C5 Aisin Warner 6 speed automatic

Hi Guys,

Just to confuse the issue, this is the oils Citroen sells for the AM6 gearbox as follows:

2.0 HDI, 2.7 HDI, 3.0 EFI, part no 9730AF (29.44 Euro per litre in France)

2.2 HDI, 3.0 HDI, part no 9734R7 (37.10 Euro per litre France)

Evidently, oils aren't oils?

Best regards,

Greg
 
Thanks for those comments. IIRC, the flush was going to be a lot more expensive.

It is just for preventative maintenance. There are no current issues with shifting. It has been known to flare into 2nd, but I felt that that was more to do with how I was treating the accelerator then with the box itself. Accelerate differently, it shifts differently.

I sometimes use it in manual, esp when towing a box trailer of several hundred kg, and I wonder if this places undue stress on the gearbox, even though the manual says it can take up to 1.5t braked.
 
Since prev post, about an hour, have done some reading up on this bollocky subject. More I read, more confused I get!

It seems that people have been contributing to similar threads for years, since 2008 when the gearbox was first used in this car.

It is used in many other common vehicles, and ALL the other makers say to change the fluid every 30 000 miles. In such a deliberate attempt at planned obsolescence, it is only sealed for the life of the warranty, not the life of the gearbox. How this can be legal in this day and age of consumer protection is beyond comprehension.

Adding to the confusion is this double drain plug - do you undo both? Is there any resetting of metrics? One site said this:
"every time the oil is changed the "oil counter" MUST be reset - the box is adaptive and needs to know about such things as it makes a huge difference."

One other site had a spew that people were using S/S or F/S oils, reckoned that the specs say it should be mineral.

How have DIYers refilled it - with a long hose? How slowly? Do you have to run it first after to replenish all the galleries etc?

This is the first auto I have ever owned, in 40 years of driving.
 
Filling a transmission is made easier by one of these trans funnel.png

The instructions are in the link I posted (the car in the pics has a 6 cyl engine). You measure what is drained, so you know how much to put back. A full drain in one go isn't going to happen. The original fluid is made for Aisin and sold through dealers - each manufacturer who uses the box (PSA, Volvo, Toyota, etc) sets a different price, with wild variations. In some markets abroad like USA they sell the Aisin brand. Some AFers use a local brand Penrite product, some don't.

You can also read the official Cit handbook for the 2008 C6 at http://service.citroen.com/dtt/CDP/donnees/fr_FR/2008_C6/2008_C6.zip from p144.

If you don't read French, online translators will make a reasonable hash of it.
 
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That is the most comprehensive instructions I have seen, along with the often seen other one:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fjzkad6g7icp68g/AM6 Oil Change Instructions in English copy.pdf?dl=0

So you have to have at least the right tools, figure out the difference between 3308 and 3309, a diag box to measure the oil temp in the first place, as well as being able to access underneath with the vehicle level, accurately measure the output as well as the input, and possibly reset the oil usage counter.

Bugger that, off to the auto trans specialist.
 
I've just put the Lexia (official Citroen) instructions up for draining & refilling the AM6 (for my 2007 C5 Hdi) on Dropbox - can somebody tell me if this link works for them?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/r58hzmgsb...level : automatic gearbox (type AM6).pdf?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/r58hzmgsbqgq6p0/C5%20II%20-%20B2CI14P0%20-%20Draining%20-%20filling%20-%20level%20%3A%20automatic%20gearbox%20%28type%20AM6%29.pdf

On the second link I've tried dropping off the '?dl+0' at the end of the link if that makes it easier for some to download...I don't understand this link stuff.

Cheerio,

Geoff
 
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Electroboy,

It views and downloads for me but I do have another dropbox account. It even accords with my experience having done it a couple of times on the C5X7. The only bit it misses is what you have to remove to get access to the drain and fill points. I must get my diagbox and reset the oil counter to see if it makes any difference.

Cheers, Ken W
 
Electroboy, I get crap javascript spoiling it.
It downloads successfully with wget --no-check-certificate but needs the trailing ?dl=0 removed.
 
Thanks Ken. Dropbox tells me the file should also be visible to those who don't have Dropbox installed - we'll see!

