504 projet hmm.. maybe
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  1. #1
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    Default 504 projet hmm.. maybe

    Pugrambo and all you 604 lovers might hate me for this, but i know where i can get my hands on a resonable 604 for nothing, full of useful parts for a project that i've been thinking of for a fair while now. Actually the only thing thats wrong with it is the starter motor, from what i've been informed, but who really wants a 604 ?!? not me :p. now before you all tell me i'm insane or that im wreacking a useable car or that this will cost me more then its worth etc, i don't really care, i have time on my side, and a drivable car at the moment so an offer of this car to me for free has got me thinking about building a 504, what i'd really be after is a late model shell thats fully optioned that i can stick all my goodies into. from what i've read thugh automatic 504's are the easiest way to go about this, and the bellhousing can be hard to find to suit the manual gearbox, so this has lead me to one of three conclusions:

    A) getting an adaptor plate made up to suit a peugeot gerbox
    B) Gettiing an adaptor plate to suit a foreign Gearbox
    C) i may be wrong here but the gearbox in the 604 is a GM trimatic automatic, are these not the same as gearboxes used in drag cars and can you not get manual trimatics ? and how hard would it be to adapt one of these to a PRV V6

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    i have also heard that PRV V6's can chew up parts and spit them out, what would be the strongest gearbox made by peugeot that would hold a decent amount of power, if not peugeot what are the other options, what else will be needed to be strengthend and what are good replacement parts, i want to do this properly over a longish period of time and i do have a driveable car at the moment so time is not an issue
    Last edited by orestes; 24th June 2004 at 10:22 PM.

  2. #2
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    If you want to go manual, one of your biggest issues will be getting a flywheel...

    Bellhousings are being made, finally, in Melbourne I believe. These are to suit either the BA7 or BA10, from what I'm told. The BA7/4 will do the job, but you'd want a tall rear end. The BA10/5 is the right box for the job. You don't need to fiddle around with foreign boxes at all, really.

  3. #3
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Ray Bell]If you want to go manual, one of your biggest issues will be getting a flywheel... [QUOTE]

    what would be the easiest way to get my hands on a suitable flywheel, what car would it come from
    Last edited by orestes; 25th June 2004 at 01:19 AM.

  4. #4
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    There were about fifty manual box Volvos sold here, I believe...

    But other than that, your only prospects are to find a private import manual 604 wreck or to import one. There are stacks of them in the USA... check with the guys on the Peugeot-L forum, and if you're smart you'll get about ten of them in if you can. You can also get bellhousings from there, or complete boxes, but bear in mind they will be left hand drive versions so will have problems with the starter mounting fouling in power steering cars.

    Or maybe you can find a contact in England?

  5. #5
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    can i get a link ?

  6. #6
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    It's a Yahoo User Group forum... sorry, I don't have a link, but I'm sure you'll find it easily enough, even putting 'Peugeot-L' into Google will probably do it.

  7. #7
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    thanks i found it

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    There were about fifty manual box Volvos sold here, I believe...

    But other than that, your only prospects are to find a private import manual 604 wreck or to import one. There are stacks of them in the USA... check with the guys on the Peugeot-L forum, and if you're smart you'll get about ten of them in if you can. You can also get bellhousings from there, or complete boxes, but bear in mind they will be left hand drive versions so will have problems with the starter mounting fouling in power steering cars.

    Or maybe you can find a contact in England?
    The volvo flywheels were different, much thicker and heavier.You may be able to machine one down to suit. I have a volvo clutch plate, brand new, if anyone wants to investigate this avenue.

    Graham Wallis

  9. #9
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    If you want to go manual, one of your biggest issues will be getting a flywheel....
    I thought I heard Bill Hamilton say that someone told him that the flywheel from the other Douvrin factory built motors (Renault 20, Fuego, 505STI/GTI) have the same crankshaft flange bolt pattern as the Douvrin (PRV) V6. The question remaining is whether the ring gear diameter is appropriate for the V6 starter motor.

    On a different note, in a sports car body you could have the starter motor mounted above the gearbox on a custom mount, so this wouldn't matter.

    Dave
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    1984 205 GT twin carb
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  10. #10
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davemcbean
    I thought I heard Bill Hamilton say that someone told him that the flywheel from the other Douvrin factory built motors (Renault 20, Fuego, 505STI/GTI) have the same crankshaft flange bolt pattern as the Douvrin (PRV) V6. The question remaining is whether the ring gear diameter is appropriate for the V6 starter motor.

    On a different note, in a sports car body you could have the starter motor mounted above the gearbox on a custom mount, so this wouldn't matter.

    Dave
    so you could run a flywheel from a 505 STI/GTI, renault 20 or fuego ?

  11. #11
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by orestes
    so you could run a flywheel from a 505 STI/GTI, renault 20 or fuego ?
    As I said, I heard this 3rd hand, so you'll have to double check this.

    Dave
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    1984 205 GT twin carb
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    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    one word...............Volvo

    or go to the wreckers and grab PRV V6 engine

    use that in a 504 and then grab the other bits needed from a dead 604

    if there is a free 604 with next to nothing wrong then send it this way and i'll put it back on the road where it belongs

    there are far to few left now to wreck a good one to use in a 504

    the 604 guts into a 504 has been one of the killers of 604's the same as the 205 conversion will be the death of the 405 Mi-16

    i hate to think what will become of GTi-6's in the future or more so their gearbox's
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

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    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

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    Fellow Frogger! MR604's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    one word...............Volvo

    or go to the wreckers and grab PRV V6 engine

    use that in a 504 and then grab the other bits needed from a dead 604

    if there is a free 604 with next to nothing wrong then send it this way and i'll put it back on the road where it belongs

    there are far to few left now to wreck a good one to use in a 504

    the 604 guts into a 504 has been one of the killers of 604's the same as the 205 conversion will be the death of the 405 Mi-16

    i hate to think what will become of GTi-6's in the future or more so their gearbox's
    As Pugrambo said,dont wreck it just for the motor.

