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Thread: 205 sad?

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default 205 sad?

    Can anyone tell me if the device pictured on this 205 engine is the supplementary air device? The last 205 I owned didn't have any of this stuff, as a race car, and my Haynes is in another State. IIt's a long time since I laid hands on a standard 205.

    The (presumably) air hose from it terminates on the underside of the throttle body, next to the distributor vacuum line - it can be seen enclosed in one of those corrugated sleeves. And yes, the hose clamp is missing a bolt.

    The other air line which is connected to the T-piece is blanked off. Where does it usually go, and what, if any, will be the effect of blanking it off?

    If this is, indeed, the S.A.D., where does it take its input air from? It appears not to be from the filtered inlet air, as I have removed all the trunking, and there seems to be nothing superfluous, and nothing missing.

    Thanks,

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    Tim
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 205 sad?-p1040052.jpg   205 sad?-p1040053.jpg   205 sad?-p1040054.jpg   205 sad?-p1040055.jpg  

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    Fellow Frogger! James504's Avatar
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    Young fella, didn't have a s.a.d on the 504 and the 403. What you have taken a photo of is the coolant bleed screw (well it used to be before someone put a hose on it and blocked it off) and the coolant outlet to the throttle body. I guess race car's don't have coolant bleed screws.

    This is what you want to look for.
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    Thanks Dad. Yeah, that's what they look like - I remember now. I guess I haven't found it yet. It's very busy in there, and I would prefer not to have to remove the distributor...............

    It remains a mystery where the device takes its air supply from, and, now, where it feeds the throttle body. I guess when I find it all will be revealed.

    Interesting that the hose which feeds coolant to the throttle body has an effective hose clamp at neither end. Guess I'm not running much pressure in the cooling system.

    Tim

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    sans witticism SLC206's Avatar
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    Perhaps this may help?

    SAD
    Regards,

    Simon

    2018 308 GTi 2011 DS3 DSport
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by SLC206 View Post
    Perhaps this may help?

    SAD
    Hell, Simon, the first 375 search results seem to deal with unhappiness, generally . No mention of "Seasonal Affective Disorder" at all. No joy, in other words.

    Tim

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    "Young fella"? And Sunshine Coast now Tim? Is this a grey nomad thing?

    The SAD picks up air from the 90 deg. bend between TB and AFM. Then dumps in into the underneath of the inlet manifold. It's a pain in the arse to replace the hose(s). The SAD has a heater element which warms up over time (a few minutes) slowly closing off the air extra bypass air. So be patient when trying to test with 12V. You can adjust the amount it open/closes by fiddling with the screw setting.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  7. #7
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    Thanks Peter. I'm just trying to get this thing to idle from a cold start. It is OK once warmed up, but not cold. Can I dispense with the SAD, or is this essential for cold idle?

    I have eliminated the temp sensor as the problem. Disconnecting the stepper motor was inconclusive. Now to the SAD............

    Anyone wants to call me "young fella", I'll cop it sweet. Sunshine Coast is a house-sit for a mate for a year or two - our place in Pyrmont is let for the foreseeable. Gotta live somewhere.

    Tim

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    Tim,

    Check that the vacumn advance module on the dizzy is not stuffed. These die and people fiddle with the adjustments to comensate for the vacumn leak that the failed module causes.

    Just put a vac hose on the vac adavnce and suck on it.

    Worth a shot but may not be the issue.

    Let me know if you want a SAD. Have a few lying around.

    Best way to access it is by taking the battery out. It lives underneath the water distribution block under the dizzy.

    Do away with the hoses that feed water to the throttle body. It is just a loop to stop the throttle icing up.. Just connect the hose from the header tank straight to the head . One less place for the coolant to leak.
    Adrian Wuillemin

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    Thanks Adrian. Like I said, it's been a while. This car of Chris's is not a bad thing, but has a few little issues that turn it into a hobby. I had forgotten how well they drive. Why on earth do people want to modify them, unless to race 'em? Must have a lot of spare driving ability.......

    Tim

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    Thanks Adrian. Like I said, it's been a while. This car of Chris's is not a bad thing, but has a few little issues that turn it into a hobby. I had forgotten how well they drive. Why on earth do people want to modify them, unless to race 'em? Must have a lot of spare driving ability.......

