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R8 upgrade project

brettr

Active member
So talking about stuff to do - less than 2k clicks and that pesky input shaft bearing was noisy again.

So easiest way i could think of doing it without dropping engine / fluids etc was to allow the whole lot to tilt down and then extract the gearbox while leaving the engine perched on a nice bit of 4x2.

20200927_172251.jpg


Box is still clean - as it was only out recently!
20200927_172304.jpg


And as suspected - here is the bearing. This one though only lasted <2k clicks - it has a different type of failure than the last - i got this one new from mecaparts and i am sure the inner race wasn't hardened properly. The outer race and rollers are fine - the last failure the surface was very different to this one.
20200927_190054.jpg


I've two+ spare boxes so will most likely will use a bearing from them.
 

schlitzaugen

1000+ Posts
Annoying bearing. Can't you get one from the usual suspects here? I mean, at least these are traceable quality items.

'box out every 2k km isn't fun. At least in your car it's not as difficult as in a 12.
 

Bustamif

Active member
Bearings are a problem these days. I recently did some work on a matter for a large European Manufacturer who told me they now have a very large department where all claims for credit and alleged failure are first subject to detailed analysis including electron microscope, chemical analysis and more to check if it is their product or a copy.
Around 99% of claims and returns are not their bearings but very accurate copies right down to part numbers and packaging. The materials, hardening, tolerances ets are nowhere near the quality of the real product. Scary when you think they are talking about everything up to giant stuff used in mining. Most high level race teams now have systems in place to verify the source of key components.
I recently had to track down a supplier to verify that the timing chain components included rollers from Switzerland and confirm the entities involved in the heat treating and other processes. All that detailed stuff has been in F1 and even NASCAR for quite some time.
 

brettr

Active member
Ok so i tracked down the only 17x40x16mm cylindrical roller in Australia - obviously not exactly right as it was not full complement, and no retaining circlip - but it was a FAG and the bearing guy said the FAG quality is much better than the SNR. It was $35 AUD vs $115 (plus $35) Euro from Mecaparts.

fag.jpg


So i carefully cut out the retaining cage, then machined the groove for the retaining circlip on the outer race and then assembled with the FAG rollers and made it full complement with some extra SNR rollers. They measured exactly the same at 9.9x6.5mm - and had no wear on them despite the inner race damage (which i am 100% sure was a case hardening failure).

modified.jpg


Then just spend a day reassembling the whole lot - again......

Until next year.......
 

brettr

Active member
A few items for repair / make better.

We all know aluminium is not a good wearing surface and even the 7075 in the pulley adapter was going to end up ridged fairly quickly - 11k kms it lasted before the seal expired and the surfaced was no good.
20201010_110643.jpg


So a speedi-sleeve to not only fix it but give it a proper stainless steel surface to run on.
20201010_110818.jpg


Some of this retaining compound helps it go on easier and ensures it goes no where.
20201010_110917.jpg


Then its on and ready for service with a new seal (seal 45x60x10mm from Sydney bearings open Saturday morning $7).
20201010_111649.jpg


Engraved the timing scale while there and painted it black then sand the surface off to make it all easier to see (i apologise to anyone that is an engraver and i also now have a new found respect for what you do - but its functional as such).
20201010_111828.jpg

20201010_112632.jpg


Plus while i was at it - got a new bolt for the crank pulley - (PMB open Saturday morning at StMarys and have everything!) - by the time i had it sized right it gave me maybe 3.5 more threads and makes me feels better about torque' ing it etc.
20201010_114905.jpg


Pulled a plug for the first time since it was built - the advantage of injection i can run it 15.5 / even 16:1 or higher on cruise light throttle and drop to 11's on boost.
20201009_210404.jpg
 
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JohnW

Too many posts!
Ok so i tracked down the only 17x40x16mm cylindrical roller in Australia - obviously not exactly right as it was not full complement, and no retaining circlip - but it was a FAG and the bearing guy said the FAG quality is much better than the SNR. It was $35 AUD vs $115 (plus $35) Euro from Mecaparts.

View attachment 126106

So i carefully cut out the retaining cage, then machined the groove for the retaining circlip on the outer race and then assembled with the FAG rollers and made it full complement with some extra SNR rollers. They measured exactly the same at 9.9x6.5mm - and had no wear on them despite the inner race damage (which i am 100% sure was a case hardening failure).