    If it's as good as you say, I'd be willing to buy it off you as a project car and help you find a motor and other bits.

    In a about 5 years or so, it'll be possible to put these cars on club registration and that would be a better fate for one than butchered for parts.

    Just my

    BTW I just converted my 604 over to a manual. If you want any advice just ask.

    It is possible to run power steering with a LHD bellhousing.

    A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any other invention in human history, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila. - Mitch Radcliffe

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    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    if your willing to help me find a decent PRV V6 for a project down the track in exchange (pug rambo or 2 pugs), (it doesn't really matter alot what condition its in as it will end up being rebuilt and slightly warmed eventually) then i'm more then willing to give you the details so you can salvage this 604. my dad has the full details and if you'd like i can give you the contact details to get in touch with him and then the owner about it, it had better happen soon though as if don't use this car for parts somone else, if you want it then get in touch with me, and i'll give you the details to contact my dad about it only problem is that its in queensland however it would be feasable to drive it back though if you could fix the starter motor, from what i've been told.

    contact me via private message, email or instant messenging, it would be quickest to contact me via IM as sometimes it can be a few days before i respond to email or private messages, but when ever i'm online i will be on AIM,yahoo or MSN i don't really use ICQ so add me on AIM,yahoo or MSN if you want to know more
    Last edited by orestes; 26th June 2004 at 05:13 AM.

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger! MR604's Avatar
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    Where is the car?


    A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any other invention in human history, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila. - Mitch Radcliffe

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    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    afaik its on the sunshine coast in queensland, if you don't know the sunshine coast its about an hour and a half north of brisbane on the coast. i haven't really talked much more about it with my dad, as he doesn't live here so i dont know its exact location, send me a PM,E-Mail or IM and i can put you in touch with my dad about it. it was offerd to us for free about a week ago, i'd use its parts for a project but if you really want to keep it in one piece then i think we can arange something, like i said if you could fix the starter motor then you could drive it back down south
    Last edited by orestes; 26th June 2004 at 10:16 PM.

  17. #17
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    The volvo flywheels were different, much thicker and heavier.You may be able to machine one down to suit. I have a volvo clutch plate, brand new, if anyone wants to investigate this avenue.

    Graham Wallis

    how much thicker graham ?

    makes me think a Volvo flywheel plus an adaptor plate for the bell housing may work out just right

    the extra weight of it would also lend itself to a bit more torque as well
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  18. #18
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    I'm taking 'rambo's spare starter motor to Brisbane today...

    If anyone wants to try this car, or get a permit to drive it to Bathurst or something, let me know. The starter will be there to be fitted for the purpose (and, of course, subsequent return to the 'rambo).

  19. #19
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    yes guys let me know and i can fill you in with the details of its location, AFAIK this car is quite savable and if you don't save it then either by my hands or somone elses this car will be going to peugeot hell, and all the goodies will be pulled out of it and the rest taken to the wreackers
    Last edited by orestes; 29th June 2004 at 02:14 AM.

  20. #20
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by orestes
    yes guys let me know and i can fill you in with the details of its location, AFAIK this car is quite savable and if you don't save it then either by my hands or somone elses this car will be going to peugeot hell, and all the goodies will be pulled out of it and the rest taken to the wreackers


    if you give Ray a call on 0409 063 662 and have a chat to him he could get back to whoever and go from there
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  21. #21
    Banned orestes's Avatar
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    calls been made, rambo so if your intrested get back in touch with ray and he'll give you the scoop if you need to get back in touch with me then pm me and i'll give you a number

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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Just as a suggestion, instead of getting ulcers trying to get permits and getting it running then adding the cost of air/bus fares plus petrol and all the other extras, why not give george1/8th a call via PM & ask for contact details and costs of the carrier I found for him when he got his CX freighted down to Vic from NSW?
    I think you'll find out that costwise it's a better deal all round and these guys are set up to gandle non runners and have no worries about picking up a dead (read lying flat on its guts) CX so I couldn't imagine a 604 would create too many terrors for them.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  23. #23
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    "Air/bus fares"? Alan, where is your spirit of adventure?

    Hitch hiking isn't dead yet!

  24. #24
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    "Air/bus fares"? Alan, where is your spirit of adventure?

    Hitch hiking isn't dead yet!
    I realise that Ray; but plenty of bloody hitch hikers are!!

    It'd be a braver (read sillier) man than me who'd do that trip on the thumb. It'd be my luck for the president of the Ivan Milat fan club to be my first lift going for a "pleasure trip" with Bryant's twin brother.
    In any case when you start looking at costs, 2 days wages plus petrol and you can have it on your doorstep for a fraction of the cost ven without the air & bus/train fares.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  25. #25
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    Last time I delivered a car from Harden to Brisbane, I hitched back. Caught a train out to Wacol, I must admit, but then hitched... about 4pm one day to 7pm the next, but I had a good sleep at the truckstop at Narrabri.

    Met some nice people... one truck driver went past me three times (Moree, Narrabri and Coonabarrabran) before he finally gave me a ride at Dubbo. "I didn't think you'd forgive me if I went past you again!" he said.

    Trucks are worth riding in these days, not like the times I used to go Sydney to Melbourne return for a weekend at the races (without missing any work time...)... they have real grunt, still keep moving like they used to, but now they pass the cars up the hills instead of vice versa.

    Only once have I ever felt uncomfortable hitching... though there was one bloke who tried to show me some unwanted affection!

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