Ripping my hair out over my BE1 Clutch

flock

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Fellow Frogger
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Feb 14, 2014
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Brisbane, Australia
Alright, so before I take my gearbox off for the third time (different reasons each time), I'm wondering if anyone can help point me in some direction.

It has a new clutch cable, new clutch/bearing/fork. The rivets holding the nylon bush on the fork broke the first time I drove it after replacing the clutch cable, and I have since drilled and tapped screws with loctite to hold it in place. That also taught me a lesson with BE1s - don't let tension off the fork, unless you have small hands like me that can squeeze into the bell housing to relocate the release bearing in-situ.

Over the course of about 2000kms I have had to tighten the clutch cable after every drive. When its cold everything feels pretty good. On the way home, the clutch bite seems to drop lower to the floor, only for me to compensate again by tightening the adjuster. The pedal is now about an inch higher than the brake pedal and I have run out of thread on the adjuster. Selecting reverse is getting downright embarrassing - I can feel the shaft is still spinning before I inevitably have to crunch it in.
 
What setup do you have with your BE1? And what car? Is it one of those with the right angle bell crank lever bolted to the box and the pushrod to the fork? Or one of the ones where the arm is pinned to the cross shaft and that cranks the fork? I’m assuming by you talking about the bushes that it’s the later.
I had a BE3 problem once, I’d converted a late pull type BE3 to a push type BE3 clutch, but had used a late BE1 clutch shaft/fork. Turned out it didn’t support the thrust bearing correctly. Lots of shudder went through 3 clutches within about 80,000kms! Sorted by getting correct fork/shaft, and plastic bushes correct.
if you’re starting with a pedal that works and during driving it’s deteriorating, there’s free play or movement increasing somewhere, if you can find where it’s losing action, you’ll be well on the way to solving your issue.
 
As temporary fix you could put some larger nuts on the clutch cable thread at the adjuster to give you more tension, but eventually you will have to have a proper look at it. I would start by looking at the clutch cable itself. I think you are pulling the crimped (adjusting thread) off the cable slowly but surely. Have a look at the cable under the sheath see what's goin' on. If you see a section of clean, shiny cable exposed you might have found your problem.

This is assuming that everything else you have done when replacing the clutch parts was done properly.
 
Did you compare the heights of new throw out bearing with the old one you took out? Forks also can be different and fork bushes have different offsets. If you have replaced any bits best compsre them with the known working parts. Sounds like something is not right and your not getting required throw.
 
Its the standard BE1 box with the pushrod, fork and L-lever. When I pulled the fork out to screw the nylon cup/bush in place I did notice it had a slight bend, maybe from putting so much force with my foot to get the car home - I was lucky the rod didn't fall out . I bent the fork back to the same form as the one that came out. Whether the original fork was already bent the wrong way and I made things worse by straightening the new one, I don't know.

I did think about putting spacers on but considering the pedal is already way too high, it's not ideal and not really fixing the problem.

One thing I do remember is years ago the clutch kit from EAI came with a bearing whose retaining 'wings' didn't quite fit the fork fingers properly and had a dome face rather than a flat bearing surface. I had to do squeeze the fork fingers and bend the wings out to get it to fit. It was definitely BE1 clutch and bearing. This was on my old car, same gearbox. When I moved the gearbox to this car I got a brand new bearing which was identical to the one that was already fitted, but I used the same fork.

I might look into getting an inspection camera and poking it into the bellhousing to see if the fork is still engaging with the throwout bearing properly. Unfortunately I dont have any old clutch components left
 
If the fork had a slight bend it has gone past the metal yield point and will fail quickly.
Especially if bent backwards and forwards as well
The question now is why was excessive force required so as to bend the fork?
Clutch not releasing, old bolts stretched on new diaphragm?
Did you use new bolts?
Should move easily on assembly BE1
 
If you keep having to adjust the cable after each time you drive, your cable could possibly be suspect/failing. Worth checking and where it mounts to the firewall and transmission bracket.
 
