Back in the day there was only one option for coolant / inhibitor (OK two to be pedantic) - it was that green stuff (ethylene glycol?) that you bought concentrated and diluted with water to whatever spec the handbook said. And that other option was not to bother and just use water - dangerous come the winter or with one of those new-fangled alloy heads. In the motor factors the other day there was a choice of green, pink, or blue liquids - the whole subjects more confusing than snooker, especially since I've been told that you cannot mix the (new) pink stuff with the (old) green. This has come to front of mind since I've half drained the 505 and am now wondering should I 'convert' the coolant to the modern pink stuff? With the "cannot mix" scenario how rigorous is this? ie if I drain the block, refill - maybe run some flushing through on basis of age since last done, redrain, then go pink will that be sufficient (given that theoretically some diluted green from the heater matrix may still be floating around)? I'm assuming here there's some advantage to using the pink stuff since all 'modern' cars seem to run it?
Coolant
- Thread starter baldrick56
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Yes the new long life coolant stuff has been designed for less contamination of the environment by using organic acid technology and long life changes. The old green stuff works but !
If you just flush the engine with say two complete changes of clean water with a short run up to temp with the heater open and a complete drain it will be OK IMHO.
Jaahn
If you just flush the engine with say two complete changes of clean water with a short run up to temp with the heater open and a complete drain it will be OK IMHO.
Jaahn
I would imagine the long-life green coolant would be the go in a 505. Diluted to 33% or 50% though? Most pre-mix seems to be 33%.
The glycol is just the antifreeze component mixed with water and then dye and inhibitors are added to the mix. The full change requirement avoids mixing incompatible corrosion inhibitor chemistry that may not work when combined. You might inadvertently mix different chemicals that effectively cancel each other out or combine to cause a problem. The additives are also consumed over time, hence the need to replace the coolant periodically.
Not all 'blue' coolant is the same as I found when looking for coolant for a Citroen XM PRV engine. Nulon's 'blue' premix is 33% vs Penrite's at 50%. Glysantin G30 is specified for Citroen post-1993. This corresponds to VW's G12+ and TL 774-F. Penrite Blue Longlife claims G12+. However, Nulon's Blue coolant claims a VW standard TL 774-C, which corresponds to G48, an older type of coolant like the green coolant. So it's not actually the same 'blue' coolant you might want for a later Citroen engine. This would be why their product selectors did not both pick the 'blue' coolant for the same car. Confusing to say the least.
The glycol is just the antifreeze component mixed with water and then dye and inhibitors are added to the mix. The full change requirement avoids mixing incompatible corrosion inhibitor chemistry that may not work when combined. You might inadvertently mix different chemicals that effectively cancel each other out or combine to cause a problem. The additives are also consumed over time, hence the need to replace the coolant periodically.
Not all 'blue' coolant is the same as I found when looking for coolant for a Citroen XM PRV engine. Nulon's 'blue' premix is 33% vs Penrite's at 50%. Glysantin G30 is specified for Citroen post-1993. This corresponds to VW's G12+ and TL 774-F. Penrite Blue Longlife claims G12+. However, Nulon's Blue coolant claims a VW standard TL 774-C, which corresponds to G48, an older type of coolant like the green coolant. So it's not actually the same 'blue' coolant you might want for a later Citroen engine. This would be why their product selectors did not both pick the 'blue' coolant for the same car. Confusing to say the least.
Don't forget the purple...yes the blue between the 2 manufacturer is very confusing when you're standing in front of shelves 
For PSA cars with the 'straw' coloured coolant, is there any problem changing to a different coolant?
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Don't use Glycol coolants, only for antifreeze, and causes corrosion if diluted too much. Get Valvoline Glycol free. Only available only from Big W or Woolworths Supermarkets as far as I know. Otherwise Penrite 10 10ths, but more expensive.
You could argue that in Oz there is no point in glycol based coolants in most locations, as anti-freeze is mostly irrelevant. Castrol makes, or used to make, a simple corrosion inhibitor - one can into 5 litres of de-ionised water. I'm totally confused about the others so stick with what I'm using - I know what to buy but certainly don't know what type it is.
New fangled alloy heads? My 1950-build Renault 4CV has one of them. Coolants are so confusing. I just don't change the type I use.
There is certainly a place for non-glycol coolants (AS Type B) just as there is for waterless coolants. Remember that glycol also raises the boiling point, which is likely more of an issue in Australia than freezing is in most parts. However, people are generally lazy and wouldn't change water+inhibitor ahead of really cold days in winter. It definitely drops below zero across a wide area. Close to the sea it is less likely, but even in Sydney somewhre like Richmond in the west will certainly happen repeatedly through winter. So the glycol coolant is simply the most practical solution for the manufacture and also the lazy owner ...
Yes, a fair analysis David and no arguments from me. I live near the sea and we've had a couple of nights below zero in 33 years. forgot to mention I use a glycol coolant in my 4CV precisely because of the higher boiling point, especially in that car's non-pressurised system. I measured its boiling point once at 107 degrees I think.
I looked into waterless coolants too, as many have I imagine. The cost is a slight deterrent, but mainly the concensus seemed to be that they ran about 10 degrees hotter because of the lower thermal capacity. In winter that's not such a bad thing.
Although the glycol coolants raise the boiling point, they may also be partly reponsible for your engine reaching that higher boiling point.
The boiling point of water is increased 1.5C per psi of pressure.
There is a significant difference between a glycol solution and pure water's abilities to absorb and transfer heat. In industrial HVAC the solution being used has a direct bearing on the design of the system. In high temperature applications a glycol based system needs to be in the order 20% larger than a pure water based system to deal with the same amount of heat.
In a nutshell a vintage car that wasn't designed to use a glycol solution will most likely run hotter with the addition of a glycol solution unless the system was overdesigned to begin with.
I've heard Jay Leno talk about these. Don't you just ignore the temperature gauge ? You run them unpressurised. Remember it won't boil at 100degrees.
Its a no brainer with an old car that is hard to find part for. They simply don't rust or corrode at all internally by the sounds of it running that waterless coolant.
Yes but you can do both together. That is what Renault did with the R8 sealed for life system. Indeed if you dumped the glycol for some reason and ran straight water it always lead to overheating problems as the temp was very close to boiling running normally with no head room to go up.
Of course the R8 system was carried over to the R10, R4 , R12 etc etc. The factory fill in Australia was BP R70/30. I would also say that when you pulled the head on them and hosed the stuff off they were as clean as new inside the water jackets.
Jaahn
Thanks for the video link.
I think that is quite correct. I basically haven't had a corrosion problem for decades running either corrosion inhibitors or glycol-based coolant with its extra inhibitors mind you. Given I have a car that struggles to warm up properly in winter, perhaps I should use the waterless one for that reason alone! Hadn't thought of that.
Too add one more to the mix, the local racing car supply shop sells a lot of the 'Water Wetter' product by Redline. I've not tried it but it claims to improve heat transfer to the coolant.
Very good point. I should go back to pure corrosion inhibitor or go waterless. Renault 4CV systems aren't over-designed for 40-degree days, that is for sure.