and yet another improvement......
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Default and yet another improvement......

    Thanks to Hong Kong Puggy for providing a nice weber falcon carby for my 505 wagon

    i did the swap today and PHWOAR what a differance, the car really drives heaps better then it did with the crappy old solex (dont get me wrong, solex was a good carb but the choke setup was pathedic)

    the wagon accually has a bit of stick now, and it starts so easy, AND the accelerator pump works, so it doesnt cough and fart under acceleration.

    really REALLY simple conversion, in case anyones wondering.....

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    >a few bits of 8mm threaded rod and some nuts to hold it down (the original bolts were too short)
    >an extension on the throttle linkage to hold the round grey thing where the cables hook up (the falcon has a mechanical linkage, the pug is cables)
    >bend the little clamp that holds the throttle and kick down cables
    >and hook up the ELECTRIC choke and fuel cut off solenoid to the coil so they are both activated automatically when the ignition is on...

    really makes a huge differance to the responsiveness and cold starting.....

    now off to the wreckers on the weekend to get an air cleaner off a falcon, then its all finished..........(the peugeot one doesnt quite fit on top of the weber carb, itd work, but not perfectly)

    love it when a plan comes together............

    now for shocks, brakes, paint and panel on the 504 thats really gonna give my wallet a good ...........lol

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts Fordman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 123abc
    >and hook up the ELECTRIC choke and fuel cut off solenoid to the coil so they are both activated automatically when the ignition is on...
    That sounds like a good conversion - just a point - the Falcon electric choke works from a special connection on the alternator - I think it picks up about 7 volts and only after the engine starts.
    Then again, your coil may be on 7 volts, so no drama, and probably doesnt matter about the choke starting to open as soon as the ignition is on because you dont usually leave it on without the engine running anyway.
    Sometimes "simple" works!

    Cheers.

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Ralph's Avatar
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    Owen,


    That's interesting. I'd heard the carbys off the Cortinas can be used on the XN series of Pug motors. What's the actual model number of the carby and what Falcon is it off?

    Matt.
    On the internet, no one knows that you are only wearing a fez.

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Been running various ideas of getting an old Pug as a run about through my head and asked my old man what the fuel consumption was like on the old 505 we had years ago, he said with the Solex it was awful but with a Weber it improved dramtically and was quicker to boot...
    05' Megane 225 Cup

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph
    Owen,


    That's interesting. I'd heard the carbys off the Cortinas can be used on the XN series of Pug motors. What's the actual model number of the carby and what Falcon is it off?

    Matt.

    Im pretty sure its off an XE falcon, i know its the old square headlight falcon, with the triangle indicators on the front........

    Hong Kong puggy supplied the carby to me so he'd be the best one to ask

    (HINT HINT, HONG KONG PUGGY JOIN THIS CONV.......)

    i will get back to you with the model and specs of the carby..........

    id certainly recomend this conversion to anyone who isnt happy with the solex.........really worth the little time and effort...........

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fordman
    That sounds like a good conversion - just a point - the Falcon electric choke works from a special connection on the alternator - I think it picks up about 7 volts and only after the engine starts.
    Then again, your coil may be on 7 volts, so no drama, and probably doesnt matter about the choke starting to open as soon as the ignition is on because you dont usually leave it on without the engine running anyway.
    Sometimes "simple" works!

    Cheers.

    hmmm, yes, after talking with a mechanic mate, i heard the same thing, the choke on the falcons has a semi complex sort of system, it only opperates when the alternator is charging, and hence the engine running......

    but he went on to tell me that the easiest way was straight to the +ve on the coil, so it just activates when ignition is on, and i piggy backed the choke and fuel sollenoid so theres just one nice neet wire running to the coil.....less things to burnout, fall off, break, corrode, short out etc...lol

    all in all, a very satisfying job....

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by 123abc
    Im pretty sure its off an XE falcon, i know its the old square headlight falcon, with the triangle indicators on the front........

    Hong Kong puggy supplied the carby to me so he'd be the best one to ask

    (HINT HINT, HONG KONG PUGGY JOIN THIS CONV.......)

    i will get back to you with the model and specs of the carby..........

    id certainly recomend this conversion to anyone who isnt happy with the solex.........really worth the little time and effort...........
    These are fitted to the XE & XF 6 cyl engines year models 1983 - 1987 (unless the engine was EFI) and was continued in the utes into the early 90's.

    They work because they have a fairly small primary throat which gives good torque and economy at low speeds, and when you put your foot down the secondary throat gives you all the power but will chew the fuel.

    Cheers.

