405 Mi16 Electrical gremlins... any ideas?
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! 20FIVE's Avatar
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    Icon8 405 Mi16 Electrical gremlins... any ideas?

    My partner has a '91 405 Mi16 which has slowly developed a few temperamental electrical issues.... basically you could be driving around all day and then all of a sudden the dashboard lights all start having a spasm then stop, or it may happen 20 meters down the road.... sometimes not at all. Occasionally I have seen the headlights go slightly duller when this happens and she has also mentioned to me that the interior light has flashed on and off mysteriously.

    One thought which has crossed my mind is the electrical distribution board which is housed under the steering wheel as this was a common fault on the old 505's failing with a bit of age...

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    Thanks in advance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 20FIVE
    My partner has a '91 405 Mi16 which has slowly developed a few temperamental electrical issues.... basically you could be driving around all day and then all of a sudden the dashboard lights all start having a spasm then stop, or it may happen 20 meters down the road.... sometimes not at all. Occasionally I have seen the headlights go slightly duller when this happens and she has also mentioned to me that the interior light has flashed on and off mysteriously.

    One thought which has crossed my mind is the electrical distribution board which is housed under the steering wheel as this was a common fault on the old 505's failing with a bit of age...

    Thanks in advance.
    Try Cleaning the earth - connections to the battery check for loose or dirty cable ends

    KC MI16

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    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    One problem I have had with my S16 (although it wouldn't explain the interior light) is that the pot that dims the dash lights seems to get dirty or something and the dash lights will flicker or go out..... solution is to just roll the dimmer pot a bit and they all come back on nicely (and will generally work for another 12 months or so before the problem happens again).

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

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    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wintermute
    months or so
    another myth gone, ................18 days only



    ed ge

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    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edgedweller
    another myth gone, ................18 days only



    ed ge
    I suppose it depends on how bad the pot is..... mine has only done it three times over the last few years, I guess once it gets to a certain point thought it will need replacing

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
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  6. #6
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Just stiring you Tony, from when you first signed on I wondered wether you would communicate during June, July and August. For these first 18 days of June I've remained in suspense, no more.

    cheers ed ge

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    Dear Edge,

    You are a complete fruit cake,

    Signed,

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

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    Quote Originally Posted by edgedweller
    Just stiring you Tony, from when you first signed on I wondered wether you would communicate during June, July and August. For these first 18 days of June I've remained in suspense, no more.

    cheers ed ge
    <grin> very funny :p never even thought of that
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

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    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    What was of real concern was that you might not "speak".

    What is the origin of you're, sobriquet, nom de guerre, ..plume, alias, s'íl vous plait?

    cheers ed ge


    Thankyou Stuey.
    Last edited by edgedweller; 24th June 2005 at 04:30 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by edgedweller
    What was of real concern was that you might not "speak".

    What is the origin of you're, sobriquet, nom de guerre, ..plume, alias, s'íl vous plait?

    cheers ed ge


    Thankyou Stuey.
    yeah I worked that out once you said June July and august, a mute in winter gave me a good laugh

    It's from the book neuromancer (which I read about 18 years ago) I don't remember why I chose it as a handle, but I have used it on a few other forums, so tend to stick with it. Wintermute was an Artificial Intelligence "entity" sort of pervasive through the matrix (yeah that's wear the film term came from, though the film has no resemblance to the book neuromancer at all).

    On the diyaudio forum I have as my sig "Any intelligence I may appear to have is purely artificial" hasn't elicited any groans yet though

    Tony.

    PS. I'm glad I was a bit inactive in June, would have been a bummer if I had posted something in the first few days... I'm guessing that after 18 days you were starting to think it may be true
    306 S16 1995 black
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    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Oh no, I was really looking forward to enjoying the experience of letting the suspense eeeke out, working to a pitch of excitement at the change from July to August, as the reality began to firm, and gentley descending into bliss as spring arrived.

