307HDi Boost Gauge 2004
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  1. #1
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    Default 307HDi Boost Gauge 2004

    Hi everyone,
    Was thinking of putting a boost gauge on to check levels while driving.

    Any ideas where to plumb in the signal?

    I believe these cars come with a garrett t15 turbo. Are these plain bearing or ball bearing??

    What is the factory boost level?

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    i may be wrong and ill soon find out if the froggy site is workin as usual but i think on a deisel
    t urbo it would be a wate of time.
    they are usually for people to read max boost on their turbo assisted petrol motors.
    in that case the turbo is for extra oomph.
    the turbo in the deisel[if im right] helps a normally low speed deisel engine acheive what a normel petrol engine would around town in normal driving conditions.
    deisels are usually a high torque low revving motor thats used for strength not top end power.
    they usually dont pick up speed very well.
    this is why they put them in the hdi's
    most new deisel trucks have both turbo and superchergers.
    the supercherger helps it get off and running quicker and the turbo keeps the power up once they acheive a certain speed.
    am i right or am i gonaa get shot down in flames here.
    other froggers please----
    BAZZ[or maybe i shopuldnt sign this.]

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    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    baz, i see there is method to your madness so no flames for you.... ha.
    But to answer the thread i would take a reading from just before the throttle body. It would work but not necesarily help our HDi friend as Im sure the ECU has a safety cut out when the boost gets too hi anyway. - Chris
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    Thanks for your input but, I'm sure petrol & diesel turbo's work the same way. Its just the rev's that it happens at. I think the hdi max boost is about 9psi. It makes max torque around 2000 revs. I would like a gauge to test its making the correct boost level & also to check over a very long time that it is still making the correct boost, as it does when its new.


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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    baz, i see there is method to your madness so no flames for you.... ha.
    But to answer the thread i would take a reading from just before the throttle body. It would work but not necesarily help our HDi friend as Im sure the ECU has a safety cut out when the boost gets too hi anyway. - Chris
    Hi,
    Throttle body??? where is it? Turbos on the back next to the firewall. Might be all to hard

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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpi
    What is the factory boost level?
    If it's the old 66kW engine (DW10TD), it's apparently 1.0 BAR/14.7PSI according to the press release that Peugeot AU handed out at launch.

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    Yeah, thats the one, 1 bar thats sounds right. Now where to connect it???

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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpi
    Hi,
    Throttle body??? where is it? Turbos on the back next to the firewall. Might be all to hard
    Hi, Lumpi
    I hate to sound negative but if you cant locate the trottle body on your own then installing a boost guage by your self probably isn't a DIY thing.
    I don't mean to sound discouraging or nasty in any way but I'd hate to hear you damage your car or hurt yourself in the process.

    But to answer your question, i'm very sure the throttle on your 307 will be attached to your intake plenum. To see it remove what plastic covers are in the way and have some one press on the gas pedal open/close, whilst you look for something moving in the engine bay. This shoud move a lever which should open the throttle (you wont see the throttle open but you should see the cable move). Next is to find something to connect the air line and make it leak free, any air that is underpressure is dangerous and you don't wan't it going anywere except in your engine anyway. Then that air line goes into your boost guage... follow its instructions and so forth. If your not sure take it to your mechanic, it should be easy enough for him. -Chris
    ... ptui!

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    Thanks 4 your interest, mate. I've done turbo swaps, eng rebuilds & was a fitter/machinist b4 being a draftsman. My other car is a nissan silvia sr20det turbo 2liter (only 200kw at moment).

    I thought these things had an electronic throttle?? ie no cable????
    Intake pipe from turbo to intake manifold hugs back of block/head, so hard to trace.

    BTW theirs no intercooler either, that would make it very easy...

    Thanks 4 your help anyways
    Last edited by lumpi; 7th November 2005 at 05:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpi
    Thanks 4 your interest, mate. I've done turbo swaps, eng rebuilds & was a fitter/machinist b4 being a draftsman. My other car is a nissan silvia sr20det turbo 2liter (only 200kw at moment).

    I thought these things had an electronic throttle?? ie no cable????
    Intake pipe from turbo to intake manifold hugs back of block/head, so hard to trace.

    BTW theirs no intercooler either, that would make it very easy...

