About Total "T"

[Alan S]

Anybody know the colour of Total "T" which is used in the Citroen c-matic gearbox, as well as anything which may/can be used as a substitute. If the genuine article is not used, then what synptoms do you get when driving the car??

Alan S

[This message has been edited by Alan S (edited 11 June 2001).]

 

[David Cavanagh]

Alan, Penrite made a product called fluid T. It was there version, its still on there product listings but you should not be able to get anymore because I ordered the last drum, they got that in for me from WA and said that it was the last one, I need some more and so far I havn't found any. All oil companies tell me they have an equivelent and it will work and if they try to sell you an equal, do what we do at work, ask them to put it in writting, that usually shuts them up, tell them how much a c-matic torque convertor costs and watch them back pedal.
If you use the wrong fluid thats what will happen, it will slip like made and smell very hot. I'm searching for an answer at the moment so if I find one I'll let you know.

David.

 

[Alan S]

David,

The panic here is that I have just pulled the dipstick & I'm trying to define what has been put in my c-matic hence the request foe info on colour.
I actually have managed to get a contact in Total & could be in with a chance of organising some Total products here in Oz. I have already found a suppleir in Brisbane but they would have to be the slackest company I have ever dealt with hence my contact with the hierachy in Singapore.
Can you tell me the colour of Total & if possible Penrite??

Alan S

 

[DoubleChevron]

Hi Alan,

sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I think total sold there entire Total 'T' stock off to the UK citroen car club a few years ago, and no longer carry it. I think the UK club still has some, but I doubt if they'll give it away...

I think Total 'T' is clear, we have a 1litre tin of it at home. I'll check for you. I've heard Total 'T' is mostly friction enhancers so if you can find a harsh Auto trans fluid for early Automatics it would probably work OK. I remember reading years ago that total 'T' was identical to a localy available Auto trans fluid. It'll take me several months of searching to find the article in 1 of the CCCV newsletters though. Someone must remember??

seeya,

Shane Leviston

 

[Paul Smith]

Alan,

'Fluide T' is still listed on Total's web site in France

http://www.lubricants.total.com/professionnels/france_transmission.html

This indicates that it is probably still available - as you say extracting it from them will be your only problem.

Paul

 

[Alan S]

Thanx for that guys,
Here's the latest; I contacted Total via their "local" operation which is Singapore, this was some time ago, & was given the name of the Total distributor in Brisbane & a phone number. I phoned & spoke to the rep who promised to send me all info on Total products. That was a few eeks ago & the e-mail I got from Total said if I had any problems to contact a certain person at Total which I now have done twice with no response at all.
My local Total seller is also just as mystified as he reckons they would have to be the worst company he has ever dealt with. They hounded him to take up an agency & now they don't even answer his calls. He placed an order a month ago which still hasn't arrived (thank God for Castrol according to him)
Working on what seems to be the safe assumption that Total are TT (Total Tossers) the best I have come up with on websites are Shell recommend "Donax TF" whilst Castrol say Castrol "TQF" both of which are apparently made specifically for a particular type of "Ford" transmission.
Anybody heard good or bad about those two?
Presumeably they are Red in colour & I suspect that may be what I have in my tranny at present.

ALAN s

 

[Alan S]

Further to previous postings, can anyone tell me the difference between Shell Donax TF, Castrol TQF and the other ATF (Donax 111 for example) the reason being that now the weather has got a bit colder (bloody cold sounds like an apt description) I have found that first thing in the morning, I have to let the car sit & idle for 5-10 minutes before I can select any gear. Once it's warm it changes no problem. The reasom I'm asking is that I have heard it said that certain ATF's have friction enhancers in them to help make the bands grip but with a c-matic this is a non-event. Also, I presume that the diff is included in the transmission of one of these and if this is the case, I woouldn't imagine you would particularly need or want, friction enhancers in there.
If I do have to change it, what is involved in changing the complete transmission fluid and how would you change it in the torque converter??
Also, would wrong fluid have any bearing on the fuel consumption?

Alan S

 

[DoubleChevron]

Hi Alan,

can't help with the Fluid types, but to change the fluid (by memory) there is 2 drain plag, and one filter to removed and clean. You can't entirely change all the fluid at once, the torque convertor always keeps it's fluid and can't be drained, I think about 1litre gets left behind at each change.

When my car had a C-matic it drove us to distraction. 22mpg round town, 22mpg highway, 22mpg thrashing the shit out of it, 22mpg driving like an old man, 22mpg towing a trailer, guess your seeing the patern about know?

We junked the C-matic and dumped a 4spd in it. However nowadays if I had a good C-matic like you have I'd go out my way to keep it original and in good nick. They are a rare bird world wide now (Serie I C-matics that is...).

seeya,

Shane L.

 

[Alan S]

Shane,

To my reckoning, I'm getting about 13.5 to 15 litres per 100 klms which is "wank tank" type figures. I did notice a strange thing this morning though, & that was that I was going through the 747 type warm up before trying to select reverse & the belts were making a noise; not as in slipping, just noisy. So I gave them a bit of a squirt to dress them as they are all pretty well stuffed as I am sure they are the originals. The noise went away & the idle which was painfully slow (almost stalling) all of a sudden increased by about 3/400 rpm & smoothed right out which got me thinking, if dry belts bottoming in the pulleys can make that much difference (obviously creating a load), how much would it make if the wrong fluid was in the transmission?
I intend writing to the guy I bought the car off to see if he can send me a copy of the service records because he reckoned he'd not long had the transmission fluid changed & although he was using a well known Citroen service guy down there, I don't have much confidence in any of the Sydney bods judging on some of the things I've found on this car & others I've heard about through the boards. Juraj reckoned the previous owner told him the synchros were caput, but I've never seen any evidence of this, just this selection when cold business & it would be interesting to know if this condition existed before the fluid was changed. I was hoping someone may have struck it before.

Alan S