Getting engine ready to remove... (driveshafts)
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  1. #1
    al
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    Default Getting engine ready to remove... (driveshafts)

    Sometime this week i have to get the engine ready to rip out of the 205, but obviously the driveshafts have to come out... What is the easiest way to do this? (I am told they don't need to be removed completely??)

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  2. #2
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    you need to remove them completely, if you want maximum access around the engine. The amount of work to move them 50mm, or completely out, is the same.

    Undo the driveshaft nuts
    remove the ball joint pins, disconnecting the wishbones from the uprights
    undo the two M7 intermediate bearing nuts/bolts

    you can then push the driveshafts out of the uprights, and remove the driveshafts from the diff.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT
    you need to remove them completely, if you want maximum access around the engine. The amount of work to move them 50mm, or completely out, is the same.

    Undo the driveshaft nuts
    remove the ball joint pins, disconnecting the wishbones from the uprights
    undo the two M7 intermediate bearing nuts/bolts

    you can then push the driveshafts out of the uprights, and remove the driveshafts from the diff.
    This is very simple with a GTi, I couldn't believe how easy it was to change a wishbone the other day.
    The Si required a crow bar to lever the lower control arm away from the strut.
    Drain the gearbox first unless you want oil everywhere!
    Graham

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    al
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    What is the best method of undoing the hub nut without the whole thing spinning? As i have the 14'' wheels i can't just remove the centre cap, and i have been warned against getting someone to apply the brakes...

    Also, i take it that the hub nuts need to be replaced?
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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Steel plate with two holes drilled to fit wheel studs and long enough to reach the floor. That locks the lot and then you need a nice big 3/4" socket and a length of pipe about 6 foot long to crack the hub nut loose.
    I've posted pics here in the past of the set up. If you do a search you should find them along with a few tips on how to do it.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  6. #6
    al
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    Thanks alan, i'll do a search here now. I have just been shopping and bought the biggest and beastliest breaker bar i have ever seen for this job... now i just need some pipe and energy and the bastard is coming off...
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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Scroll through this and check out the pic on number 22.


    35mm 3/4 drive socket - where to get one


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! WAUTY205's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by al
    ...and i have been warned against getting someone to apply the brakes...
    Why??? If the brakes & studs can stop the car hard enough to lift the back wheels off the ground. Maybe put the nuts back on to hold the disc against the hub. I would like to know the reasons against doing this.
    -Will
    1990 205Gti
    1976 504 rally car (currently out of action)

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    Quote Originally Posted by WAUTY205
    Why??? If the brakes & studs can stop the car hard enough to lift the back wheels off the ground. Maybe put the nuts back on to hold the disc against the hub. I would like to know the reasons against doing this.
    -Will
    So would I!
    Graham

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    al
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    Talk to Mr Haynes guys... It didn't make much sense to me either.
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    it can be done using the brakes but for some reason it is not recomended. i recently had to do it withour the right socket

    used a chisel and ball hammer... medieval rattle gun only took about 30sec a nut but wont be reusing them
    French - 92 205mi16, 87 205gti and spares
    Other - Amarok V6, Iveco Daily 50C17, Isuzu 600

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    Quote Originally Posted by al
    Talk to Mr Haynes guys... It didn't make much sense to me either.

    mate if you need any tools or a hand on this.give me a call.my computer is down so dont pm me for a week.-BAZZ
    BAZGTI
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  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! amcc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by al
    Talk to Mr Haynes guys... It didn't make much sense to me either.

    possibly because on one side you would be turning the drive shaft the wrong way...
    French - 92 205mi16, 87 205gti and spares
    Other - Amarok V6, Iveco Daily 50C17, Isuzu 600

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    al
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    I haven't had a crack at this yet, but i have equipped myself with the biggest mofo breaker bar ever... It is really fat and with a bit of pipe i should be ok.

