2011 Peugeot 207cc Auto - gearbox fault repair needed message

And yes, this transmission is very conventional in its design, construction and operation. There have been millions of them made across dozens on Peugeot, Citroen and Renault badges (and Fiat and Chery and probably some others).

They’re dead easy to rebuild, parts are super cheap and if maintained properly are robust and long lasting. The pressure regulation solenoid can give trouble, but that’s a cheap and easy fix.

The best way to kill them is run a semi synthetic Peugeot fluid and then never change it. Change the fluid (well the half charge you get when you drain it) every 40K or so with a quality full synthetic fluid and it will go for a long time.
 
Then there is the whole broader topic of commercial arrangements between automakers and oil companies. PSA and Total, Renault and ELF (now changed to Castrol), Fiat/Alfa and Petronas etc etc.

The carmakers (and the component manufacturers such as Seimans who made the AL4/DPO for PSA and Renault) will set a specification and then “recommend” the brand they have the commercial tie up with. But the spec is what you need to adhere to and even under warranty you’re not tied to a brand of oil.
 
That linked text repeats sections of the PSA material on this gearbox. I'm not arguing with you, and have quoted or illustrated from official sources. All manner of misbehaviour comes from solenoid valve faults.

But transmission repair shops don't often buy fluid from dealers, and have to source fluids that comply with manufacturers' published specs. That leaves a lot of room for discussion.

This isn't an accountants' forum or a collection of petrolheads. There are several mechanics who contribute and several more have rebuilt these transmissions. Workshop diagnosis of modern computerised cars has become expensive and it's good to have shortcuts to this from people with PSA vehicle experience.

It shouldn't be as heated as this has become.
 
persephone_pug said:
Over the last couple of weeks, I have had the above error message come up. I can feel the transmission slipping at low speed, and between 60 to 90 kph the fault comes up, and sometimes I even get a clunk mostly between 80-90 kph. If I pull over as soon as the fault comes up and switch it off and on twice it clears the fault on screen and performs ok. Also if I can get it quickly up to freeway driving at 100kph+ it doesn't miss a beat and is as smooth as silk to drive.
I just had it at the mechanics finally, as I work full time, and the only transmission code it is throwing is P1799 which is a hold switch circuit malfunction. Both my usual mechanic(that I had it at) and another transmission specialist say that is a really odd code that they haven't heard of as my model usually has solenoid problems in the transmission. The only other code it has is a P1167 which is the air/fuel sensor closest to the engine. Can anyone be of assistance? Given the above am I doing more damage by driving it? I am getting it to the transmission specialist next Saturday morning.
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At the risk of being attacked in this maelstrom I shall put in my 2 cents worth.
I am neither an accountant nor a mechanic. However I do come from a technical back ground (avionics).
I speak from personal experience but you are free to take that with a grain of salt.
I have changed the solenoids in 3 Citroen C3's. Two on spec and 1 from gearbox faults virtually identical to yours.

First up the transmission "slipping" is probably because the torque converter locking ring is not engaging or it's engaging late. Second gear in the AL4 is very "rubbery" and until the torque converter locks up it may feel like it's slipping. In fact when the torque converter locks up in second gear, that can feel like another gear change! It's quite pronounced. Of course it could be one of the brake bands slipping but you really don't want to hear that. That's a transmission rebuild! The bands could also slip because of low oil pressure on the brake band actuators from the pressure regulator solenoid failing! Either way you don't want the brake bands slipping, that will reduce the lifespan of the gearbox.
Bad gear changes at speed, "snow flake of death" and the ability to reset the condition by stopping and restarting the car are classic symptoms of the pressure modulator and torque lock-up solenoids failing (the 2 your mechanic recommend to replace).

Replacing the solenoids is fairly straight forward, however setting up the selector quadrant detente spring in the gearbox requires a bit of skill. Also the selector switch on the top of the gearbox might need to be reset (that's the 0 Ohms bit your mechanic was talking about). You should get 0 Ohms between these contacts in neutral.
SWITCH.png
The selector lever in the cabin, the multi-function switch on top of the gearbox and the selector quadrant in the gearbox all need to line up. And after pulling out the valvebody that contains the the two solenoids, It's unlikely that they will all line up again. I have also had to re-adjust the ball joint adjuster @ the multi-function switch on 2 of my C3's after removing the valve body. But some people get lucky.

You haven't said how old your car is. If the gearbox ECU firmware is earlier than #9650010680 you will need to update the firmware after installing the solenoids (you will need a LEXIA to read that).
pics 004.jpg
Firmware revisions before that will not run the "new" solenoids. The new solenoids can be identified by their black electrical connectors. If you were to pull out of your gearbox solenoids with white connectors You will need to check the firmware revision. The 9650010680 revision will run both "white" and "black" solenoids. So in this case you can replace white solenoids with black solenoids. If your car is older than 2003 it might have the white solenoids. If it's later than 2003 it it most likely has the black solenoids. Later revisions of the firmware will only run the "black" solenoids. So if you pull black solenoids out of your gearbox, no problem. Again this might be what your mechanic was talking about with the "old" and "new" solenoids?
pics 030.jpg"White" or old style solenoids.
Depending on the age of your car it might be advisable to update the engine and gearbox ECU's (they should be updated as a pair).

