here's a thought. I wonder whether you can put the exhaust, down to including the Y piece onto the engine gearbox before you put them in through the subframe hole ? That would make it much easier to tighten up the exhaust clamps and make all the contortions required to do them up in the car redundant!
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Ken, I thought of doing that but there simply doesn't appear to be the space to get it all through while fitted up.

I imagine if that had been practicable then one fiddly step on the production line could have been avoided completely.

At least coming at the Y pipe clamps from above without all the air circulation gubbins in the way is marginally easier than when I first attempted it from underneath. (When I renewed the driver's side pipe and pre-heater tube).

Despite the frustration, I do feel a sense of achievement. I just bet the bloody things will leak like sieves now, just to annoy me!

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

Ken W

1000+ Posts
I did find that they soot up to seal after a while. You should be ok to let that happen now its registered. It was only a problem before because you were trying to get a safety certificate straight after you put it together last time.

Cheers, Ken W 03
 

wheelnut

Member
Hi Pottsy. Having had three goes at this since I got Gaston, I found that the best way to get the exhaust sealed up was to put the whole system in place joint by a joint, but without fully tightening any clamps, from the engine to the rear of the car,and then tightened up completely starting at at the manifolds and then successively working back. I then tightened a minor clamps for the carburettor base pipes last. I found that way everything could find its own position and get the best seal. I realise you might be past this point, but I'm putting it out there for those following your excellent progress as something for them to try. Cheers. Ian
 

pottsy

1000+ Posts
Ian, that's pretty much what I've done. The difficulty initially was getting the 2 y pipe clamps in position at all. Once that was accomplished I started tightening at the engine end and worked backwards as you say. The annoying this is that I haven't been able to put any sealant in because I don't have three triple jointed arms! The sealant I favour is Holts FIregum and when you can get it in before clamping, it's simply wonderful stuff.

So far today the RH suspension is all back in, just got to tighten up the drive flange bolts & nuts. To make that easier I'm halfway through re-establishing the handbrake system so I can hold the disc easier.

Hydraulic hoses and pipes are all back in and I've filled the reservoir ready for pumping.

It's all go down here at the Bureau! :)

Cheers, Pottsy.
 

forumnoreason

1000+ Posts
those return lines you put in Ray look very close to the driveshaft. I've just given up using the Daniel connection hose to the plastic connector and going the fuel line instead because they are bloody impossible.
 
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