Captur 2018 1.2

[tazfrog]

Greeting Froggers....can some one enlighten me as tot eh correct plug size
and spanner to use in removing the plugs from the Captur 1.2 Ltr Turbo engine please.
I seem to have difficulty in getting any of my plug sockets to fit....methinks the socket walls may be too thick
and looking down said 'ole with torch, there seems to be very little clearance between plug
and plug recess....any help will most appreciated. ;o))

 

[Aln]

The hex size is 14mm, and so not a standard size. I expect one could be ordered through a tool store, but I doubt it would be in stock. In NGK it is a ILKAR7J7G which is an iridium plug that generally has very long life.

 

[tazfrog]

Thanks Allan...I knew what the plug type was but wasn't sure about the hex size.
As you say, not a normal size....so, it would be 14mm across the flats?

 

[Aln]

Yes 14mm across the flats.

 

[tazfrog]

Yes 14mm across the flats.

Thanks for confirming Allan...now I need a thin wall socket....
motorcycle shops would be the go I reckon....have seen a few on line as well.
There is not much clearance between the hex and the cyl. head.

 

[COL]

Thanks for confirming Allan...now I need a thin wall socket....
motorcycle shops would be the go I reckon....have seen a few on line as well.
There is not much clearance between the hex and the cyl. head.

A 14mm tube spanner maybe the go if you can get one long enough.

 

[tazfrog]

A 14mm tube spanner maybe the go if you can get one long enough.

Thanks Col....I'll have a dig around my collection.
My wife's car suffers a lot of short distance start stopping in the last 16,000klm
and the plugs seem to get a bit of a hard time in these direct injected engines.
The last dealer service back in February, they changed the plugs and the guy
showed them to me....they didn't look too good at all and I'm seriously thinking of fitting
NGK Iridiums to get a bit better service life.

 

[Aln]

On the NGK website the only plug mentioned is the iridium one, so I believed these were the standard plug for your motor. I run NGK iridiums in almost everything I own. I have been very happy with the life and performance. On the RS265 I am successfully using the standard heat range iridiums in it, even though it is somewhat modified with more boost and such, and on E85 fuel. I did have to close up the gaps, but other than that they work fine.
On my old magneto bikes, which don't develop very good spark at low rpm (kick start), I find the iridiums improve the low speed running and resist fouling well with the fine tips they are fitted with. Given the modern fuel injection on your car, I expect the very lean mixtures could bring up problems of their own.

 

[Kim Luck]

Thanks Col....I'll have a dig around my collection.
My wife's car suffers a lot of short distance start stopping in the last 16,000klm
and the plugs seem to get a bit of a hard time in these direct injected engines.
The last dealer service back in February, they changed the plugs and the guy
showed them to me....they didn't look too good at all and I'm seriously thinking of fitting
NGK Iridiums to get a bit better service life.

I wonder if your plug problems aren't similar to DPF problems in diesels that are used continuously in short trip environments, with the engine hardly ever getting to it's proper operating temperature. The DPF problem is fixed by a run at the speed limit (or better) or up a windy incline for 30 or 40 km. I would be inclined to try that on a regular basis to see if things "went better with (no) coke"?

 

[tazfrog]

On the NGK website the only plug mentioned is the iridium one, so I believed these were the standard plug for your motor. I run NGK iridiums in almost everything I own. I have been very happy with the life and performance. On the RS265 I am successfully using the standard heat range iridiums in it, even though it is somewhat modified with more boost and such, and on E85 fuel. I did have to close up the gaps, but other than that they work fine.
On my old magneto bikes, which don't develop very good spark at low rpm (kick start), I find the iridiums improve the low speed running and resist fouling well with the fine tips they are fitted with. Given the modern fuel injection on your car, I expect the very lean mixtures could bring up problems of their own.

Alan...I agree about the Iridiums...the Captur was fitted with what looks like platinum plugs of some indeterminatemodel stamped Renault.
I have used Iridiums in everything from Moto Guzzi, H-D, Norton, Peugeot, Volvo, Jaguar....since thet were first introduced over 25 years ago.
We steer away from 'E' fuels and stick with Caltax Vortex 95

 

[tazfrog]

I wonder if your plug problems aren't similar to DPF problems in diesels that are used continuously in short trip environments, with the engine hardly ever getting to it's proper operating temperature. The DPF problem is fixed by a run at the speed limit (or better) or up a windy incline for 30 or 40 km. I would be inclined to try that on a regular basis to see if things "went better with (no) coke"?

