need suggestions for lowering my car...
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  1. #1
    TT
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    need suggestions for lowering my car...

    hey all...

    being a complete newbie when it comes to tech stuff about cars... i still want to lower my 206 coz i cant stand looking at the huge gap (esp at the rear end) between the wheels and the arch.... also to improve a bit of cornering stability at high speed.... evil evil

    but from what i've read in the forum... it comes with a lot of problems later on with the mod.. disappro
    so if anyone was to recommand anything... what would be a good spring / shock combination?? what would be a once off mod that dont require replacements of other parts every so often n is still reasonable in price?? 8_ball
    will only changing the 2 front spring n play around with the rear spring (like they do at Esscargo)do the job??

    thanks...

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger!
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    i remember i wanted to do the same to my 306, i remember being told and reading that eibach designs their springs so they can be used with the standard shocks, i don't know what problems can arise down the track though. The reason why i dind't lower my car was my habit of driving into pot holes instead of avoiding them :p

  3. #3
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    my mother lowered her 206 GTi and she is more than happy with it
    the operation isn't as painfull as it sounds
    more time than anything else
    she got lowered front springs and a stiffer rear torsion bar re-set to sit the rear end down
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  4. #4
    TT
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    pugsly...

    i dun tend to aviod pot holes also... usually i am so close to the cars infront i dont get to see them b4 i hit them.. i guess i better re-think about lowering the car....

    pugrambo.....

    where did your mum had her car lowered?? there was no prob with it since she had it lowered??how long has it been n how much did it cost??

    thanks...

  5. #5
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    You 'Pug' guys are strange sorts...

    Everyone knows lowering cars is as easy as moving the lever beside your seat :p :p tongue approve

    <small>[ 18 April 2002, 05:18 PM: Message edited by: DoubleChevron ]</small>
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  6. #6
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    Right on, Shane!

    The bloke who taught me how to fix cars back in the late 60's even put a couple of extra notches in the guide for the lever, so that he could "fine tune" the ride height on his 1962 ID!

    Sounds like pugrambo has one groovy mother though!

    Cheers

    Rod

    <small>[ 18 April 2002, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: Rod Hagen ]</small>
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  7. #7
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    TT:
    pugsly...

    i dun tend to aviod pot holes also... usually i am so close to the cars infront i dont get to see them b4 i hit them.. i guess i better re-think about lowering the car....

    thanks...
    Maybe you had better simply rethink your driving style TT. Nothing more stupid, stupid, stupid, than tailgating on a regular road. Ask any real racing driver and you will get the same answer!

    Some people are clearly just dumb. Trouble is they cost the rest of us big dollars in insurance premiums and pain.

    Get a life.

    Cheers

    Rod

    (PS - hey guys - don't you love the sound a 505 wagon tow bar makes when it penetrates the nose of one of those Hyundai's or Toyota's. Never met a Peugeot driver silly enough to stick his or her nostrils so far up my tail pipe, but if anyone knows TT's rego number.....I'd be happy to check out the impact sound on a gti 6!

    A good mate of mine had his original condition DS wiped out by one of these brain dead bum bandits in a BMW a while back. I've suffered a couple of G's damage in my own DSpecial too. You might expect it of some brain dead tootsie in a Celica, but you would think anyone with brains to buy a Peugeot would have more sense.)

    <small>[ 18 April 2002, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: Rod Hagen ]</small>
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  8. #8
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    H&R springs is a bit like Eibach (can be adapted to existing shocks)

    it really depends on the $$$$ that you want to spend. If you've got $$$, then a set of H&R or Eibach with Konis adjustable shocks would be a perfect match.

    if you have lots and lots of $$$$, then you may be able to source a set of height-adjustable springs & shocks set from UK. (these are the one that you can adjust the height of your car by using a spanner)

    also check-out Hi-op engineering (located at Artarmon), they specialised in euro rides as well.

    As to where to get it done, here are some of the places where you can go and get a quote or ask arround:

    1) Esscargo Artarmon
    2) Hi-op engineering Artarmon
    3) Australia Best tyre services Lakemba
    4) Pedders suspensions (check yellow pages)

    I will think H&R and Eibach will be the best choices for the 206 as these 2 companies have done r & d on their springs to adapt to the existing shocks.

    the only problems that you will get from lowering is from excessive lowering........anything lower than 1 - 1.5inches can be classify as excessive and they should only be done by changing the shocks to match the new spring rates....... otherwise your car will be hopping on the road like a Kangaroo and your suspension will be finished within months.

    a 30mm (3/4 to 1 inch) drop will be ideal if using existing shocks.

    Also, you may want to check with your insurance company as to their limitation on lowering....... in my memory, NRMA will only allow a 1/2 to 3/4 inches drops. AAMI don't have any restriction as long as you notify them and its complied with RTA.

    I am thinking to lower my 206 as well but probably i will wait until i put in some new 16in or 17in alloys.