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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    34ADM weber is the carb
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

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    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

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    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    in case anyones interested...

    i have run a whole tank of fuel through the car.....

    after crunching the numbers, the wagon now gets just under 10 litres/100klms, around 9.5ish.......

    this is under normal driving conditions, a combination of highway and 'traffic jam' driving.......

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts 504-504-504's Avatar
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    Default ULP or PULP?

    Quote Originally Posted by 123abc
    in case anyones interested...

    i have run a whole tank of fuel through the car.....

    after crunching the numbers, the wagon now gets just under 10 litres/100klms, around 9.5ish.......

    this is under normal driving conditions, a combination of highway and 'traffic jam' driving.......
    Sounds good, what octane rating fuel do you use?
    Paul,
    504-504-504,
    Northern Outpost.

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph
    Owen,


    That's interesting. I'd heard the carbys off the Cortinas can be used on the XN series of Pug motors. What's the actual model number of the carby and what Falcon is it off?

    Matt.
    Ralph,
    Hi, HKP here. Just saw this thread. The Weber is a 34 ADM. It is from the XE falcon. It is similar to the 32/36 in all sizings from what I could make out amd unlike the 34dgas it is still a progressive carby. (single then dual throat) I wasn't sure if Owne would have any hassles with it due to the accelerator pump being larger than the 32/36 but it would appear t be OK. I am a little annoyed I didn't try it on my last 505 before Is old it, which is actually the car I purchased it for.
    Chris
    P.S....I didn't read all the posts before replying and see all questions have been answered. Dam Owen, I really wish I had tried that carbie now. Actually, it sounds like it would be a great carbie for the 4 port head motor on the floor of my garage. Any interest?? Hint hint... I will get and pull the sump off and see what's wrong if anything if you'd like and get abck to you.
    Aussie rarity.....4 port XN1 engine
    motor here for any one interested.
    Last edited by HONG KONG PUGGY; 20th October 2005 at 04:40 PM.
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  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 504-504-504
    Sounds good, what octane rating fuel do you use?
    Paul,
    504-504-504,
    Northern Outpost.
    just useing normal unleaded, the cheap stuff........

    after all its not an F1 car..

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HONG KONG PUGGY
    Ralph,
    Hi, HKP here. Just saw this thread. The Weber is a 34 ADM. It is from the XE falcon. It is similar to the 32/36 in all sizings from what I could make out amd unlike the 34dgas it is still a progressive carby. (single then dual throat) I wasn't sure if Owne would have any hassles with it due to the accelerator pump being larger than the 32/36 but it would appear t be OK. I am a little annoyed I didn't try it on my last 505 before Is old it, which is actually the car I purchased it for.
    Chris
    P.S....I didn't read all the posts before replying and see all questions have been answered. Dam Owen, I really wish I had tried that carbie now. Actually, it sounds like it would be a great carbie for the 4 port head motor on the floor of my garage. Any interest?? Hint hint... I will get and pull the sump off and see what's wrong if anything if you'd like and get abck to you.
    Aussie rarity.....4 port XN1 engine
    motor here for any one interested.
    lol, ah well, you can always get another 505 one day.....lol........its really a beaut little beast that carby, ill bring it over oneday to show you how it all fits........

    Owen.

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 123abc
    lol, ah well, you can always get another 505 one day.....lol........its really a beaut little beast that carby, ill bring it over oneday to show you how it all fits........

    Owen.
    Owen,
    that'd be great.

    Chris..........cured of the 505 bug for a while, I'll take you for a run in the Scenic
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    Default Manifold ?

    What do you do for a manifold ? Does it fit onto the original solex one. regards cane toad

  16. #16
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 123abc
    in case anyones interested...

    i have run a whole tank of fuel through the car.....

    after crunching the numbers, the wagon now gets just under 10 litres/100klms, around 9.5ish.......

    this is under normal driving conditions, a combination of highway and 'traffic jam' driving.......

    did you change the jets at all ?

    i would have thought that taking a carb from a 4.1L engine and sticking it straight onto a 2L engine would near drown the poor thing

    do these have a venturi size of around 26mm/28mm primary/secondary ?
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    did you change the jets at all ?

    i would have thought that taking a carb from a 4.1L engine and sticking it straight onto a 2L engine would near drown the poor thing

    do these have a venturi size of around 26mm/28mm primary/secondary ?
    I would have said the opposite as the 2 litre would have trouble producing enough vacuum through the big venturis to suck any petrol.
    Graham

