AL4 issues

[oror494]

Opening this again - terribly sorry everyone!

As far as AL4's go, this one is as good as they get, smooth shifting, no limp mode BUT the 2007 C4 with only 70k on the clock is having this same issue as the OP.. delay engaging first.

After being driven for about 30-45 minutes, regardless of speed and conditions, engaging first gear won't engage straight away with about a 3 second delay, this is followed by a loud thud and large kick from the gearbox. When accelerating again before the gearbox has been able to engage first, it'll roll as if it is essentially in neutral.. slowing down to engage reverse also has the same effect as I believe 1st and R share the same solenoids. Like the OP, no mechanic has been able to reproduce the problem (god damn it). Through it's life the box has had transmission oil 24 monthly with the proper AL4 PSA oil.

So this problems (on my mothers car) has apparently been an issue for about 18 months now, at first on and off. I originally thought it may be the lower solenoids, unlike the third gear solenoids, but that doesn't seem right. After reading here I suspect it may be the multifunction switch or speed sensor on the actual transmission.

IS there a conclusion for whats causing this issue? ie parts wise (please don't be $$$ frenchy)

the problem in your AL4 is the 2 sealing rings at the end cover part number 2215.15
if you will continue to drive it in this condition and every time it will get hot and the 1st won't engage you will brake the F3 Brake bend

 

[dukbilt1]

Update:

Antipollution fault comes from the catalytic converter --> quoted $1250 ...

Oil leak comes from the oil filter housing --> quoted $300...

Now looking for another car on gumtree, avoiding as much as possible car dealers...
Always bought privately in France (4 cars)--> never had real issues with cars, except maintenance and age
Bought one at a dealer in Australia --> spent $1000 in the first 5 months of ownership (oil leak and another oil leak).
Bought two privately in Australia--> just need to change the original battery (7 years old) for one and battery+fuel pump for the second one (23 years old)
Bought this one at a dealer --> transmission, brake, oil leak, catalytic converter...
I never had any oil leak in France in 16 years and nearly 400 000 km...and now in Australia 3 oil leaks in 2 years and 70 000 km...

No more dealer for me, and it will most probably be Toyota, Nissan or Mazda... Peugeot are good, but spare part are by far too expensive to take the risk to buy an old one here, and I can't afford a new one.

Khman,

what model is your car?

The oil filter leak may just be the oil filter cover not fitted properly...


Ewan

 

[dimistyle]

Ewan new OP Louisb posts 36 and 38 with a different issue.

Khman sold his Pug and bought another brand.

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[dcc236]

It's not that many kilometres, so the transmission should be OK with respect to simple wear.

I'd suggest the basic procedure to follow, would still be the same as for commonly reported faults. I am presuming the car has received all software updates due to it, and the engine itself is not recording any faults.

First try three replacements of the fluid, maybe a fortnight between each change.
If no success, you would replace the upper two solenoids with new items.
Should there still be no change, a replacement valve body is next, these are cheapest bought from overseas.
Last option is the most invasive and costly - repair of the transmission unit.

Are the solenoid and valve body replacements DIY'able or should an automatic specialist be used? I have never worked on an auto gearbox before.

Where is the best/cheapest place to source the parts required?

 

[dimistyle]

With the correct tools, oil and instructions it can be done at home. Information on AF or web if searched. Pm me your email address and I can send you a pdf which has been distributed all over the web. Other than torx and 8mm square drive no other special tools just time. Look up ATX on Alibaba. Michelle has been my contact.

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[Louisb]

Sorry for the delayed reponse -

So I had the output speed sensor on the transmission replaced last week at the yearly service, i'm thinking it might be too soon to say but car seems to be driving SO much better, it hasn't dropped into limp mode at all, it seems to be shifting much smoother like a warm knife in butter apart from when cold, much more responsive with gear changes (never used drop gears or climb gears like it does now) at the right time.

Many issues on this this car has currently stem an absolute shoddy service undertaken at a supposedly 'French car mechanics' in Melbourne in 2013.. Previous to this I never had any issues with this car. The car was (over)filled with a semi-synthetic 15w40 instead of the usual 5w40/30 from dealers and other specialists causing some pretty bad idling and poor start up behaviour, AL4 transmission was filled with Renaultmatic D3 syn instead of the proper semi-synth PSA stuff - this meant the car to go into limp mode the for the first time the day after the service and all the poor behaviour relating to the gearbox and lockup since the change. On top of this the fuel strainer/filter on top of the tank under the rear seat came off completely after being changed and let out all the fuel resulting in the RACV calling fire brigade to clean up the roads.. leading to it's first breakdown. Oh, and I was spoken too like an imbecile by the mechanics in which they suggested a week later that i'll need a fuel system and solenoids replaced, by them. At the time the car was 5 years old and had less then 40k on the clock.

My regular pug dealer changed the trans fluid, changed the oil and checked over everything a week later.

I'll keep this forum updated on how the transmission goes under some more driving, after years of hopeless gearshifts, limp modes and no lockup i'm hoping it's now finally fixed - and all it took was an cheap output speed sensor.

 

[Louisb]

Thanks mate - will watch what happens with the new speed sensor, this'll be the next change on the transmission.

As for the three ATF flushes to get the Renaultmatic crap out, these were done a week after the incident.

 

[Louisb]

Few months has passed since replacing the output speed sensor and the issues are still remaining..

After driving for about 40 minutes or so, coming to a stop and downshifting into first is followed by a (few second) delay/slipping which then sends a thunk through the cabin when first engages.

1: since 2012, it's been maybe four times a year the transmission drops into 'limp mode'. It's a 2006 build car and i've been trying to avoid changing solenoids.

Does anyone know when PSA began fitting AL4's with the updated solenoids?

2: regarding the AL4, before I change these parts; what exactly do the 'sealing rings at the end cover part number 2215.15' do?

3: Any other ideas that could be causing the issues above?

Thanks

 

[dimistyle]

Dont open the end cover as this opens a world of pain for the home DIY unskilled.
If the end cover is to be opened the clutches should be replaced at the same time.
There is a french car auto mechanics on the forum in Melb see if you can track Tony down.

The 2215.15 are installed in the later model AL4 with the later valve block. They are just seal differences with less pressure loss due to overlapping seals. No one knows why the change or if any shifting difference can be achieved.


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[Frenchiemech34]

If u have to buy an auto 307 petrol. Make sure u get the ZF 4HP20 4 speed and not the AL4 as it’s extremely reliable compared to the AL4.

Or buy an aisin 6 speed auto and never really have an issue if u change gear oil every 60km.

Tim - Citroën Peugeot dealer master technician *

 

[dmccurtayne]

What are you on about 307 never had a 4hp 20 and a al4 apart from valves are not that unreliable cheaper to replace a couple of valves than a full valve body in a AM6 for the DIY guys.
Come on Timmy


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