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205GTI Non PAS Steering

neilc

Member
I have read on this forum that the non PAS GTi has 3.9 turns lock to lock. Am I right to assume that from the position where the front wheels are pointing straight ahead then then it would be approximately 1.95 turns to full lock in either direction?
 

GRAHAM WALLIS

VIP Sponsor
Yes, I have never been able to work out why the GTi is renowned for its steering. Even the PAS GTi has 3.3 turns. The Si is 2.75, much better and Citroen got it right with the Xsara VTS, 2.5. Apart from its appearance from some angles the VTS is a much better car than the GTi6.
 

neilc

Member
My steering at present has 1.4 to the right and 1.9 to the left from the centre steering straight position. How do I fix it?
 

GRAHAM WALLIS

VIP Sponsor
Lengthen the steering arm on one side and shorten on the other. It makes a huge difference having the rack centered. If it is off centre the car will oversteer one way and understeer the other.
 

neilc

Member
So would the process be, set the front wheels straight, remove the track rod ends both sides, turn the steering wheel until the rack is equal on both sides and the adjust the track rod ends to connect to the wheels. Centre the steering wheel on the column
 

GRAHAM WALLIS

VIP Sponsor
Yes, that should work. I usually work out which way the adjusters have to go, change by half a turn or so on both sides then test again. Easy to get confused though.
 

neilc

Member
Graham I seem to only have 3.3 lock to lock even allowing for inaccuracies on my part, the only steering rack close is a 3.3 pad used in uk
What have you found with your involvement with Peugeot’s here?
 

schlitzaugen

1000+ Posts
I would suggest you measure rather accurately how long the exposed sections of the rods (nut to nut) are on both sides before you undo anything. After changing setup you need to have the same total length (right+left) otherwise you have just messed up your alignment.

That said, and considering it should be 3.9 turns lock to lock (unless you know someone changed the rack) perhaps it is worth checking the wheel doesn't hit something that stops the wheel short of full lock before you start undoing anything on the steering.
 

neilc

Member
While I thought the drop links might have been restricting movement but not the case. I removed the rubber boots off the steering rack and measured how much rack extended out of the steering box, I measured 120mm each side.

I measured the length of the tie rod rack ends and got 330mm which is correct I think.

I wondered if I set the steering with equal lengths of rack out out the steering box and then adjust the tie rods until the wheels are parallel would that help.

Having said that the total turns lock to lock does not equal lock to lock is 3.3 not 3.9.
Before I change anything I intend looking at the steering in another Gigi I have in the yard and do some measurements

ANY. OMMENTS
 

neilc

Member
I have since disconnected the tie rods from the hubs and then turned the steering wheel right and left I have 1.4 turns to the right and 1.9 to the left

the steering rack on another gti I have has the number 9431236021 the one on the car with the problem is 7941103629. is anyone able to tell me the turns lock to lock for each of the serial numbers quoted

thanks
 

neilc

Member
I removed the new inner tie rods I fitted I noticed that weren’t alike one had grooves around bottom (313mm) the other has a flat washer machined into the rack end (317mm). Not sure whether this would be causing a problem listed above
Photos attached I hope
Comments please
 

schlitzaugen

1000+ Posts
If I am getting this right, with nothing attached to the steering rack you still have unequal movement about the centre of the rack. I think you've done pretty much everything now. Sounds like you need to take the rack apart and have a look. Shot in the dark (I have no idea about this, but this is what I would hope) it may be that the rack is the wrong way around (if that is even a possibility at all). That would be the least problematic, else something more nefarious might be going on.
 

BIGRR

1000+ Posts
Just went out and tried my power assisted 205 (93 model): 1.5 left, 1.5 right!

I would suggest that a non-power assisted 205 with a low number of turns lock to lock would require "BIG" muscles to drive. Too big for me! :)
 

neilc

Member
I have put the original tie rods back on centred the steering wheel getting 3.4 lock to lock and 1.7 in each direction the odd tie rod shown above Img 3941 was accentuating the problem
Plan is now to get another tie to replace the odd one and then get a wheel alignment
 

schlitzaugen

1000+ Posts
Alright, so the odd tie rod was going further in enough that it restricted travel at the end a bit. In the picture it doesn't show much different from the original one, but that's the way with pictures.

Now going by the numbers listed before, it seems you have a PAS rack?

I have only once tried this, but you could get the wheel alignment lose enough with strings and what have you. Mine was not that successful and the car was wandering dangerously but I didn't have a flat and horizontal surface to work on and a flat and vertical surface to reference against plus zero experience. Good enough to get to the service station.

Today I would use wheel jacks and a moveable screen on a wind free day.
 

neilc

Member
I will reassemble and get near right at home once I have a replacement tie rod then organise a wheel alignment

thanks to all that commented
 
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