Lowering/altering fuegos
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Lowering/altering fuegos

    Hi guys,

    further to my earlier posts on lowering fuegos(for racing only- not road use!), I ran into a guy the other day who mentioned another way of lowering them.(other than changing the spring or cutting them)

    The top (A?)arm where the stut/shock bolts too, is redrilled as low as possible- down about 2cm (you have to heat the steel around it and bend the 'lip' down, to get an even go at it for drilling the 'new' hole. Then drill the hole, and move the strut mounting point down, he tells me the movement of 2cm equates to about 1.5 inches lower ride height....being twin-skinned it should be safe enough.. This combined with one coil off the springs should offer enough of a drop to make it handle better- lower C.O.G,improve it's looks, without losing all the travel (and making it illegally low)like you do with 2 coils out(so I have found)...

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    Can anyone see any flaws with this type of mod? question

    Another one is instead of modifying the bottom ball joint (like on my R17) for extra camber- by grinding off the original small plate that the ball joint attaches too and welding another on further out...

    Simply move the top ball joint further in (by slotting it)as it isn't load bearing like the bottom ball joint- therefore inherently stronger?
    Also allows you to alter the camber as and when you see fit- not much point in going beyond 1.5-2 degrees is there?, as I'll never be running slicks, just high performance road rubber...

    Thoughts/suggestions? head_ban

    Cheers Ben

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    I have seen R25 bottom arms and brakes fitted giving heaps of negative camber and bigger brakes to match. 14" wheels will fit over the calipers.
    Alan.
    '56 Renault 4CV (16TS Power)
    '62 Renault Dauphine Gordini
    '82 Renault Fuego GTX
    '89 Renault Alpine GTA V6 Turbo
    '02 and '03 Renault Clios 1.4L
    '13 Renault Megane RS265 Trophee+

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    I have seen R25 bottom arms and brakes fitted giving heaps of negative camber and bigger brakes to match. 14" wheels will fit over the calipers.
    Alan.
    '56 Renault 4CV (16TS Power)
    '62 Renault Dauphine Gordini
    '82 Renault Fuego GTX
    '89 Renault Alpine GTA V6 Turbo
    '02 and '03 Renault Clios 1.4L
    '13 Renault Megane RS265 Trophee+

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts Haakon's Avatar
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    Another way of lowering the front a bit is to simply trim some length off the thread on the bottom of the shock where it screws into the upper arm mounting pivot. As standard, theres is atleast a centimetre of thread visible - screw it all the way in and you have a drop of least twwo centimetres...
    I tried to drown my sorrows in alcohol, but the bastards learnt how to swim

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Thanks for that Alan, but me thinks it'll be easier/cheaper to use fuego bits an pieces than R25 (Besides I think I'd have to weld some bits to make the r25 A arms fit)beyond my skills and tool collection at present....

    Haakon, yeah that had occurred to me before, so with this plus the 'shift' of the shock locating point, it should be (quite a bit!)lower and if need be, give me some adjustability- both up and down... approve

    Something else- in another post- I think it was either Haakon or Simon who mentioned that if you lowered a fuego too much the rear trailing? arms worked in the opposite manner they are supposed to?

    Not sure if I have got that right, but on a race car as ride/comfort isn't really an issue, if you still have travel, and handling is good, then how low is too low(on the rears)? mallet

  6. #6
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Renault17:
    Not sure if I have got that right, but on a race car as ride/comfort isn't really an issue, if you still have travel, and handling is good, then how low is too low(on the rears)? mallet
    I don't know about the beam axle rear suspension of a Fuego, but with wishbones, etc, the car is too low when the theoretical roll centre is below ground level, which makes the handling unpredictable. Actually you have to make sure it's a bit higher than ground level, to allow for suspension travel factors while braking, cornering, etc. A roll centre of about 75mm above ground level is a good thing to aim for.

    Dave
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  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Hey thanks Dave,

    so is there a relatively easy way of calcuating the roll centre? It will be used for hill climbs and such, so some travel is definitely required....

    Is the roll centre calculated for the whole car- or front and rears seperately?

    Cheers Ben

  8. #8
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Renault17:
    Hey thanks Dave,

    so is there a relatively easy way of calcuating the roll centre? It will be used for hill climbs and such, so some travel is definitely required....

    Is the roll centre calculated for the whole car- or front and rears seperately?

    Cheers Ben
    Ben,

    You calculate the front and rears separately, and the line between them is the roll axis. Depending on which is the higher, you get understeer or oversteer. On the EL Falcon they lowered the rear roll centre to reduce oversteer, by moving the Watt's linkage mount on the diff downwards.

    The method of calculating the roll centres varies depening on the type of suspension used. I have seen it in motor vehicle engineering textbooks, but you might be able to find it on the net.

    Also, many of Carroll Smith's books on setting up race cars will cover it. He's one of the engineers who tamed the Ford GT40 in the mid-1960's. I met him a couple of years ago at a university racing car engineering competition, and he certainly knows his stuff.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
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    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  9. #9
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    mistareno's Avatar
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    I am in the process of installing a set of SPAX coilovers to the front of my Fuego. They are about 1 inch shorter than a standard shocker (compressed) and are still a frazle longer than standard at droop. There fore I can safetly lower the car and still have plenty of suspension travel. An added bonus, and one of the main reasons I am going to all the trouble is that the spring will now be rubber isolated bottom (at the bottom eye bush) and top (shocker stlye bush) Hopefully this isolation will reduce some of the "crashing" and road vibration that Fuego's (and all renaults of that era) expeirience. The dampers have 28 stages of damping adjustment and about 2 inches of threaded height adjustment.
    I hope it wil be done for All French Day.

    <small>[ 14 February 2003, 12:44 PM: Message edited by: mistareno ]</small>

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Hey Mistareno,

    Just out of interest, what did it cost you for the spax, any chance of a pic of them?

    What other changes are you making to the car- swaybars, camber etc etc. Keen to hear or see any progress- is yours the (silver/white) machine on your webpage front page?

    Cheers Ben

  11. #11
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    Renault 17,
    When they are fitted, I will take some photos of the shocks in and out of the car. I will also detail any problems with the install and how much it all cost (and what improvement it made).

    P.S: Yes that is my fuego on the front page of the site (and in the gallery)

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