    Thanks 4 your help anyways
    Cable or not it still has an intake plenum, you could get a feed from there. I didn't know your level of mechanical skill but if youve done turbo swaps and are a fitter then you should be able to find the throttle very easily.... do you know were it is on your sr20?? surely you could locate the pugs one just as easy. Having no intecooler means very little. Sorry i couldn't help anymore. - Chris
    ... ptui!

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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    Cable or not it still has an intake plenum, you could get a feed from there. I didn't know your level of mechanical skill but if youve done turbo swaps and are a fitter then you should be able to find the throttle very easily.... do you know were it is on your sr20?? surely you could locate the pugs one just as easy. Having no intecooler means very little. Sorry i couldn't help anymore. - Chris
    This is my first DIESEL, & yes I can find the throttle body on any petrol engine. If it had an intercooler it would be very easy to do cause the pipes are there. I dont know if youve ever looked at a 307 Hdi but all i can see is the intake from the air box dissapear round the back to the turbo inlet. I know where the wastegate is, but I was looking for any easy tee-in point - boost control etc. No worries no big deal.

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    Do HDi's actually have a throttle body. My knowledge on diesels is very limited but I thought on the older mechanical ones the "throttle" controlled the amount of fuel going to the engine (ie no butterfly) as opposed to a petrol engine where the throttle controls the amount of air going into the engine. The HDi's may do it differently but it may pay to find out a bit more about the fueling system before you go nuts looking for something that may not exist.

    Jarrod

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    Thats what I thought, but I couldn't be bothered explaining it to chris...
    thats why i questioned throttle body??? The fuel not air controls motor.
    cheers
    How do techies test boost pressure??
    Last edited by lumpi; 7th November 2005 at 06:54 PM.

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    Although not a DSL, I've got the boost guage set up to read from the plenum/manifold on my 505. This is the best place to take a reading because this is what's being fed into the motor.

    Find a vacuum/pressure hose leading to the plenum and add a T-junction and attach the line for the boost guage. Be careful how conspicuously you fit it, because you don't want your warranty effected by DIY modifications.

    Not a hard job at all. If you feed the line to the guage through the firewall, make sure it's not in an area too badly effected by heat or exposed to anything moving. Rubber hose wears easily and I found it to be prone to leakage.
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    Default Diesel boost guage

    Owing a 2 litre 66kW HDi and a turbo diesel landcruiser I would say that a boost guage will be nice to look at but really no use. Get it checked by all means to see if it is giving one atmosphere (14PSI, 1Bar) boost. Where to put it would be in the in the inlet manifold somewhere post turbo.

    More important (read very important) is an EGT (Exhaust gas temperature) guage as this is soemthing that may well damage your motor. It is why they say to let turbo's cool down after they have been heavily used. it will be better insurance and more useful than a boost guage.

    A turbo it is a great addition to a diesel engine, it gives more power, torque and in general does not affect efficiency ie fuel usage. In fact it can improve it. They also add significantly to the driveability and enjoyment you get from the HDi. Mine is the old motor and it quite good to drive, I would love to drove the new 1.6 or 2 litre for a comparison.

    regards,
    Matt

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    Quote Originally Posted by 505 to the max
    Although not a DSL, I've got the boost guage set up to read from the plenum/manifold on my 505. This is the best place to take a reading because this is what's being fed into the motor.

    Find a vacuum/pressure hose leading to the plenum and add a T-junction and attach the line for the boost guage. Be careful how conspicuously you fit it, because you don't want your warranty effected by DIY modifications.

    Not a hard job at all. If you feed the line to the guage through the firewall, make sure it's not in an area too badly effected by heat or exposed to anything moving. Rubber hose wears easily and I found it to be prone to leakage.
    Thanks for your help guys, but unless you've done it on a 307hdi your suggestions wont help. If you've looked at one you will know what I mean.........

  17. #17
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    Well my point was that anything past that point would be the intake plenum... thats were i would take a t-off from. If you can see the waste gate (extrenal?) then the compressor can't be that far.... TBH its looks like it will be one of "those" jobs. - Chris
    ... ptui!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew
    Owing a 2 litre 66kW HDi and a turbo diesel landcruiser I would say that a boost guage will be nice to look at but really no use. Get it checked by all means to see if it is giving one atmosphere (14PSI, 1Bar) boost. Where to put it would be in the in the inlet manifold somewhere post turbo.

    More important (read very important) is an EGT (Exhaust gas temperature) guage as this is soemthing that may well damage your motor. It is why they say to let turbo's cool down after they have been heavily used. it will be better insurance and more useful than a boost guage.

