405 MI16
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Thread: 405 MI16

  1. #1
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    405 MI16


    I've just puchased a 1989 405 MI16 and it's a fantastic car no dout about it, its got leather, roof, hamburger with the lot you might say, my wife loves it and it is a great road car. I have one quiery, I'm a little disapionted in its performance,its got alot of power theres no denying that but I also own two Renault Gordinis, both are 1600cc and original condition and they will eat the 405 all the way to the red line at 7000rpm, I'm a little amazed at this considering the Pug is 20 years newer and is alot more high tech, the Pug runs smoothly and I cant fault the way it runs it just doesnt go as hard as I expected does anyone have any ideas or a simple performance mod I could try.
    Thanks, David.



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    David Cavanagh

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  2. #2
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    Giday,

    Yes if you talk to Northshore Rallysport in sydney their website is http://www.esscargo.com.au they are the only ones in the country that do good peugeot performance work.

    nick

    P.S also join the GTi Club!

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  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Unfortunately Australia received the low compression engines and because of your pollution laws and re registering, I suspect there is nasty performance sucking catalytic converter. There are a number of things you can do to "release" horsepower from the current configuration. Easiest and cheapest initially would be replacing the current air box with a cone type filter. These are mounted directly infront of the airflow meter and will allow much higher air flow. More comprehensively have another exhaust system fabricated, 2 1/4 inch with a high flow muffler in the mid section and a resonator with some nice tips out the back.
    Have a look at pugspares.co.uk and the mi16 performance page for more ideas, another good site is maxpugs there in Australia, Andreas the man of the site has a fairly hot Mi16 worth looking at. Also check out ecosse-peugeot.co.uk they have some extremely hot cars.
    Best of luck, and remember spend time researching yourself, there are alot of people who will claim big and deliver little.
    Another organisation worth looking at is Skip Brown Peugeot int the Uk, he has been working on these cars more specifically the 205 from the begining.



    [This message has been edited by James (edited 16 February 2001).]
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  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger!
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    This message is posted courtesy of
    David Ian Cavanagh [french@ezenet.com.au]

    Thanks for the messeges I will certainly check out those sights, I don't know if I'm interested in modifying the Pug thow, I like it standard and reliable I just want to know how good are they ment to be. I have not looked up horsepower or performance figures yet and you are right it does have one of those perfomance sucking catalytic convertors on it.You understand my queiry, the 405 is a twin cam, 16 valve fuel injected 1.9 litre, the two Renault Gordinis are 1.6 litre pushrod, 8 valves and 20 years older, one puts out 125 hp at 6500rpm and the other 160 hp at 7200rpm and both are original from the factory, this is why I question the 405's performance.
    Regards David

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger!
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    I am of the opinion that most modern multivave OHC engines are just fancy heat converters. You are correct some of these old push rod 8v engines are WICKED. My father recently completed a Fiat 650 build up to Abarth spec. 903cc, 115hp at the wheels, 10,000 rpm WICKED !!!
    My modified XU9J2 engine (the 8v 1905cc) in the 405 I run is pushing on 200hp at the wheels !
    I reckon go lo tech ! Its cheaper, easier to fix and most of the time you can do it your self.
    The mi16 is a very comfortable car, but remember the lower spec. 405 with the 8v engine was European Car of the year 1989.

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger!
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    The mi16's which ran in touring cars were reputed to put out over 300hp. Peugeot claim 150hp for your model, this is flywheel hp. By the time it gets to the wheels not to mention through the cat. and the low comp. pistons you'd be lucky to see 95hp at the wheels.

  7. #7
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    <font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by James:
    The mi16's which ran in touring cars were reputed to put out over 300hp. Peugeot claim 150hp for your model, this is flywheel hp. By the time it gets to the wheels not to mention through the cat. and the low comp. pistons you'd be lucky to see 95hp at the wheels.
    I have a fasination for small performance engines and your fathers Fiats would be fantastic, my love of French cars leeds me to Gordini for probably the same reasons as Arbarth fans. Anyway, Aussie fuel is a problem, I'm currently running the Mi16 on optimax, which is the new high octane (about 98%) fuel from shell and Although I'm only half way through my first tank I recon I can tell a performance increase already, it feels more resonsive down low and I recon the fuel gauge is moving slower as well it seems to have more power and better fuel economy but I'll have to monitor that. Whats the fuel like in NZ?. What compression is your 405? The Fiat would be up there to, my , Gordinis, the 125HP car runs 10.25 ;1 and it runs on optimax, but the 160HP car runs 11.75:1 and it must use avgas which is a reel hassle as avgas is illeagle in road cars over here, what do you use over there?
    David Cavanagh

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  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Check the performance/modification page, I have detailed my cars specification. I haven't mentioned however I run a mix of avgas and 91 unleaded. Unleaded does not have the aromatics which boost the RON level. These new High Octane unleaded gases bung up my carbs. So its a 1 to 4 or 5 mix. Runs wicked !!