  9. #9
    TT
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    lol at Rod's reaction.....

    though it might sound like I drive stupid.. but not as stupid as u might think ... ok.. so i do drive a bit crazy sometimes.. but that's from the envy i get from a lot pugs (esp 306s...)who used to do the same thing to me back when i was driving a honda... seeing them come all the way up my ass and was able to swing away at the very last mins... envy~~~~~~~~~~~~ so please pay more attention on road and realise its not just me who drives a pug like that..
    okok.. i apoligise for giving pug drivers a bad name.. but i will be looking out for a 505 for sure now..... dead dead dead

    wilsonson......

    thanks for that info......... i will look more into it b4 i do anything.... afterall... driving around in western suburbs with all the pot holes...

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    Yeah yeah yeah, TT. Dumb drivers always have dumb excuses.

    I guess the three kids in the borrowed Lambourghini that flipped at 180kph on Mona Vale Road a few years back and landed on top of my father''s second wife , who was sitting in a traffic jam going the other way, would have had something similar to say, if they had lived to tell the tale. (No doubt they would have loved being the lead story on Channel 9 news if they had known about it)

    Trouble is, I've seen the misery and loneliness that her death caused my father for year , after year, after year, after year.

    Cheers

    Rod
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  11. #11
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    I have Eibach springs on my S16. These are about 30mm lower. It is a firm ride, but very controlled and grips like hell. NO body roll either.

    Yet I think you really need to get a good set of tyres to make the springs worth while.

    I recently changed my struts. I looked at Koni and Bilstien, but after carefull consideration and advise from various ppl in the know I stuck with the OEM's.

    Apparently the Bils are WAY to stiff for road use and the Koni's were not supposed to be all that better and not worth the extra 70% in price. Their only saving grace was the 3 year warranty.

    I am using the money I saved to replace all front bushes which IMHO together with the new struts will make ALOT more difference then replacing the struts alone.
    B to the R to the A from the D
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  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger!
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    As usual, Phasis's advice is spot on...

    Phasis, care to tell me how much the bushes were when you get them?

  13. #13
    TT
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    phasis....

    thanx for that... yeah.. i was told that Eibach does a pretty good job just today by a friend...
    probably the best value for $$$ anyways...

    cant wait to get it done~~

    cheers.......

  14. #14
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    i don't know how much it cost her to have it done
    i do know that she had it done by her dealer at moss vale and they got the springs and torsion bar from the UK and they were part of the SP kit that you can get through peugeot for the car
    she hasn't had any trouble at all with the car since she has had it lowered
    she has also put a different rear wing on it as well since then
    even after she lowered the car the 206 still doesn't appear to look as low and mean as my 306 GTi-6
    her next step is to put a good flowing muffler on it
    just goes to show you are never too old to mod your car
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger! Andreas's Avatar
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    just dont fit coilovers on a road car...trust me, it hurts!

    Andreas

  16. #16
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    ntrx - I have had 2 different stories about the bushes.

    Firstly from a supplier in Brisbane, they are $89 a side for 3 bushes, I would say 2 inner and one outer lower control arm,

    Secondly, that only 2 can be replaces becasue one of them you ned to replace the whole lower control arm which will cost around $4-500...think not.

    Will look into it some more though becasue I am hopeing it will make the ride a bit more compliant but with the same grip and responsiveness. I guess I am trying for a lost casue becasue my benchmark is Dad's 318is BMW which trully is a magnificant chassie
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  17. #17
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Guys,

    I'm just wondering, why do your 'Pugs' need the suspension components even looked at, aren't they only 2-4year old cars

    I'm thinking my ID might need some grease put into some of it's ball joints, other than that the wear is very acceptable. But hey, I guess it is only 40years old :p

    The prices quoted appear way over the top to me as well, that's more than I pay for most of my cars I'm probably just a really tight bas$#rd....

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    PS: Ya know what happens when people tailgate me??? Ever seen a shiny new Semi doing 30km/h on freeway eek! eek! That's what happens when they catch me (when I'm doing 120km/h+) and tailgate me millimeters off my towbar. Trust me this is NO exageration. It really did happen disappro
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  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Phasis - I bent my RHS lower control arm, it was replaced with a new unit from Peugeot for $190.

    $4-500 is not on!

  19. #19
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    I have 2 legitimate reasons (in my mind) for replaceing the suspension components.
    1. I bought the car with 100,000kms on the clock. I want to experience the car the way it was when new.
    2. I have no idea how hard the car was driven before I had it and I know I drive it like it should be, therefore I expect more wear then normal. Also, the lowered springs will undoubtably put more stress on the components.
    B to the R to the A from the D
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  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger! Jez 405's Avatar
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    DoubleChevron:
    Ya know what happens when people tailgate me??? Ever seen a shiny new Semi doing 30km/h on freeway eek! eek! That's what happens when they catch me (when I'm doing 120km/h+) and tailgate me millimeters off my towbar. Trust me this is NO exageration. It really did happen disappro
    I'm not usually like this, but I really wasn't in the mood for it that night....
    Fellow P-plater in NA Fairlane sitting on my rear bumper. I switch on the rear fogs - he remains.
    Traffic stopped at a light in the middle of Box-Hill central, up ahead...I speed up slightly, and at the last minute, swerve to avoid a stopped Toy Landcruiser.
    Fairline.....screeeeeeeech..... BAM!
    Lots of people turn a look.

