Headers VS Manifold - Peugeot 203/403 Engine

[James Gelido]

Hi guys,

I hope everyone is keeping safe and occupied with their projects during these times. Great news that there are 0 reported infections in both NSW and VIC! French car meets will be back on the move soon I hope 🌬

Just wanted some opinions. I have had the original manifold going into a 2 1/2 Inch pipe, recently fabricated to complete my resto. Been driving around with that setup for around 8 months now. A few weeks ago, I was offered some after market headers for my car, which I agreed. Took them to the place where I had the original setup fabricated, and they told me 'truthfully', that it wasn't going to make any noticeable difference. They seemed very genuine when explaining to me, and even said 'we should be telling you to install them, more business for us'. I then decided to re- think the install.

I approached another exhaust place down my way, North Shore Performance Exhausts (Hornsby). Blokes name was Garry. A real wizard in the trade. He explained to me, what I initially thought, that each port would have its own pipe with the headers, meaning, more efficient flowing, less back pressure etc. He pointed at the centre point of the original manifold, where the "heat proof" exhaust paint I had sprayed on not too long ago, had started to peel. He explained that all 4 ports were fighting to exit through that one point, causing pressure to build and an enormous amount of heat to produce around that one bottleneck.

After that I decided to install the headers. $300 all up. After the first test drive I could feel some more power and torque in 3rd + overdrive. Although this could be a bit of a placebo affect mixed with volume enhancer, haha. Also, seems to start easier and somewhat more responsive. Not too sure about power/torque without a dyno, which is why I am here gathering some opinions ..... So please help assure me, worth it or money better spent elsewhere?

**PHOTOS OF HEADERS 203/403 ATTACHED**

 

[Steven King]

James, do you like being told "What you should have done is ..."?
I hate that ...
thanks for the photos. They look mean, are not anachronistic and if it gives you $300 bucks of pleasure, what better?
(it's not like you did something irreversible and spoiled it for posterity ... yet)

 

[James Gelido]

James, do you like being told "What you should have done is ..."?
I hate that ...
thanks for the photos. They look mean, are not anachronistic and if it gives you $300 bucks of pleasure, what better?
(it's not like you did something irreversible and spoiled it for posterity ... yet)

Fair point! haha Thanks for the optimism

No problems at all with the photos, been trying to keep busy and my mind occupied. Hope you been keeping well.

Recently had a window lifter go out on me, so converted a rear lifter (spare I had) to a front. Minor fabrication, but, all in all, was pretty straight forward. Also polished my spats with 3000 grit sandpaper and metal polish. came out really well!

 

[Steven King]

beautiful.

 

[GRAHAM WALLIS]

I fitted headers and a slightly bigger exhaust on my 403 (with 1600 cc pistons). I couldn't notice any power improvement but I think it ran a bit smoother. A rally acquaintance always fitted headers to his Volvos. He then went back to a standard manifold and gained 20hp.

 

[GRAHAM WALLIS]

$300 is extremely cheap though.

 

[James Gelido]

I fitted headers and a slightly bigger exhaust on my 403 (with 1600 cc pistons). I couldn't notice any power improvement but I think it ran a bit smoother. A rally acquaintance always fitted headers to his Volvos. He then went back to a standard manifold and gained 20hp.

Hi Graham! Long time mate, hope you're keeping well and good to hear from you It did feel slightly more torquey on 3rd and 4th, but I think thats about it. Could have just been a bit of wishful thinking. Smoother/easier start up thats for sure. I've read mixed opinions on headers, some say you lose HP, some you gain, I just think it boils down to the type of system you're switching. I think the 403's original system is quite limited in free flowing, others will argue differently I guess.