Re: resetting the oil counter to zero. I didn't reset mine the first time I changed the oil and I don't believe it made any difference when I did get around to resetting it a week or two later. I find it hard to believe the behaviour of the gearbox would be significantly changed as a result. I reckon it's there for maintenance scheduling more than anything.

Geoff
 
seasink said:
Electroboy, I get crap javascript spoiling it.
It downloads successfully with wget --no-check-certificate but needs the trailing ?dl=0 removed.
Click to expand...

Jeepers Seasink, that's all Dutch to me! Do you mean I should edit my message and remove the ?dl=0 from end of the link?


Geoff
 
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wget is an internet standard downloader. It will get the file complete provided it is asked not to check the site certificate, which cannot be verified, ie do an insecure download. Other downloaders like curl give the same warning. The pdf file arrives ok with or without the trailing suffix. On my secured browsers however, the file only partly displays at download - a result of the javascript.
 
One thing I noticed with this AM6 (Aisin AW TF80SC) gearbox is that when a bit worn, gear changes were still perfect before it gets up to full temperature (around 80º-81º in my car). Before replacing the valve block, I briefly considered fitting a remote oil cooler using this adapter to run the box cooler and forestall the inevitable. Now my box is working beautifully - but I am still thinking about it as a future addition:

Remote cooler adapter Aisin TF60SN TF61SN TF70SC TF80SC TF81SC AW50-55SN JATCO | eBay

As I understand it, some cars use a remote oil cooler (Volvo IIRC) with this gearbox as standard equipment. I reckon it's bound to help with longevity, makes a full 'flush' type fluid change easier too since hoses can be easily accessed.

Thoughts?
 
electroboy said:
I've just put the Lexia (official Citroen) instructions up for draining & refilling the AM6 (for my 2007 C5 Hdi) on Dropbox - can somebody tell me if this link works for them?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/r58hzmgsb...level : automatic gearbox (type AM6).pdf?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/r58hzmgsbqgq6p0/C5%20II%20-%20B2CI14P0%20-%20Draining%20-%20filling%20-%20level%20%3A%20automatic%20gearbox%20%28type%20AM6%29.pdf

On the second link I've tried dropping off the '?dl+0' at the end of the link if that makes it easier for some to download...I don't understand this link stuff.

Cheerio,

Geoff
Click to expand...

Works for me without problems Geoff. I only have latest Firefox. No Adobe, No drop what its. Cheers.
 
A cheap funnel, selected length of 20mm clear fuel hose, a plastic hose joiner [going into the gearbox end] and a couple of spring on hose clips, all ex Bunnings, about $8. Works for full flow filling. Cheers.
 
Nothing wrong with that, but my purpose made transmission funnel cost even less.
 
You might be interested in this thread over in Pug-land:
http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/peugeot-forum/127899-407-coupe-engine-gearbox-fault.html

There are certainly repair options with this gearbox and these will assist in understanding it:
Sonnax Adjusting Clutch Control Valves on Aisin FWD 6-Speeds
Sonnax Aisin AW Linear Solenoids
There's plenty more on this gearbox at the Sonnax website.

Each owner can decide whether they try a repair to the existing valve block or just replace the entire assembly.
 
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fritzelhund said:
I would like to share an experience with others.

The C5 ( a 2 litre diesel ) at 7 years of age and 65000 ks had begun to deliver inconsistent 2nd to 3rd up changes, that were very dependent on throttle setting, but I still couldn't drive around it so off to EUROSERVE ( in Brisbane ) it went.

Fresh genuine oil in the gearbox ( I don't know if this box has a filter ) , and no doubt a chat with Lexia, and all is back to what it was or even better than it has ever been. It now readily sings through changes and is more likely to pick up 6th on a 90 km/h motorway. Genuine oil was charged at approx $18 a litre and it needed 7.5 litres.

The exercise was well worth the effort.
Click to expand...


Fresh genuine oil in the gearbox? Are you sure it was genuine Citroen oil?? The dealer in Perth wants about $2,000 for 5 litres. There seems to be a great debate about what you canuse and what you can't. I have experienced an occasional surge between gear changes if I accelerate very hard to overtake something, and I fear it only started after I replaced the original oil in the gearbox with Penrite FS at 65,000kms by the local garage. Sort of holding my breath and hoping. It's only happened twice now since the agents re-calibrated the gearbox computer .
 
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