    I know, it was wrong and stupid.....
    He tailgaited me on the wrong day.
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  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger!
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    If you realy must lower any car I would sugest only doing so by 1/2 an inch (13mm). Any more than this it becomes difficult to set the correct camber and caster angles. Uprated bushings are great for improving suspension control; but can be at the expense of NVH. Remember Peugeot are the only car maker that produces its own shockabsorbers (suspension dampers), they do a lot of research into spring rates and damper rates so change these and results are likely to be less than pleasing. Springs are springs imported high ticket items are no beter than locally produced items (try king springs) spring rate and ride height are the really important factors. Finaly dont cut or heat original items (some people do)or allow some dickhead at the local tyre service to try to dail-in more camber or caster this will mess up the turn in and steering feel. In short fit springs with 13mm lower ride height and same spring rate, renew any worn bushes with genuine items, have dampers checked and replace (in pairs only) with genuine items if required.
    Quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten!

  22. #22
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    Jez 405:
    I'm not usually like this, but I really wasn't in the mood for it that night....
    Fellow P-plater in NA Fairlane sitting on my rear bumper. I switch on the rear fogs - he remains.
    Traffic stopped at a light in the middle of Box-Hill central, up ahead...I speed up slightly, and at the last minute, swerve to avoid a stopped Toy Landcruiser.
    Fairline.....screeeeeeeech..... BAM!
    Lots of people turn a look.

    I know, it was wrong and stupid.....
    He tailgaited me on the wrong day.</strong>[/QUOTE]

    The "rear fog light" approach to getting rid of tailgaters is a good one but it seems to work best with people who have simply been badly taught , and don't understand the need for space (mind you, that accounts for about two thirds of the driving population) .

    Super agro Ayrton Senna wannabee twits probably get so used to it that they simply disregard any red lights on the rear of your car altogether.

    Finding a nice gravely bit of road verge to pull off on to works up to a point for the ones with shiny new cars, but not for the older ones.

    Jez's swerve approach is promising but a bit extreme for most circumstances, and could have deleterious consequences if you get your timing wrong.

    Shane's is the right way to go, but can be annoying if you are in a hurry.

    Any other novel approaches (short of fitting a rear facing Maxim gun) to get rid of these tailgating pests? ( around 2/3rds of all accidents, I gather, are now rear end shunts) I've got vague ideas of fitting a cheap remote controlled camera on the tailgate (with flash perhaps) .

    Cheers

    Rod

    <small>[ 21 April 2002, 11:07 AM: Message edited by: Rod Hagen ]</small>
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  23. #23
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    [/qb][/QUOTE]I'm not usually like this, but I really wasn't in the mood for it that night....
    Fellow P-plater in NA Fairlane sitting on my rear bumper. I switch on the rear fogs - he remains.
    Traffic stopped at a light in the middle of Box-Hill central, up ahead...I speed up slightly, and at the last minute, swerve to avoid a stopped Toy Landcruiser.
    Fairline.....screeeeeeeech..... BAM!
    Lots of people turn a look.
    QB][/QUOTE]

    Good one! I hope the guy learnt his lesson.

    Dave
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  24. #24
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    DoubleChevron:
    Ya know what happens when people tailgate me??? Ever seen a shiny new Semi doing 30km/h on freeway eek! eek! That's what happens when they catch me (when I'm doing 120km/h+) and tailgate me millimeters off my towbar. Trust me this is NO exageration. It really did happen disappro
    Yeah, I've made a few tailgating semis change down through 10 gears or so in a 100 zone, then I speed off. I really don't know how those guys expect to stop umpteen tonnes of metal when the vehicle in front has to stop suddenly. I guess some of them don't care about whether they run over the vehicle in front or not.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
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    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger! Jez 405's Avatar
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    [quote]Rod Hagen:

    Any other novel approaches (short of fitting a rear facing Maxim gun) to get rid of these tailgating pests? ( around 2/3rds of all accidents, I gather, are now rear end shunts) I've got vague ideas of fitting a cheap remote controlled camera on the tailgate (with flash perhaps) .

    Cheers

    Rod
    If you have a 504GLD or similar, how about shifiting it down a gear or two - instant smoke screen! evil It's also quick way to find yourself on the EPA's top 10 most wanted list.
    1987 Peugeot 205 GTI S1
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