Raising 504 front suspension questions.

Pug72

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Hi all

On one of my previous cars (505 SRDT) to raise the ride height, I had 604 springs in the rear and 40mm spacers between the front strut towers and the body. This worked well for many years, but the front camber was on its limits.

I wish to now do this to my 504, however I thought it was possible to eliminate the camber issues by installing 505 lower control arms, caster arms, sway bar and steering rack ends.
Is this correct? Is this all the parts required, or should I be also getting 505 struts too?
Thanks.
 
Would that be series 1 505, or series 2 ?
 
You can use complete struts from a later 505 diesel for the front and spacers for the rear. I had started writing "I would use complete..." but I changed it because I wouldn't raise a 504 40mm unless it was necessary; the legendary handling of the car would be seriously compromised.
 
I think you may have mis-read his post, Thanos. His previous car was a diesel. Diesel struts in a petrol 504 would be way too hard, as the diesel engine is so heavy.

I would agree about not raising it at all though. Even just putting aftermarket strut inserts in mine ruined the lovely soft suspension.
 
I think you may have mis-read his post, Thanos. His previous car was a diesel. Diesel struts in a petrol 504 would be way too hard, as the diesel engine is so heavy.

I would agree about not raising it at all though. Even just putting aftermarket strut inserts in mine ruined the lovely soft suspension.
I thought the plan was to raise it, so here is my thought process: 505 struts will give 504 around three degrees of negative camber at normal height. Using the much stiffer diesel springs (they have to accommodate the extra weight of the heavier diesel engine) will raise the car around 45mm. This would bring the camber from -3 to about -0.5 to zero. I agree that the springs would be stiffer, but this was my intention; soft springs would make the car dive during braking, excessively so in a raised car and this would make the tail want drive the car. Hence the stiffer springs. The rear has to be raised by the same amount, spacers are the most exact way to do that precisely.
 
Thanks everyone

Yes the plan is to give it a small suspension lift. 505 struts (and associated suspension arms) will be the way to go. If I use 505 diesel springs, I will need to look at custom shock inserts that are slightly longer too.

Also need to fabricate a sump guard.
 
But...why ?

You'll have a stiffer, harder ride and go to a lot of trouble to achieve that.

I put heavier-duty King springs in the rear of a 504 and regretted it.
Also (as I mentioned) I put inserts into the front of a 505, rather than repairing the lovely soft original struts and regretted it, especially after later, again driving one with the original struts.
 
Have heard of moving the spring base plate up the strut column, to get greater ride height.
 
Reduces travel though. Same shocker length for full extension but greater length for full compression.
Exactly. The best way to do it is to put a spacer between the top mount and the spring housing. We have done this for the Peking to Paris cars, 505 struts and 20 mm spacers for the right height and two degrees of negative camber. And if you want to retain the 504 ride, you can still use the 504 springs and shocks.
 
20-25mm is all I’m going to raise the front via a spacer between strut and body.

just need to buy a hole saw and will start fabricating the spacer. Then just longer m6 bolts.
 
Why raise it? Just to get a little more height on dirt roads.

Will be adding a sump guard too,
 
I am about to replace my worn shock absorbers. Standard height. Thinking of having full gas absorbers; is there any aftermarket available for it?
I am looking for a soft setup i.e. Bilstein B4, but I am not sure which part number to go with (if there's any available)
Many thanks
 
I am about to replace my worn shock absorbers. Standard height. Thinking of having full gas absorbers; is there any aftermarket available for it?
I am looking for a soft setup i.e. Bilstein B4, but I am not sure which part number to go with (if there's any available)
Many thanks
Pretty sure that B4s aren't available. The worst shocker I've ever had the misfortune to be involved with. Softer than standard and last no time at all on 405 and 205. Don't touch LIPs either. The Records on my 504 wagon are good, well priced at EAI, hopefully they have them in stock. Gas are likely to raise the car due to the soft springs, not good with standard control arms, too much positive camber.
 
I am about to replace my worn shock absorbers. Standard height. Thinking of having full gas absorbers; is there any aftermarket available for it?
I am looking for a soft setup i.e. Bilstein B4, but I am not sure which part number to go with (if there's any available)
Many thanks
A friend of mine who got 504 mentioned the other day he wants to gas absorbers as well. We'll just finish installing the set of tires from 4Wheelonline onto his Wrangler this week before we work on the 504. Hope to hear more recommendations here.
 
I fitted gas shocks to my 504 in the 80s. Believe they were De Carbon. For some reason car had been fitted with oil damped heavy duty front struts (probably Monroe) which gave a terribly harsh ride - the De Carbon's transformed the ride without any negative effects on handling (that I could detect). I used to deliberately hit pot holes for the sheer joy of not feeling them 😁.

Later had a diesel, and the guys at Alpine Motors sold me a set of Bilstein inserts for it. They had tried them on a petrol car, but had exactly the problem that Graham mentions - it sat too high. With the extra weight of the diesel engine they were just right!
 
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I found the De Carbon struts were good but the rears were hopeless, much too soft and raised the rear so the back wheels came off the ground even on fast sweeping corners. I did have a pair of decarbon rears which were too stiff, put them in someone else's car for a camping holiday, which ran them in and from then on were great. Must have been the Super Africa ones with wrong labelling, can't think of any other explanation. I never liked the De Carbons with black plastic covers in the rear of 404s, much too soft, but I have a different type with rubber boots in my 404 at present and they are perfect.
 
What year 504 are we talking? It is getting harder to get good front shocks for the early 504's (like mine - 1972). I got hold of a set of Sachs shocks when I rebuild my front suspension late last year and they give a very good ride.
 
Mine is October 1974 (series 2). I am not aware of the differences.. can someone gives a light on it?
 
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