I wonder if your plug problems aren't similar to DPF problems in diesels that are used continuously in short trip environments, with the engine hardly ever getting to it's proper operating temperature. The DPF problem is fixed by a run at the speed limit (or better) or up a windy incline for 30 or 40 km. I would be inclined to try that on a regular basis to see if things "went better with (no) coke"?

Kim...I would say it would be very similar.
Direct injection engines of several marques have discovered other problems
relating to clogging up inlet manifolds....Subaru are apparently very susceptible to this malady.
We give the Renault a good 160klm run at least once a fortnight and it definitely runs better.
At least the plugs are easily accessible with the removal of only one pipe sitting across plug four ;o)

 

[Aln]

We steer away from 'E' fuels and stick with Caltex Vortex 95

The E85 is 85% Ethanol and 15% 98. Certainly not available everywhere, and you use about 20-25% more than with 98, but it does have 107 octane, and works really well in turbo cars. On the Lakeside track I average 68l/100Klm, almost 2L per lap. On the road a little better.

I have used the E10 94 and 95 octane fuel in my "ordinary" cars with no ill effects over many years, but not in my bikes or "special" cars, with all getting 98.

 

[tazfrog]

The E85 is 85% Ethanol and 15% 98. Certainly not available everywhere, and you use about 20-25% more than with 98, but it does have 107 octane, and works really well in turbo cars. On the Lakeside track I average 68l/100Klm, almost 2L per lap. On the road a little better.

I have used the E10 94 and 95 octane fuel in my "ordinary" cars with no ill effects over many years, but not in my bikes or "special" cars, with all getting 98.

Interesting....E85 is unavailable here in Tassie....closest 'hot rod' fuel is BP 98.

 

[harrisonati]

The E85 is 85% Ethanol and 15% 98. Certainly not available everywhere, and you use about 20-25% more than with 98, but it does have 107 octane, and works really well in turbo cars. On the Lakeside track I average 68l/100Klm, almost 2L per lap. On the road a little better.

I have used the E10 94 and 95 octane fuel in my "ordinary" cars with no ill effects over many years, but not in my bikes or "special" cars, with all getting 98.

I'm a bit surprised by Alan's fuel consumption at Lakeside. My standard RSM 230 R26 used about 25 l/100km at Lakeside and about 30 l/100km at either of the QR short circuits. I know that his RSM265 probably has 100+ more horsepower and also that ethanol has lower calorific value, carries it's own oxygen which allows you to run richer and all that, but 68 l/100km seems very high. Does anybody else have experience with E85?

 

[Kim Luck]

I'm a bit surprised by Alan's fuel consumption at Lakeside. My standard RSM 230 R26 used about 25 l/100km at Lakeside and about 30 l/100km at either of the QR short circuits. I know that his RSM265 probably has 100+ more horsepower and also that ethanol has lower calorific value, carries it's own oxygen which allows you to run richer and all that, but 68 l/100km seems very high. Does anybody else have experience with E85?

68 l/100km = 4.15 mpg for those old enough to remember. I know that the works Gordinis were using as much fuel as V8 competitors in the Victorian desert rallies, around 8 mpg or 35.3 l /100 km.

 

[jo proffi]

I'm a bit surprised by Alan's fuel consumption at Lakeside. My standard RSM 230 R26 used about 25 l/100km at Lakeside and about 30 l/100km at either of the QR short circuits. I know that his RSM265 probably has 100+ more horsepower and also that ethanol has lower calorific value, carries it's own oxygen which allows you to run richer and all that, but 68 l/100km seems very high. Does anybody else have experience with E85?

Yes,

I ran it in a NA 2.2 douvrin motor as a trial, and simply lowered the rev limiter to a point when the duty cycle of the injectors At stoic was close to max.
The tail pipe looked nice, and the exhaust smelled cool, but the experiment was called off for two reasons.
1, I spilled a bit on the paintwork when filling up, with the acrylic paint ending up on the ground.
The primary reason for immediately haulting the experiment though, was that the amount of ‘sump snot’ that was fouling up the oil breather catch can was unbelievable.
It was a fresh motor, fresh rings etc and getting up to temp quickly, but still, unbelievable amounts of peanut butter coloured crap was being formed.
I understand an old NA motor was never going to see great gains, but I wasn’t expecting the outcome I saw.