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Hey Graham and Rambo,
    Chris here. I can't remember exactly what sizes the venturis are but from memory I am sure they were close to the sizes of a 32/36. It is stamped on the side as usual and may-be Owen can look for you if you ask him nice like. I hadn't got around to changing the acc pump jet in the carb before I sold it to Owen as I couldn't get any info out of the guys at the carb shop up here on sizings. All they kept telling me was to fit it and they would dyno it and go from there. Yeah $$$$ right. Although, from what I can remember most of the jet sizes were similar to the jetting for a 2L weber/solex type carbie so I have no idea whar Ford did to make the thing run a 6 cylinder Falcon engine when it runsa 2L Pug well also.
    All I can say is when I got the carb, the guy who sold it to me had already re-kitted it and I can't remember what car he was going to use it on and may-be it was destined for a 2L 4cyl anyhow. Age and oldtimers is catching me and my memory is chasing oldtimers so I have no hope
    Chris
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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    i should really go and dig out one of the ones i have in the garage and check it out but it's dark outside and i am feeling lazy

    i'll have a look tomorrow when i get back from work

    26 and 28 sound familiar though regarding venturi sizes for the standard 34ADM weber

    beware of getting the XF version though as they have pollution gear crap all over them where as the XE ones don't
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Rambo, this one was ddefinatly an XE version as it had no crap hangin off it, just a bare bones carbie, with the electric choke.
    I say on the steength of what Owen has said, just give it a go, sort it out after it's on the car.
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    "When you hit the tree between the headlights thats understeer. Oversteer is when you hit the tree between the Tail Lights" - Wayne Bell

  21. #21
    1000+ Posts Shobbz's Avatar
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    Interesting..........

    Might go and have a chat with the local ford nut.

    shobbz
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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    I would have said the opposite as the 2 litre would have trouble producing enough vacuum through the big venturis to suck any petrol.
    Graham

    but then if the venturis are big then when you give it a boot full the car would cough and die wouldn't it ?
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  23. #23
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shobbz
    Interesting..........

    Might go and have a chat with the local ford nut.

    shobbz
    Hey Shobz,
    I'd try one of the Ford wreckers. If you need a kit let me know and I'll see what I can do. I think for ease of operation this is the way to go especially with NO wax capsule choke. Just make sure if you look at any in the Wreckers that you ask them to hook up the fuel solenoid to a 12v power supply to check if it works. They are not cheap to replace if faulty. (solenoid located on primary circut side of carbie where the idle jet would be and has a single spade connector on it. Earth the carb, +ve to terminal and it should click)

    Good luck searching,
    Chris
    P.M. for any assistance if you like.
    2016 Renault Sport Clio Cup EDC 200



    Previous

    2001 Rx-4 Privilege
    R17TL, 1973
    R20TS x 3
    R18 GTS wagon x 2
    R10





    "When you hit the tree between the headlights thats understeer. Oversteer is when you hit the tree between the Tail Lights" - Wayne Bell

  24. #24
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HONG KONG PUGGY
    Hey Shobz,
    I'd try one of the Ford wreckers. If you need a kit let me know and I'll see what I can do. I think for ease of operation this is the way to go especially with NO wax capsule choke. Just make sure if you look at any in the Wreckers that you ask them to hook up the fuel solenoid to a 12v power supply to check if it works. They are not cheap to replace if faulty. (solenoid located on primary circut side of carbie where the idle jet would be and has a single spade connector on it. Earth the carb, +ve to terminal and it should click)

    Good luck searching,
    Chris
    P.M. for any assistance if you like.

    and make sure there is no play in the throttle shaft or the butterfly

    remember that most of the cars these have come of have done high miles but in saying that i have a couple here that from memory are in pretty good nic and i'll be checking them out when i get back from work
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger! 123abc's Avatar
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    Hmmmmm

    i had the same worries as i prepared to do the swap.....

    but with the help of a mechanic friend, it soon dawned on me that a carby will only supply what the engine demands, the larger overall size doesnt meen itll supply more fuel and drown it, but infact, it helps the whole system to breath a lot easier............and in fact, the fuel economy accually got better, (probabley because the new carby was in better condition) but partly because its breathing a lot easyier with a bigger carb, tuned down of course.

    as for the manifolds, the bolt pattern is exactly the same, i just droped it on, the only thing was that new bolts had to be made out of threaded rod (8mm) as the old ones were to short........

    the carb sits higher up then the old one, but a falcon air cleaner fits perfectly under the bonnet, it only touches EVER SO SLIGHTLY on the under side of the bonnet, and i mean, ever so slightly.......

    i will post pictures........

    Owen.
    Last edited by 123abc; 22nd October 2005 at 09:51 AM.

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