I thought its around the standard $100 an hour, about 3 hours work to fit them. Had a slight issue where headers closest to block were hitting on steering column, causing the wheel and dash to rattle like hell on high rpms and on idle, steering wheel would shake like a bowl full of jelly He was happy to fix that free of charge though, which took another hour. Assuming a bit of heating and pipe bending took place

 

[davemcbean]

Hi James.
I've got the same headers as you. Got them from Ron a couple of weeks ago. Won't have a chance to fit them for a month or two. In my previous experience with various headers, this type of header (4-2-1) is the only type which you can feel a difference on a standard engine, which I guess is why most 4 cylinders cars, manufactured since 1970, have this type of header fitted as standard equipment. The longer the headers the better (within reason) in this regard. Where you most notice the difference is how well it pulls up steep hills on the open road in 4th gear.

I have a steep hill which I often drive, near here, called Loomes' Hill on Burragorang rd. I'll let you know how I go when I test mine on this. At the moment it drops from about 60mph back to 50mph on this hill.

 

[GRAHAM WALLIS]

Hi Graham! Long time mate, hope you're keeping well and good to hear from you It did feel slightly more torquey on 3rd and 4th, but I think thats about it. Could have just been a bit of wishful thinking. Smoother/easier start up thats for sure. I've read mixed opinions on headers, some say you lose HP, some you gain, I just think it boils down to the type of system you're switching. I think the 403's original system is quite limited in free flowing, others will argue differently I guess.

I thought its around the standard $100 an hour, about 3 hours work to fit them. Had a slight issue where headers closest to block were hitting on steering column, causing the wheel and dash to rattle like hell on high rpms and on idle, steering wheel would shake like a bowl full of jelly He was happy to fix that free of charge though, which took another hour. Assuming a bit of heating and pipe bending took place

I thought that was to make them as well.

 

[Steven King]

Now, the old air cleaner - are you attached to that or is it just the throttle?

 

[davemcbean]

I thought that was to make them as well.

They were $330 to make.

 

[davemcbean]

A rally acquaintance always fitted headers to his Volvos. He then went back to a standard manifold and gained 20hp.

The Volvos have a really good cast iron 4-2-1 dual tract manifold from the mid 1960s onwards (as did Peugeots from 67 onwards). It would be pretty hard to improve upon.

 

[davemcbean]

They were $330 to make.

But he didn't make any money on this batch of headers. Any subsequent batches will be dearer!

 

[James Gelido]

Hi James.
I've got the same headers as you. Got them from Ron a couple of weeks ago. Won't have a chance to fit them for a month or two. In my previous experience with various headers, this type of header (4-2-1) is the only type which you can feel a difference on a standard engine, which I guess is why most 4 cylinders cars, manufactured since 1970, have this type of header fitted as standard equipment. The longer the headers the better (within reason) in this regard. Where you most notice the difference is how well it pulls up steep hills on the open road in 4th gear.

I have a steep hill which I often drive, near here, called Loomes' Hill on Burragorang rd. I'll let you know how I go when I test mine on this. At the moment it drops from about 60mph back to 50mph on this hill.

Hi Dave!

Thanks for that

Ron's such a champ! I didn't order them, but he just offered them, thought it would be rude not to take them Yeh, my thoughts exactly. As compared to original, obviously pre 1970, the exit points are too crammed in the manifold (4 chambers into 1 exit, direct flow). If i could give an analogy, much like the London Underground, after work, where everyone is trying to rush to the same platform at once, subsequently causing a bottleneck.

I'll give it a whirl up Dural way, have a steep bit up Newline Rd, always have to chuck her back in 2nd in order to pull up the hill.

 

[James Gelido]

The Volvos have a really good cast iron 4-2-1 dual tract manifold from the mid 1960s onwards (as did Peugeots from 67 onwards). It would be pretty hard to improve upon.

Sometimes factory is just better, the engineers who designed the motors, generally, knew what worked best. Much like the SOLEX Carbie debate. Although in the 203/403s, I feel the manifold design may have been to cut costs, rather than what works better (header v manifold)

 

[James Gelido]

Now, the old air cleaner - are you attached to that or is it just the throttle?

It's purely just to hold the throttle cable until I can be bothered to fabricate a bracket