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Having owned both 150 and 160bhp models, I speak with some authority on this topic. This model should have a fairly lively top end, from 4000 till red line. If not, there a few things worth checking. After a compression check, look for air leaks, particularly around the rubber join between throttle body and manifold. Mine had started to perish. I disagree with cone type air filters. HP is affected by two air variables, volume and temperature. Fitting a cone filter will destroy one of these. I agree with the exhaust however. Upgrade to a 2.25" mandrel bent system, and check the cat while it's off. It may have self destructed and is forming a blockage down stream. Stick with original chip. I have tried them all and nothing works better overall than the original chip in the 150bhp version. If all is in order and you still want more, I suggest advancing the intake cam 4 degrees. This moves the power curve down appox. 300RPM, giving a lot more useable midrange. The intake cam is retarded 4 degrees on 150bhp models by a different pulley. This can be overcome by fitting an offset key next time you change the timing belt. It's a fairly simple procedure. Keys can be purchased from Owen Wuillemin in Sydney, ojw@kings.edu.au. Finally, don't forget to use high octane fuel. Good luck.
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    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  10. #10
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    Peter, thanks for you reply, interesting what you said about air intakes, what would you suggest, the car realy does pull very well above 4000 RPM its just getting there thats the problem, if the cat is blocked wouldn't that effect performence up top? Down low is the problem, I mean the Gordinis would be half way down the street before it hit 4000, any suggestions for that, How does the 150hp car compare with the 160?
    David Cavanagh

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  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! Andreas's Avatar
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    200bhp at the wheels, are you serious!?!?!?!
    you're a bigger prick than i thought : )

    man you've set me a big target to beat!!!
    have you done any body mods?
    if not i've got a carbon fibre rear wing on a plane from the UK now so i'm beating you there LOL

  12. #12
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    Andreas, you read the specs. If you want serious ponies from a N/A engine youre gona have to crack it open.

    The company that worked on the engine are V8 specialists the only fours they touch generally are those open wheelers that race on ovals, N/A on methanol 2.3 litres and 350 ponies !

    I didnt mention the clutch I blew after the engine rebuild, then the gear box I blew having the stronger clutch. Now I need more traction so the slippery diff has to go.

    Keep me posted, Cheers.

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  13. #13
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    The only air filter worth considering is the K&N replacement for the original air box. Unfortunately it's not available is Aus. Sounds like a typical 150hp car. It's actually only 148bhp. Sorry. I'd suggest the offset key. Especially if the belt needs replacing. It makes a big difference to the midrange, allowing easy overtaking in 5th from 100km/h, and pulls smoothly from 1250rpm in 5th. As for 160bhp model, there's no substitute for good compression and good fuel. The difference is low 8's to low 9's for 0-100km/h. The biggest handicap is weight, but it's still a great car on the open road.

    '92 205 Mi16
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  14. #14
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    If you want a K&N filter as suggested by Peter T, let me know. I can get them cheap through the distributer here !


  15. #15
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Hi David,

    just a Renault gordini??? Who are you trying to kid ;-) People he's talking about a genuine works Renault 12 gordini which there is probably less than 10 of world wide...

    The easiest way to get more accleration out of an Mi16 motor is to buy a BX16valve, same motor, much lighter (rattlier)/plasticy car. Less weight = more go... I think I'd prefer the Mi16... (even though every other car I own is Citroen).

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  16. #16
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    OK Shane, so its an exworks 12 Gordini,one of only 6 in the world, its still
    1971 tecnology and did you know that these days HQ Holdens lap Bathurst
    quicker than the GTHO did in 1971 (scarry thought eh). The other car is a stock
    17 Gordini (76 model) and that still beats the MI16. My brother (Steve) has a BX16valve and I think it is quicker than the MI16 but the Pug looks better and feels heavier on the road, it the MI16 had a hatch back and hydralic suspension it would be perfect.

    David Cavanagh

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  17. #17
    pur-john, not pew-john! peujohn's Avatar
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    Bump, just for fun!

    What happened to your Mi16 David? Did you end up finding more HP?
    John W

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    Previous: 2005 407 HDI manual sedan, 1980 504 GL, 1990 405 Mi16, 1977 504 GL Special, 1984 505 SRD Turbo



  18. #18
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Wow . 15 years old!
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    hehe, it's like finding in an old youth magazin a letter to the editor asking "am i pregnant?", whose writer is now a gynecologist

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    Classic!! LOL
    jr20516v

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  21. #21
    1000+ Posts cav91's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peujohn View Post
    Bump, just for fun!

    What happened to your Mi16 David? Did you end up finding more HP?
    This is what happened to the poor old girl. I bought it off mum. Then almost a year later and with 510,000 kms some idiot Hyundai driver did a right hand turn in front of it. :-(
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 405 MI16-1442982123990.jpg   405 MI16-1442982182396.jpg  
    2011 Renault Koleos manual petrol, yes it's boring, but not as boring as:
    2017 Renault Koleos auto

  22. #22
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    510,000km. Good wicket really

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