    Will immediately begin looking into unusual discrepencies or coincidences surrounding AI.

    Although anything but an audiophile.

    cheers ed ge

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    Quote Originally Posted by edgedweller
    Oh no, I was really looking forward to enjoying the experience of letting the suspense eeeke out, working to a pitch of excitement at the change from July to August, as the reality began to firm, and gentley descending into bliss as spring arrived.

    Will immediately begin looking into unusual discrepencies or coincidences surrounding AI.

    Although anything but an audiophile.

    cheers ed ge
    hehehehe I'm not what you would call an audiophile just like building and tweaking stuff

    Tony.

    edit: I think we have somewhat hijacked this thread. Have you had any luck 20five????
    306 S16 1995 black
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    No worries edgey...

    Hey Tony, what do you tweak? I'm just designing a pair of speakers (it's only taken me a year to finally start!) using the theory in Vance Dickason's The Loudspeaker Design Cookbook and using WinISD. Never realised the theory was so technical!

    Anyway, I've narrowed it down to some two way vented floorstanders using Vifa drivers - 8" woofer and 1" tweeter. I'm ordering the drivers in the next couple of weeks. Got the box design sorted, unless I reduce the woofer size down to 6.5".

    Might have a go at a MM phono pre-amp next...

    Cheers

    Stuey


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey
    No worries edgey...

    Hey Tony, what do you tweak? I'm just designing a pair of speakers (it's only taken me a year to finally start!) using the theory in Vance Dickason's The Loudspeaker Design Cookbook and using WinISD. Never realised the theory was so technical!

    Anyway, I've narrowed it down to some two way vented floorstanders using Vifa drivers - 8" woofer and 1" tweeter. I'm ordering the drivers in the next couple of weeks. Got the box design sorted, unless I reduce the woofer size down to 6.5".

    Might have a go at a MM phono pre-amp next...

    Cheers

    Stuey
    a year that's nothing I started planning my current project about 3 years ago.... got to get back to it .... in the past the tweaking has mainly been electronics (Like my amp) doing things like looking at newer designs and making some mods.... though I did also buy some LPAD's for my current speakers so I could adjust the levels, and over the years I changed drivers a few times as well.

    I'd say reducing to 6.5 inch is probably a wise idea.... you won't get as much bass but will have less problems with the higher freqencies... an 8" starts getting directional at fairly low freqencies, there is some stuff about this in dickasons cookbook... has the max recommended crossover freq for various diameter drivers, problem is that it's hard to find a tweeter that will go low enough for a two way with 8" drivers......

    My Current project has morel MW-144 5" drivers (in MTM config) and morel DMS37 tweeters.... I'll have separate twin subwoofers with vifa 10" drivers (the drivers in my current 3 ways)... Tweaking on these is going to be a learning experience, as I have never designed a crossover before, but will consist of trying different capacitors and inductors until it sounds right (If I can tell what sounds right!!!). Checkout the speaker forum on http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/forum....php?forumid=6 it is a great resourse (assuming you haven't already) very friendly atmosphere just like here.

    But be prepared to suddenly get the feeling that there is a lot more to know than what you thought I take some of it with a gain of salt as there really are some fanatics (as in the slogan for the forum) but if you have any questions it's the place to ask

    Other thing if you have M$ Excell I'd recommend playing around with UNIBOX it is a speaker design spreadsheet. Also if you have a good soundcard speaker workshop is invaluable, but you really need to get the manual (available elsewhere) If you want more info check out the wiki on diyaudio.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
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    Howdy Tony,

    Yeah, I thought about the crossover point with the 8", but the Vifa I'm using (they are at the very low end of the Vifa range - BC22JW08-08) extends relatively smoothly up to 4.5K to 5K before dropping off. What I'm doing is buying cheap-ish good name drivers for my first experiment, then if it's encouraging, I'll go all out and get something decent. Morels sound good...