Jo

 

[Aln]

I'm a bit surprised by Alan's fuel consumption at Lakeside. My standard RSM 230 R26 used about 25 l/100km at Lakeside and about 30 l/100km at either of the QR short circuits. I know that his RSM265 probably has 100+ more horsepower and also that ethanol has lower calorific value, carries it's own oxygen which allows you to run richer and all that, but 68 l/100km seems very high. Does anybody else have experience with E85?

On your Economy Run, not trying particularly hard, I got about 9.5L /100km. At Lakeside, twice I have driven to the event from Ipswich with a full tank, done approx 110Klm at the track day, put 40L of fuel in at the track, and when I left Lakeside for home, I had a bit over a quarter of tank, around 20L left.

I have done those two track days on the same oil, and it has now done 9500 Klm since the last change. Now at 35K. Oil level has not dropped or risen, with no mayo in the oil filler cap, and the oil looks like it went in last week. Early on I was a little worried about fuel dilution, but it doesn't seem to be an issue. Spark plugs look good, although colouration with the E85 is more subdued, and are the standard NGK 7 range Iridiums, which I have closed up the gaps to 25 thou, as I was having some misfire issues under boost. 295Hp at the wheels, at 21 PSI.

I have now gone somewhat off topic. Back to finding a 14mm plug spanner.

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[harrisonati]

Sorry to continue 'off topic'. On the 2019 Economy Run, also not trying very hard, my R26 recorded 7.36L/100km. I don't know what power at the wheels the R26 would have recorded, but I doubt if it would have been within 100 hp of your RSM265.
Back on topic, I've recently changed plugs in my Megane 2 sedan. My normal plug socket wouldn't fit into the 'plug shaft', but I found a reasonably conventional socket that did, without resorting to a tube spanner.
I changed plugs according to the Renault nominated 60,000km interval and was surprised to find that the previous plugs were non-iridium and had lasted that long. I replaced them with NGK iridium plugs.

 

[Aln]

After looking at the plastic fuel containers I use, it was actually closer to 25 L each, so 50 litres added at the track. I expect on E85 I would use approx 25% more in normal conditions, but on the track it does seem extreme.

Back to the spark plugs, I was thinking my modern bike was idling and not starting as well as it had been, and so went to look at the plugs to find they were only standard NGKs from new, and at 30000klms they were not at their best. The bike does 5000rpm at 100 kph, and are on a wasted spark system, so spark twice as often as they need to so they do more work than in most cars. I fitted NGK Iridiums and have just recently changed them after another 40k. They were working fine, ijust thought it was a reasonable thing to do.

 

[tazfrog]

Right lads....an update on the Captur plug issue.
I have procured a 14mm thin wall socket from the motorcycle place off Flea-Bay
and it works very well.
Removed all plugs including No.4 which is hidden under a large hose
that looks to be part of the turbo-inter-cooler system.
Involves unravelling the hose clamp, remove three nuts from triangle bracket
holding a couple of vac pipes, move to one side, un-clip all COP leads, remove 8mm
screws retaining the coils, pull out giving a slight twist which exposes the plugs.
Plug socket is fitted to a 250mm extension and 3/8 drive ratchet to undo plugs.
The socket has a very neat little rubber insert which firmly grips the plug for easy removal.
These plugs have only been fitted since Feb. this year and have covered 8,000klm
but they soot up easily and the threads were dirty.
After a good clean up on wire wheel, I set the gaps to 1.2mm, applied some nickel ant-seize
to half the thread depth to 180 deg..
Screw in plugs hand tight and torque to 20 Nm.
Use a cotton bud to apply a little di-electric grease around the opening of the coil pack
to prevent sticking to plug ceramic, place back on plugs firmly and replace 8mm screws
and the pipe work after replacing coil connectors....job done.
Considering how this car is used, it will be necessary to cut in half the factory recommended
plug service life.
I also use NULON Complete Fuel System Cleaner every fourth tank full to keep injectors clear
as these get a harder life being direct injected engine.