    A turbo it is a great addition to a diesel engine, it gives more power, torque and in general does not affect efficiency ie fuel usage. In fact it can improve it. They also add significantly to the driveability and enjoyment you get from the HDi. Mine is the old motor and it quite good to drive, I would love to drove the new 1.6 or 2 litre for a comparison.

    regards,
    Matt
    Diesel's run a lot cooler than petrol turbos & EGT gauges are used on very high hp/boost petrol applications. The reason you dont turn off turbo engines straight away from makin boost is because they spin at 100000 rpm+or- and stopping the motor stops pressure fed oil to the bearings, cooking what little oil is left and coking up the bearings. Water cooled turbos are less susceptable to this. EGT won't be a problem provided your making stock boost. If you performance drops off wouldn't you rather check boost level/timing than EGT!!!!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    Well my point was that anything past that point would be the intake plenum... thats were i would take a t-off from. If you can see the waste gate (extrenal?) then the compressor can't be that far.... TBH its looks like it will be one of "those" jobs. - Chris
    Waste gate in integral and yes you can see it when car is on a HOIST

    Taking a tee off you would think was easy but this aint your average intake manifold.

    Thats why I'm asking a techie where they test boost??
    Like I said it aint no biggie, but its the kind of test I would have liked to do before I put too may ks on the car - for comparison later...

    BTW chris what do you mean by one of those jobs? I asked a specific question relating to a very specific model, not how do you put a boost gauge on any old turbo engine.
    Please people, thanks for your ideas, but if you dont understand the question dont try to answer it....
    Last edited by lumpi; 8th November 2005 at 11:47 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpi
    BTW chris what do you mean by one of those jobs? I asked a specific question relating to a very specific model, not how do you put a boost gauge on any old turbo engine.
    Please people, thanks for your ideas, but if you dont understand the question dont try to answer it....
    "those" jobs mean that the obvious answer was the first one that you suggested yourself. Seems to me you got it figured out already... I wasn't trying to just conveigh an idea; i've personally lost count the amount of guages ive done. Id say id be nearly 500, thats what you get when the store your worked (past tence) sells the damm things. The trikiest part was finding a mounting spot the customer was happy with and didn't cut up the dash/binicle etc....lol.
    True, these were all on petrol cars, no diesels, but i didn't realise the 307 was all that much more difficult, but alas it seems this has evaded us.
    Lumpi I can assure you i never ment to question any of your abilities, just that out of the several boost or boost/vaccumm guages I did it was never really a challenge, maybe diesels are all too different, but guess Ill never know as I don't do accesories in cars anymore. Good luckl I hope you suceed in your experiment. - Chris
    ... ptui!

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    No worries chris, I do value all information I can get on these forums. These hdi's are defiately different tho. Not only is the intake plumbing from turbo to head on the same side as the exhaust - on the very back of the motor. Its all under the windscreen/wiper cowling. eg to take the intake manifold off you've got to lower the motor!!! The intake under pressure to the head is very short.

    I was hoping there was a test point or a boost control hose somewhere (there's stuff all hoses anywhere).

    Next time I get it on a hoist will try to trace wastegate signal hose...

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    A slight slip of the pen, by saying let a turbo cool down I mean a turbocharged motor. Yes I agree it is very important to let the tubo cool down but if you want to see how cool turbocharged diesels run then come over and I will show you and it runs less boost than the Peugeot, 12 lbs vs 14 lbs. They also normally have oil feeds like a dripping oil to the bearings to try and limit this kind of damage, but I would not liek to try it.

    EGT of 600 - 700 degrees may not be out of the question if you have been giving it some stick and this can affect your valves and turbochargers..

    Let the Turbo cool down too with a timer, but also pay attention to the EGT.
    Boost is boost, you soon know when its delivered.

    Regards,
    Matt

    Quote Originally Posted by lumpi
    Diesel's run a lot cooler than petrol turbos & EGT gauges are used on very high hp/boost petrol applications. The reason you dont turn off turbo engines straight away from makin boost is because they spin at 100000 rpm+or- and stopping the motor stops pressure fed oil to the bearings, cooking what little oil is left and coking up the bearings. Water cooled turbos are less susceptable to this. EGT won't be a problem provided your making stock boost. If you performance drops off wouldn't you rather check boost level/timing than EGT!!!!?

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