    I'm making my own crossovers. Not sure about what quality of caps to go for, though. Thanks for that link. I've seen the site, but haven't looked around much. BTW is Unibox a freeware prog?

    BTW my first run at WinISD reckoned I needed a 91 litre cabinet so I'm hoping to get a second opinion from another program. Or I could do some manual calcs of course! Fiddling with the alignments changed the volume, but I'm still reading up on the effect of this! Might start driving a Chebyshev...

    Stuey


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    Hi Stuey,

    If you are mainly listening in the one spot then directivity shouldn't be too much of an issue, what happens is the sound waves become very directional at a certain point (relative to driver diameter) so if you are sitting off to one side then it may sound flat between say 2000 and 4000Hz....

    Yeah unibox is free. I find it excellent. I like to play around varying things and seeing what it does to the freq response... I've played with winisd, but decided on unibox in the end (though there are some things it can't do) 91 L certainly sounds big for an 8" driver!! are you using two per box?? I assume it is vented... what model is it?

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Default speaker design -off thread but interesting

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey
    No worries edgey...

    Hey Tony, what do you tweak? I'm just designing a pair of speakers (it's only taken me a year to finally start!) using the theory in Vance Dickason's The Loudspeaker Design Cookbook and using WinISD. Never realised the theory was so technical!

    Anyway, I've narrowed it down to some two way vented floorstanders using Vifa drivers - 8" woofer and 1" tweeter. I'm ordering the drivers in the next couple of weeks. Got the box design sorted, unless I reduce the woofer size down to 6.5".

    Might have a go at a MM phono pre-amp next...

    Cheers

    Stuey


    Stuey,

    If you are designing speakers have look at Neville Thiele designs and the hardcore calcs and theory behind them.

    Some of the early Radiatron Designer handbooks (around 1948 - 1958) also had some great stuff on speaker design. Although, the tend to look like a catalogue for Altec Lansing VOT (Voice of the Theatre) range.

    Very little has changed in fundamental loudspeaker enclosure since the start of the Western Electric Shearer horn stuff. Douglas Shearers' work also makes interesting reading too , but if you took his philosopy to heart you would end with enclosure the size of public telephone booth !

    If you want some serious LF drivers I still have a pair of Altec Lansing 515bs,
    15 inch, 15 ohm, good response from 28 to 500 hz, rated at about 150 w RMS continuos.


    Work really well in bi- amped or tri-amped set up.


    BTW Silicon chip have a excellent RIAA preamp design, uses low noise op amps, $30 at tricky dicky for the circuit board and componeets in a plastic bag type kit . You need a diecast box, some sockets and dual rail power supply with some stuff collected from the junk box you can get the whole going for less than $50 and it works as well as almost anything else which is available.

    regards


    Robert

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Hijacked .......to be sure ......... tweaking, mmmmmmmm.

    ed ge

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    Stuey,

    Did you ever see what my eldest fitted into his CX?

    Now, that's gettin' serious about sound systems!!




    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

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    Tony, no, I'm just doing two-ways. Like I say, if I use different alignments, the box volume varies. 91 litre was the biggest using a particular alignment model (SBB4). The model of the speaker is in my previous post. The boxes - I'm making from scratch with braced 18mm MDF/ply composite.

    Robert, thanks for that info about the preamp. Dickason incorporates Thiele's theories, as well as the many that have moved on from there, in his book. You're right about hard core. I've read the book three times and I'm still working it out...

    Cheers fellas, and sorry for the thread sabotage...

    Stuey


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    Hi Stuey,

    I can't find anything on this model BC22JW08-08 is it a really new one?? Where are you getting it from?

    You can do a two way with 2 X 8" and a tweeter, the 8" drivers are wired in parallel for roghly twice the efficiency, but also needs twice the volume and halves the impedance...

    Sounds like you are going all out on the construction I got lazy and decided to go with 25mm MDF (though the composite constuction which you are doing did get some serious consideration).