View attachment 126108

Then just spend a day reassembling the whole lot - again......

Until next year.......
The SNR ones only last decades so you should be fine. :)
 

brettr

Active member
So in Renault fix up mode now.

The gearshift setup was also a little vague - so made two flat bar braces and bolted to the floor front and rear. The unit ontop of the aluminium risers is a standard Nissan S13 aftermarket gearbox top shift insert - get them off ebay fairly cheap.
20201011_191311.jpg


I was finishing it with elec tape as below (i even vacuumed the floor!) - but there was no boot as such.
20201014_193654.jpg


So found this off a Suzuki Sierra gearbox - it will work well.
20201013_205018.jpg

20201013_205402.jpg



At the same time of slipping that up into the recess (and adding some locating silicone in the round corners) i installed a return spring to pull to centre 3rd / 4th gate firmly.
20201013_220431.jpg



After adjusting everything down to minimal clearance It actually feels really good now (for a Renault).
 
Last edited:

JohnW

Too many posts!
So in Renault fix up mode now.

The gearshift setup was also a little vague - so made two flat bar braces and bolted to the floor front and rear.
View attachment 126320

I was finishing it with elec tape as below (i even vacuumed the floor!) - but there was no boot as such.
View attachment 126321

So found this off a Suzuki Sierra gearbox - it will work well.
View attachment 126322
View attachment 126323


At the same time of slipping that up into the recess (and adding some locationg silicone in the round corners) i installed a return spring to pull to centre 3rd / 4th gate firmly.
View attachment 126324


After adjusting everything down to minimal clearance It actually feels really good now (for a Renault).
Are you sure it is strong enough? :ROFLMAO: Don't forget the weak point is the roll pin inside the end housing.....
 

Bustamif

Active member
The end on mine does not have a roll pin, there is a stainless/hardened bush that carries the load with a stainless pin rather than a roll pin. I have added some stainless shims to take up the side to side slack across the gate in neutral, this reduces the movement to get reverse and minimises bruising on the passengers right knee.
The weak point that sometimes fails is immediately above or below the spherical bearing on the gearstick.
I can also adjust the ratio of the lever to change the amount of movement across the gate 3rd to 4th and 2nd to 3rd. There is a bush above and below the bearing located with grub screws to fix the spherical bearing in the desired position for the preferred ratio.
TRI2E3.jpg
 
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brettr

Active member
Yes that's right the fork roll pin - never really thought of that.

When i go for fast change (about 3 seconds to complete instead of a normal 6 seconds of finding a gear) it will probably let me down...

Chris's one looks all nice - all i seem to be trying to achieve is placing the most amount of various manufacturers parts onto one car!

Last nights Midnight Garage effort was a few things that were end of life'ing for various reasons.

The alternator - was a cheaper "brand" - the clutch pulley was making a squeak so i just replaced the whole lot with a Bosch. Its for a Nissan ZD30 diesel engine...
20201014_160603.jpg


And the electric water pump - was still functioning fine but the bearings were getting noisy - 6 years old and done probably 15k's on various engines - for $140 its a quick fix - spose now i could carry it as a spare...
20201013_194557.jpg


And finish it off with a new tensioner (from a Range Rover Sport V8) and also a new drive belt but this time go to a 7PK1370 instead of 1385 which will allow the alternator to move away from the exhaust a little....
20201014_164520.jpg


The inside idler is Lexus IS250 and the outside idler is dayco 89008 so Honda Accord etc etc.
 

bowie

1000+ Posts
It is warming to hear of the various manufactured parts going into your beast. A true multicultural champion!
 

COL

Alpine A110
So anyone got ideas on why a 385 transmission (yes in the 330 cases) would get stuck in reverse?
Not real sure as I have never had any Renault transaxle get stuck in any gear, but guessing that something has broken or the selectors have jammed up some how.
 

Fireblade

Active member
I had the roll pin that holds the selector fork to the gear change shaft slip out just enough to jam up the works on an R10 some time ago. Thought it was the end of the gearbox - but turned out to be a dead easy job - remove the rear housing, engage "neutral" by hand, fit a new roll pin and bolt up the cover again.
 
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