Gearbox oil. I shall leave this one alone as discretion is the better part of valor!

Again this is my personal experience. I know others will recommend different ways or have had different results. Your experience may differ too.
 
Hi I have replaced the 2 solonoids today. but now the engine starts and idle fine. But when i enter to revers or D the engine stops.Its try to move forward got the force and stops even before i relases the brake. I checked the manual valve twice as i done it wrong the first time. The new soloinds are onlien orderd for the correct part number.
 
Harinathm2002 said:
Hi I have replaced the 2 solonoids today. but now the engine starts and idle fine. But when i enter to revers or D the engine stops.Its try to move forward got the force and stops even before i relases the brake. I checked the manual valve twice as i done it wrong the first time. The new soloinds are onlien orderd for the correct part number.
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Not sure why the engine would stop, never had that issue, did you reconnect the VB wiring back on with a click? on the dashboard does it display the correct gear, i.e neutral in neutral and reverse in reverse?
oxVTR may know better but if the selector on top of the gearbox may need to be adjusted to read 0 ohms in neutral otherwise may be telling ECU to stop engine??

my guess is still the manual valve (selector quadrant) did you tension the blade down 1st before torqueing all the screws down but not sure why engine stops?

you really need to see what error code you have now if you believe everything is correctly set up
 
Its fleel like the clucth is enguaged and not off. A soon i enterd the gear car try to move and stops. similer to a manual car that we relase the cluch when on gear whlee pressing the brake hard. Dashboard it says correct Gear N D etc.VB wiring is the the sockect connect to the ECU ? i locked it until its purple clip go right in and tight.I had the manual valve error firt time as i didnt alighn it to the pin. closed and try once did not have any output.So I redone the whole process and alighn themanual valve and strated. I fitted the tension blade after fitting the valve body and torqued. can it be the Solonoids not working ?
 
Harinathm2002 said:
Hi I have replaced the 2 solonoids today. but now the engine starts and idle fine. But when i enter to revers or D the engine stops.Its try to move forward got the force and stops even before i relases the brake. I checked the manual valve twice as i done it wrong the first time. The new soloinds are onlien orderd for the correct part number.
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I know that one - its the lockup solenoid (one of the two you replaced) stuck on and the converter is locked even in park. Does the converter rattle at idle?

I fixed this by new solenoids and a full strip of the valve body to properly clean it out.

Did you strip and clean the valve body? If you didnt and just swapped solenoids, you may well have just contaminated and ruined the new solenoids. Gotta clean out the valve body ;)
 
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Start in P or N safety switch correctly set?

I'm a qualified mechanic (6 decades in the trade) who readily takes input & advice from accountants plus others more experienced with some of these Froggy topics, than myself.

I went the Penrite route in my 130000km Scenic & just did a 3 drains runs & refills @ temperature.
Runs just like a new car & much SMOOTHER changes, without a doubt.

Not sure why any agro stuff is needed from all/any quarters? Definitely not called for or needed.
 
RINGER said:
rt in P or N safety switch correctly set?
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Could you please advise further about it.How to check. i can move the gear lever normally,it shows correct gear on the dahboard.car stays idel on P. I culdnt check on N which ill check today.
 
persephone_pug said:
I would like you all to read the link directly from Peugeot Logic and please note the IMPORTANT REMINDER at the end
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The important reminder to support the commercial arrangement we have with that oil company despite there being dozens of other better quality fluids that meet the requirements of this gearbox.

Do you always only use the brand of tyres fitted at the factory?
 
Haakon said:
I know that one - its the lockup solenoid (one of the two you replaced) stuck on and the converter is locked even in park. Does the converter rattle at idle?

I fixed this by new solenoids and a full strip of the valve body to properly clean it out.

Did you strip and clean the valve body? If you didnt and just swapped solenoids, you may well have just contaminated and ruined the new solenoids. Gotta clean out the valve body ;)
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I culdnt check if the engine rattle on N. But P engine is fine on idle. Do you think its the new solonoids are bad, do you know which one coasu this.so i can replace with the a old one with it. i didnt clean the whole valve body just replaced the solonoids and installed back. ill take it out and clean all through and swap solonods? do you reckon?
 
Harinathm2002 said:
Could you please advise further about it.How to check. i can move the gear lever normally,it shows correct gear on the dahboard.car stays idel on P. I culdnt check on N which ill check today.
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Do you have the manuals for this? There is a procedure with a multimeter to set the position switch.

PM me your email and ill send the literature you need.
 
Harinathm2002 said:
I culdnt check if the engine rattle on N. But P engine is fine on idle. Do you think its the new solonoids are bad, do you know which one coasu this.so i can replace with the a old one with it. i didnt clean the whole valve body just replaced the solonoids and installed back. ill take it out and clean all through and swap solonods? do you reckon?
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Solenoids get stuck on due to material in them usually. There are filters inside the valve body that need cleaning as well.
 
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