Excessive force was required to engage the clutch when the nylon bush on the fork failed the first time, as you can see from these pictures I took over a year ago. Note it is the standard size pin, I just heat shrank the edges to identify it. The bend I was talking about is circled in yellow, it was barely noticeable unless comparing side by side with the old fork. It may have even just been a difference between manufacturers. Either way I don't think its the problem. Didn't use new bolts.

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I just took the following pictures from under the car. I have no reference to see if maybe the L-Lever is bent too far - every picture I see of BE1s have these L-levers with dodgy weld jobs and springs to stop the pin falling out. I must have used my series 1 L-lever as it looks different now, I'll hunt out the series 2 one. At least the nylon bush looks to have held up.

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I'll be sure to recheck the cable Craig. This issue was what prompted a new cable in the first place.
 
It’s not something silly, like the little nylon fitting where the cable sits in the bracket not being fully home? I’d be concerned at the mention of needing to put a lot of pressure on it. Is the clutch cover plate torqued to the correct setting? Are the bell housing bolts tight?... sounds Silly I know, but I had a guy calling me for advice once on a 405 and after a couple of days of him having issues that didn’t make sense I went to have a look. As soon as he pushed the clutch could see that the gearbox was being pushed away from the motor cause the bolts weren’t tight.
 
Everything looks right and I don't think the lever is bent or not significantly (or at least not enough to explain running out of adjustment on the cable). Back to my first suggestion, check the cable end (maybe both ends just to make sure it's sitting correctly at the pedal and all the way along to eliminate any other possible problem).

That said, if you had to put that much force to engage/disengage, and the cable managed to bend the fork (I still think it's not significant), I would say the cable was operating well, but the question is why did you need that much force? Something else must have been wrong.
 
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I apologise, I think I confused people as to why I had to use heaps of force to engage the clutch. It was originally when the nylon cup failed, so the fork was barely holding the release bearing. Since it wasn't properly pivoting off the ball, the rod kept coming loose like in that first photo and , thereby increasing the effort and distance needed to push the fork as it just kept coming off-center. That pedal has felt normal since fixing that last year.

That's a good point about the clutch plate angru. When I fit the pressure plate I didn't have an alignment tool on hand, so I just finger tightened the bolts so that the input shaft would self-centre, and then tightened them up with a ring spanner through the timing cover. I only used loctite on the flywheel bolts. All the gearbox bolts are still torqued to spec.
 
Ok. I’d be checking those bolts on the plate then. Important that they’re evenly torqued to around about correct setting, as that will affect the clamping force in the plate, and also will alter the angle of the diagram fingers and where the thrust bearing makes contact.
 
I need to bring the blue alignment tool over then?
 
Well I think we have found our problem, Angru!

2/6 of those pressure plate screws were quite loose and the rest could be nipped up. It took 2 rotations of the flywheel before all screws were as tight as I could go, not exactly a scientific torque but they should be equal nonetheless. I can't loctite them in-situ anyway, so hopefully she holds until the other engine is ready to go in.

Thanks everyone for their input! Feels like new again and the pedal is back to a reasonable height after taking the tensioner back a couple of threads. I am unsure as to why the tensioner is still only a couple of threads away from the crimp with a new cable, but it's doing its job. I'm just happy I don't need to take the gearbox off again.
 
Sounds like a good outcome... I’d be trying to get them as close to the specified torque as possible though, (around 18 foot pound from memory), although if it’s working and isn’t playing up they must be at least even enough. Don’t use locktite on clutch cover plate bolts anyway. If they have the correct washer and tightness they won’t come lose.
 
The method is only as dodgy as the practitioner! :p

Next time the gearbox comes off I'll probably convert it to the BE3 setup anyway which means new clutch.
 
I had a look at my BE1 and I am still not sure how you managed to get to the bolts through that window.

It is way easier to make a mandrel to center the clutch than tightening the bolts like that (even if you don't land in that heap of trouble afterwards). Remember the mandrel doesn't have to be anything special, you can cut a broomstick and make it out of wood or whatever just as long as it serves it's purpose (i.e. positions the clutch centered). I reckon it would take five minutes and 50 cents worth of sandpaper to make one.
 
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