Ethanol Fuel
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Thread: Ethanol Fuel

  1. #1
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Default Ethanol Fuel

    Guys,

    have we had the ethanol debate yet?

    It has appeared at United SS in Adelaide, 98 octane 3c less than Ulp, price is good.

    What have you to say.....................?

    ed ge

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! chris's Avatar
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    The ratio of fuel:air is different for complete combustion, you need to run a bit richer. Some modern EFI systems do this automatically, otherwise you're into fiddling with jets to get it right. I think there was a long thread on this a while back when someone (pugrambo?) inherited a few drums of ethanol. The advance curves would be slightly different too, I think.

    Probably easy enough to set up a car to run on either ethanol or petrol, but not to switch between the two every time you fill up

    Something I'm kind of interested in as a seems like ethanol will become more common in the future -- greenhouse-friendly and increasingly competitive on price. There are people in my department working on producing it on an industrial scale out of almost any plant material.

    Chris
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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    if you do a search you will find the thread

    up to around 18%ethanol is fine for normal running and it raises the ron of the fuel as described in that thread

    anymore than that and you start to lose ron

    in saying that though you lose a little mon ? but the car also runs cooler
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    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    I thought that there were problems with corosion if the fuel system isn't specifically designed for ethanol... As far as I know up to 10% is safe for the majority of cars, but anything over that and you need to make sure your fuel system components are compatible...

    I don't know whether french cars in general have the right fuel system components.

    Tony.
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    Some of the information I have heard:

    -Ethanol is not as efficient to burn(less mpg's) therefor you emit more exhaust to go the same distance.
    -More fossil fuels are consumed producing ethanol(equipment to plant, harvest & refine) than is saved by using it on the street.
    -More than 10% blend is hard on engines
    -here in the states they say there isn't enough corn produced to have much of an effect on our fossil fuel dependency

    Scott

  6. #6
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    here is the said thread

    The Ethanol debate
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Thanks Rambo,

    read the entire thread, most amusing, and inconclusive, some interesting sidelines and I was stumped by the ending.

    I take it you haven't been using you grand supply of ethanol.

    The pamphlet that comes from United service stations is a white wash, it works in everything and it's good for everything (vsr warning pre '86).

    But from the replies it would seem it is not being widely used, if at all and perhaps Adelaide is the quinea pig.

    98ron for 3 cents less than ulp seems an attractive offer.

    Would you buy it? Anyone.

    ed ge

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    This may be of interest to some I haven't got time to read it right now....but I did skim over the potential damage part.

    http://www.deh.gov.au/atmosphere/eth...it/issues.html

    Tony.
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  9. #9
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    Damage would most likely be limited to rubber fuel hose and fuel filters. The oil industry love fud (Fear uncertainty and doubt) and the fuel they sell is directly responsible for the rubbish that will clog your filters, wither as deposits of gums etc or rust from the tank. The car industry have cheapened their product to suite our cheapness, as well as the tpe of fuel that is predominant.

    If its less than 10% Ethanol use it, the combustion will not be that different either Stoichometrically (burning) or power wise, it is in a small percentage (10%) so it will not corrode (if at all) and it will save you some cash. Its not that fine so don't pick hairs with it please. Try it once with a few litres when low on fuel then if it plays up go and get the old stuff and dilute it even more.

    Says me running 100% biodeisel in my pug. It runs fine but its not ethanol!

    Regards.

  10. #10
    Tadpole Nitrousvts's Avatar
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    Ethanol is very better of the one than the gasoline! In Brazil all the cars turbo use ethanol! Besides giving more power of that gasoline, cools combustion very and he is cheaper! Engines use up to 18:1 ratio with ethanol! motor is perfect!it has that to increase the outflow of the injectors in 50% and to advance the ignition! Nowadays the used materias in the cars do not suffer corrosion!

    all the engines prepared in Brazil use ethanol in the street and methanol ln races! It functions perfectly! With Much more power of that any gasoline! Besides being very cheap!

    In the cold stations we use a reservoir to inject morning gasoline
    Boost foot for you !

    Xsara VTS 167hp,
    Air filter,3''exaust,rev.limit 8300rpm,Koni/Eibach federn,Yokohama advan A-032 tires,N.O.S. kit,Big TURBO,Fuel:Ethanol...
    Best time:0-60mph 6.2sec
    TURBO project=ready!!
    12,3sec in a quarter!!!

  11. #11
    Tadpole Nitrousvts's Avatar
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    HAs much xsara vts using ethanol! all pass 200hp in dyno! weakkest it has 202hp! engine all stock with alterations in the ecu

    the engines turbo that had pressure of 0.8bar in the gasoline, use ethanol and to 2bar without harming the engine! the power profit is nonsense!
    Boost foot for you !

    Xsara VTS 167hp,
    Air filter,3''exaust,rev.limit 8300rpm,Koni/Eibach federn,Yokohama advan A-032 tires,N.O.S. kit,Big TURBO,Fuel:Ethanol...
    Best time:0-60mph 6.2sec
    TURBO project=ready!!
    12,3sec in a quarter!!!

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Thankyou nitrous,

    good to have advice from some-one who uses this fuel.

    See also posts from Citrolero a friendly Chilean who is crazy about Citroen.

    Cheers ed ge

    no boost only injected (P504ti)

  13. #13
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    Someone I know who used to work at Holdens told us there were a number of different components used in the fuel system of the cars destined for Brazil because of the high (greater than 10%) ethanol content of the fuel. Different hoses and plastic components, as well as stainless steel replacing some of the normally steel items.

  14. #14
    Tadpole Nitrousvts's Avatar
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    Millions of cars exist here using ethanol!millions!
    All function without problems! Mine vts nitrous for example twirled c/50hp in the gasoline... With ethanol I use 130hp without problems some! In dyno is only happy!!!

    Mine vts this stopped p/to install the turbo! I bought the peaks with 50% today more than the outflow to use ethanol! Later sending the videos for as the functioning of the engine are perfect
    Last edited by Nitrousvts; 31st July 2005 at 04:44 AM.
    Boost foot for you !

    Xsara VTS 167hp,
    Air filter,3''exaust,rev.limit 8300rpm,Koni/Eibach federn,Yokohama advan A-032 tires,N.O.S. kit,Big TURBO,Fuel:Ethanol...
    Best time:0-60mph 6.2sec
    TURBO project=ready!!
    12,3sec in a quarter!!!

  15. #15
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Default Ethanol Fuel..

    Have been keenly following this thread, in particular Nitrousvt's comments, his simple,almost naive translations. No offence meant Nitrous.
    To be considered in modern motoring lexicography has to be his. "Boost foot for you!" Also "In dyno joy is alone!!" Wordsmithing at its best.

  16. #16
    Tadpole Nitrousvts's Avatar
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    It's the google translator
    thank's
    Boost foot for you !

    Xsara VTS 167hp,
    Air filter,3''exaust,rev.limit 8300rpm,Koni/Eibach federn,Yokohama advan A-032 tires,N.O.S. kit,Big TURBO,Fuel:Ethanol...
    Best time:0-60mph 6.2sec
    TURBO project=ready!!
    12,3sec in a quarter!!!

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