Head re-torquing - is it necessary?

Pug72

Pug72

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Hi all

As per my previous threads, I have just replaced the cylinder head on my 504.

I torqued the head studs to 80 ft/pd in three passes. I did not use Hylomar sealant on the head gasket.

Is it now necessary to re-torque the studs after say 1000kms?

If so what is the process/sequence?

Thanks
 
1972 service book - first service between 600 and 800 miles - time requested 24 hours -subsequently every 10,000 miles head to be re-torqued and valve clearances checked. That said, there was a certain Peugeot dealer in Melbourne that never lifted the tappet cover or did much else beyond an oil and filter change in the first free service. Not that the owners or Renault knew about it.
Did it make any difference? I've no idea but the first 504 I ever saw having a head gasket job was in that workshop.
 
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My purchased new '73 Ti went in for Head Re-torque at 600miles. :)

If it were ME, I would set the torque wrench to 80ftlb and check that it clicks off at 80. (I would use the recommended sequence).

Then check the valve clearances.
 
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Did it make any difference? I've no idea but the first 504 I ever saw having a head gasket job was in that workshop
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.

In the late 80s and 90s Regans Auburn road workshop was wall to wall with 504 head gasket jobs.

And I daresay they were very profitable jobs. Since Regans always replaced the liners seals as well as the head gasket.

They also kept BGT Clutch and Brake, in Burwood Road supplied with brake and clutch reconditioning.

I fondly remember Ernie (putt-putt) and not so fondly Jeff who worked in the spare parts department opposite the Auburn Rd workshop.
 
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Six hours cold was always the requirement. Owners were encouraged to leave the car the night before.
Regans wasn't the dealer in question but I don't think it's politic to mention them. They could underquote anyone and that's why. A mate bought a Renault there and set markers on the tappet cover bolts for the first service. Of course when armed with the evidence he got a proper service. Head gaskets and liner seals were a design weakness on the 504. Peugeot were well aware of that which is why they forbade the use of coolant additives. That led to other problems.
 
robmac said:
.

In the late 80s and 90s Regans Auburn road workshop was wall to wall with 504 head gasket jobs.

And I daresay they were very profitable jobs. Since Regans always replaced the liners seals as well as the head gasket.

They also kept BGT Clutch and Brake, in Burwood Road supplied with brake and clutch reconditioning.

I fondly remember Ernie (putt-putt) and not so fondly Jeff who worked in the spare parts department opposite the Auburn Rd workshop.
Click to expand...

Robmac,
What the hell were Regans doing. Replacing liner seals at every head job ? Not necessary if the manual was adhered to and the liners were retained with the correct tool. Talk about overkill!! Very profitable, jeez I'll say !

Psst. The State Service Manager should have got onto that straight away.:mad:
 
I was told that they had a high incidence of recalls for leaking liners after head gasket replacement. So the decided to go belt and braces.

With the mechanics they employed I can't see any deficit in skills.

Peugeot wasn't paying the bill for out of warranty stuff.

At that time many vehicles would have neoprene liner seals. And even lifting the head had potential for disturbing them.
 
Andrew, what brand of gasket did you use ? Did it appear to be softish and slightly pliable, or hard, stiff and twangy ? The monotorque ones are hard....

My sense of logic would say that as you tightened the bolts to more than the manual states, that you should not have to re-tighten them for at least 1,000 Ks.
 
A 1958 model 203 from Sth Africa went into Regans with a leaking head gasket at 30,000 miles and they pulled the motor down. Wondered why.
 
Ok so looks like the consensus is to re-torque the bolts at 1000kms

Do I slacken off one bolt and retighten to 80 ft/pd again (as I did originally) or do I go to 85 ft/pd?

This will be done with the car cold and in the sequence in the haynes manual.

Beano, the head gasket brand was Sasic which I purchase as part of an engine gasket kit from EAI
 
Pug72 said:
Ok so looks like the consensus is to re-torque the bolts at 1000kms

Do I slacken off one bolt and retighten to 80 ft/pd again (as I did originally) or do I go to 85 ft/pd?

This will be done with the car cold and in the sequence in the haynes manual.

Beano, the head gasket brand was Sasic which I purchase as part of an engine gasket kit from EAI
Click to expand...

Pug,
As it seems you have chosen to "march to your own drum" regarding re-torquing to 80 ft/pounds per sq", I would slacken off slightly one bolt at a time in sequence. If an attempt is made to simply re-torque at your original figure the reading will be incorrect for reasons that have been discussed in previous posts.
 
"If an attempt is made to simply re-torque at your original figure the reading will be incorrect for reasons that have been discussed in previous posts."

This is important.
 
Don't go up to 85 ft/lbs....that's a hell of a lot of torque !

I put two head gaskets on a 504 once (due to it being too thin from being surface ground too many times, thus causing pinging) and on the advice of an old guy did it up to 90 ft/lbs. I don't think the bolts / threads would have taken much more.

I can't remember if Sasic is a hard or soft head gasket...
 
robmac said:
.

In the late 80s and 90s Regans Auburn road workshop was wall to wall with 504 head gasket jobs.

And I daresay they were very profitable jobs. Since Regans always replaced the liners seals as well as the head gasket.

They also kept BGT Clutch and Brake, in Burwood Road supplied with brake and clutch reconditioning.

I fondly remember Ernie (putt-putt) and not so fondly Jeff who worked in the spare parts department opposite the Auburn Rd workshop.
Click to expand...

Yes I remember those days. Lots of workshops were doing liner seals because they couldn't take the risk.

We use to have a production line going of 504 engines, couldn't build them quick enough, we were selling 2 or 3 a week. all the C/O engine were all the same, headgaskets and liner seals gone.
 
There was an interesting court case in London in 1975. An owner sued Peugeot for the cost of repair of a corroded 504 head because the car had not used anti-corrosive coolant. The Peugeot representative admitted they only used water in the cars because of the delicate nature of the liner seals. The 2 litre 504 engine was a problem because it really needed a larger engine block. The head gasket did not tolerate overheating but the fact the radiators were only filled with water without a service requirement meant it became likely after about five years. Fitting air conditioners only made the matter worse. I replaced a number of head gaskets on mine and others over the years.
 
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