    I usually start simulating with a max flat alignment (I think it is butterworth from memory) then tweak things like volume and port tuning until I get the best bass extension with the smallest effect on the smoothness of the curve..... the max flat alignment usually results in a pretty small (relatively) box... my 10" Vifas model at a 65L box, though I am going to be making a box between 80 and 90L for them, as they are going to effectively be subwoofers.

    edit: I forgot to say earlier, what I'm doing with the crossovers is I bought a whole pile of different value bipolar electrics (for values bigger than 1uf) and polypropylene caps, to experiment with. Once I have the values I need, I'll probably buy some Solen poly caps (good quality without being rediculously expensive). For the inductors I'm going to have a go at winding them myself (despite what dickason says, aboout not doing it without a coil winding machine).

    Tony.

    attached pic of my prototype (morel) speaker sitting on top of my trusty old three ways (long story with those), which are looking a little the worse for wear, since they were left as raw particle board, and have had many beers spilt on them at parties The new ones will be getting some nice veneer. The new ones are an MTM two way.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 405 Mi16 Electrical gremlins... any ideas?-speakers.jpg  
    Last edited by Wintermute; 26th June 2005 at 03:23 PM.
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    Tony, the speakers are from a Vifa/Peerless (they've merged) cheap series (called Logic), designed in Denmark, made in China. They are quite rare; in fact, this 8" model was custom made for WES Components, as I was told by a Vifa engineer via email when I tried to get some specs from them (Xmax), so they aren't even on the Tymphany website.

    I'm buying them from Speakerbits - don't laugh, but they're only $60 (!) and the specs are pretty darn good for the price. I'll buy higher grade tweeters, though, to handle a lower crossover point. Like I say, if the results are encouraging (and I fully expect them to be) I'll be able to convince the missus that I need to buy some better woofers...

    BTW after a few calcs today, I might go for the sealed box and leave the vented for my next project. I think I'll more easily get a flat-ish response with a sealed box. If the bass extension isn't enough, I can always buy a REL subwoofer...

    Cheers

    Stuey


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey
    Tony, the speakers are from a Vifa/Peerless (they've merged) cheap series (called Logic), designed in Denmark, made in China. They are quite rare; in fact, this 8" model was custom made for WES Components, as I was told by a Vifa engineer via email when I tried to get some specs from them (Xmax), so they aren't even on the Tymphany website.

    I'm buying them from Speakerbits - don't laugh, but they're only $60 (!) and the specs are pretty darn good for the price. I'll buy higher grade tweeters, though, to handle a lower crossover point. Like I say, if the results are encouraging (and I fully expect them to be) I'll be able to convince the missus that I need to buy some better woofers...

    BTW after a few calcs today, I might go for the sealed box and leave the vented for my next project. I think I'll more easily get a flat-ish response with a sealed box. If the bass extension isn't enough, I can always buy a REL subwoofer...

    Cheers

    Stuey
    cool sealed is probably a good idea for a 1st project though I went bass reflex.... I'm doing sealed with my current. Adding a sub later is a good option, though if you are considering this I'd be tempted to drop back to the 6.5".....

    The other advantage with the sealed is it will be much smaller which may help in getting the approval of the missus

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
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    Quote Originally Posted by 20FIVE
    My partner has a '91 405 Mi16 which has slowly developed a few temperamental electrical issues.... basically you could be driving around all day and then all of a sudden the dashboard lights all start having a spasm then stop, or it may happen 20 meters down the road.... sometimes not at all. Occasionally I have seen the headlights go slightly duller when this happens and she has also mentioned to me that the interior light has flashed on and off mysteriously.

    One thought which has crossed my mind is the electrical distribution board which is housed under the steering wheel as this was a common fault on the old 505's failing with a bit of age...

    Thanks in advance.
    Since we have completly an utterly thread jacked 20Fives thread I thought I better put his original post back in here..... Sorry 20Five!!!

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

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