    Plus, the driveshafts have only done a couple of hundred kms so they shouldn't be rusted on.
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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I'd reckon the brakes would hold it well enough but the biggest hassle I could enviseage would be the springy effect of holding it with the brakes.
    If it turns out to be on too tight, then the piece of flat iron bar I orginally suggested which is similar to a recognised service tool that has been used on Cits for years.
    I've only ever seen a couple of them, but in the advent of a really tight axle nut, this thing sitting on a concrete floor is like striking a blacksmiths anvil .......one.........two.........bingo, she's loose.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    I'd reckon the brakes would hold it well enough but the biggest hassle I could enviseage would be the springy effect of holding it with the brakes.
    If it turns out to be on too tight, then the piece of flat iron bar I orginally suggested which is similar to a recognised service tool that has been used on Cits for years.
    I've only ever seen a couple of them, but in the advent of a really tight axle nut, this thing sitting on a concrete floor is like striking a blacksmiths anvil .......one.........two.........bingo, she's loose.

    Alan S
    I just used an electric rattle gun!
    Graham

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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    If he hasn't got one or access to one, this is by far a cheaper option than buying one and as effective as you'll get without risking any internal damage.
    The point is that if he has to hire one, he'll also need to get it to refit the nut as well and if there's any problems...again and so it goes on and he already has the socket and breaker bar.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    If he hasn't got one or access to one, this is by far a cheaper option than buying one and as effective as you'll get without risking any internal damage.
    The point is that if he has to hire one, he'll also need to get it to refit the nut as well and if there's any problems...again and so it goes on and he already has the socket and breaker bar.

    Alan S
    Yes, of course.
    I was lucky and bought a second hand one cheaply, don't know what I did without it!
    Grahamn

  19. #19
    1000+ Posts Haakon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by al
    What is the best method of undoing the hub nut without the whole thing spinning? As i have the 14'' wheels i can't just remove the centre cap, and i have been warned against getting someone to apply the brakes...

    Also, i take it that the hub nuts need to be replaced?
    I just put a screwdriver into the vented disc holes and let it butt up against the caliper (assuming it has vented discs)
    I tried to drown my sorrows in alcohol, but the bastards learnt how to swim

  20. #20
    al
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    I am soooo stupid... I managed to overlook the fact that my car is currently sitting on the wheels from my sisters 205si... (ie: the ones with the hole in the middle)

    And for the record, i just got both the hubnuts loosened within 30 seconds. Somehow i don't think they were on tight enough...
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  21. #21
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    So you didn't have to resort to this hey?




    Maybe when you refit them.



    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  22. #22
    al
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    I want to get an arrangement like that going just cos it looks cool alan... Anyway, i think the ease of removal is a testament to the recent replacement of the driveshafts. I just drained the oil from the gearbox and it looks brand new... (not discoloured at all)
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  23. #23
    al
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    Help guys... Everything was fine until i discovered the rounded 11mm intermediate bearing nut... While i'm sure my efforts didn't help it, the thing was looking ordinary before...

    What should i do? The engine is supposed to be getting swapped tomorrow!
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  24. #24
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    The head of that bolt should be a camshaped thing and is replaceable (if it's the same as the Cit which I presume it will be) so don't stuff around spending all night on it. Either use a nut splitter or a self locking headbolt remover which will grab a rounded off nut or bolt head. If none of these available, just carefully cut the nut off the shaft possibly with an angle grinder or power hacksaw.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  25. #25
    al
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    The head of that bolt should be a camshaped thing and is replaceable (if it's the same as the Cit which I presume it will be) so don't stuff around spending all night on it. Either use a nut splitter or a self locking headbolt remover which will grab a rounded off nut or bolt head. If none of these available, just carefully cut the nut off the shaft possibly with an angle grinder or power hacksaw.


    Alan S
    Thanks alan. I have attacked the bugger with everything now, and just made an unpleasant mess... I think an angle grinder is the only solution now.
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