    Tim
    Or perhaps your driving ability is limited....
    2006 Peugeot 206 Xt
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    Quote Originally Posted by James504 View Post
    Or perhaps your driving ability is limited....
    That must be it. Perhaps when I grow up I will become as skilled as those of whom I am in awe on here - the ones who speak of such esoterica as "left-foot-braking" , "flat changing", and "finding the limit". Wow!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    That must be it. Perhaps when I grow up I will become as skilled as those of whom I am in awe on here - the ones who speak of such esoterica as "left-foot-braking" , "flat changing", and "finding the limit". Wow!
    It's the only way to drive!

    I suspect in some cases the modifications come about as the only 205 GTis they've driven have tired suspension etc, and don't know what they're like when in good condition.
    2005 Renaultsport Clio 182 Cup
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    That must be it. Perhaps when I grow up I will become as skilled as those of whom I am in awe on here - the ones who speak of such esoterica as "left-foot-braking" , "flat changing", and "finding the limit". Wow!
    One day Grasshopper, one day .......
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    Why on earth do people want to modify them, unless to race 'em?
    Reliability?

    (runs away)

    2005 Renault Clio Sport 182 Cup
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    Quote Originally Posted by four_plus_two View Post
    Reliability?

    (runs away)
    This is not an idiotic suggestion at all, but has nothing at all to do with why most of the dudes modify their 205s. That has more to do with the fact that they are now cheap and fairly disposable.

    Modifying for reliability includes suggestions such as Adrian's above, re disconnecting the coolant loop from the throttle body - unnecessary in most Australian environments. As A says, it's just another potential coolant leak.

    Fitting after-market management allows you to get rid of a lot of superfluous hoses related to the L-Jet management, which are potential sources of air leaks.

    Getting rid of the distributor in favour of some sort of solid-state ignition has obvious benefits.

    However, none of these is particularly compelling. As I am currently discovering, there is nothing much wrong with L-Jet - you just have to be very thorough about tracing the leaks and fixing them, and rigorous about maintenance. These cars are now old, and a lot of the regular maintenance which would have been scheduled when they were new has been let go for a long time now. A typical maintenance schedule for a 205 these days would be a couple of oil changes a year, an oil filter once a year, an air filter when you think of it, and brake pads when they wear out. Other than that, after it overheats and roots the engine, have a whine on AF, and fit a second hand donk if you can afford it. Sound about right?

    Fitting a 16 valve engine with 250,000 km won't do much for reliability though.

    Tim

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    Fellow Frogger! four_plus_two's Avatar
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    V. true! I feel these days a lot of the parts are harder to come by - and all engines and parts have a dedicated lifespan - so putting in a 'new' engine removes some of the problem points and updates the car with modern technology.

    But yes, I do see what you mean - when early Series cars can be picked up for around $1k, they can either be driven for 12 months and fall to bits, or be fully rebuilt and/or restored. I would imagine a proper rebuilt 205 for either race or daily use would be $10k+ if you factor in replacement or rebuilt engine, rebuilt or upgraded suspension, good tyres, brakes, gearbox, and that's if you start with a really good condition shell that doesn't need a respray or panel replacements. And ... unlike the UK we can't draw on a massive pool of wrecked 205s!

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    Tim, two other 'failure points' I've found on the XU.

    The wire running from the base of the dizzy to the coil gets soaked in oil and the plastic rots away, leaving the wires underneath exposed. As they wear out the spark signal gets weaker and leads to intermittent starting and running problems. Have a look at the wire - if it's anything like mine, it will be hanging on by a strand. Easy fix with a soldering iron and some crimp connectors.

    re: the S.A.D, Graham W posted on here a while back he ran his car fine without it - just needs a few revs in the morning to stop it from stalling before getting up to temp. I never tried disconnecting it on the cars I've had, they all idled OK. The throttle position sensor usually fails intermittently too - I think I have a spare one around if you need to test it (actually, I have most of the bits off a S1 engine, minus the block and gearbox - including a high comp S3 8v head that PeterT built a few years back and I never got a chance to put more than 1,000km on).

    2005 Renault Clio Sport 182 Cup
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