GTi6 Dyno Results
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Default GTi6 Dyno Results

    Hey Peoples

    I just got my Pug Dynoed at the German Car Club Victoria(GCCV.net) Dyno Day.

    The dyno day was held at A.R.T(Teknik Tuning).

    My final result was 101kw at the wheels...it spiked to 103kw but yeah 101 was the correct figure.

    I was quite happy as i was only expecting around 90kw at the wheels.

    What are other peoples results on the dyno...like what have other peoples GTi6 put out or what is normal to put out?

    Oh also before u flame me...i know that dyno results should be taken with a grain of salt and are just a tuning tool. You dont have to tell me that as i dont really like Dyno results but yeah u can understand my excitment when i made over 100kw

    For example...other cars on the day such as a Golf GTi with chip made 98fwkw and a VW Passat 1.8T made 86fwkw. So yeah was happy to make more power than the turbos.

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    If u look at the chart the power curve starts to get all wavey and rough after 6200rpm....is this normal? Or can it be recitified by different plugs and an oil change(my pug is overdue on a oil change).

    Anyways if anyone has there dyno chart post it up as im curious as to what ur power curve looks like.....does mine look about right for peak torque and power?

    Alex
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails GTi6 Dyno Results-dyno2.jpg  
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Looks good to me. As long as the torque and power curves cross at 5200, you know its valid. In comparison:

    145 hp Mi16 - 79kW
    160 hp Mi16 with inlet cam - 100kW
    160hp Mi16, inlet cam, TB's - 110kW

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Reno's Avatar
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    how does it figure 400+ nm of torque????

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts brenno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reno
    how does it figure 400+ nm of torque????
    That figure is at the wheels. The engine torque is multiplied by the gearing.

    Is 4th or 5th gear closer to 1:1 in the GTi6 box? I can't remember.

    I think that torque output is whack. It should be linear. See attached graph to compare.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails GTi6 Dyno Results-img_0028.jpg  

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts U Turn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macquered
    That figure is at the wheels. The engine torque is multiplied by the gearing.

    Is 4th or 5th gear closer to 1:1 in the GTi6 box? I can't remember.

    I think that torque output is whack. It should be linear. See attached graph to compare.
    The torque curves on both graphs look similar. The one on WRCPUG's graph is always between 350 and 425 Nm. It would be clearer if they used two different colours for the power and torque curves instead of blue for both! Awesome engine though, putting out 80% of max. torque from just 2000 rpm!

    It looks like there's a flat spot between 4000 and 4500 rpm and it seems unusual (with respect to factory spec quotes) that the power peaks at 6000 rpm when it theoretically should do so at 6500. I'd keen on getting my car up on a dyno to see how the curves compare and whether there are those flat spots, I think that's where some proper tuning could improve drivability.
    Take the long way home....

    - 306 gti6

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! Jason20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT
    Looks good to me. As long as the torque and power curves cross at 5200, you know its valid. In comparison:

    145 hp Mi16 - 79kW
    160 hp Mi16 with inlet cam - 100kW
    160hp Mi16, inlet cam, TB's - 110kW

    wow, sure kills my miserly 82kw.

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts brenno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jastanis
    The torque curves on both graphs look similar. The one on WRCPUG's graph is always between 350 and 425 Nm. It would be clearer if they used two different colours for the power and torque curves instead of blue for both! Awesome engine though, putting out 80% of max. torque from just 2000 rpm!
    You're right, I was getting confused. It's not a bad curve now that I look at it but the linearity is more pronounced with the latter graph.

  8. #8
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    Good results there.

    I've done two dyno's with mixed results. The first gave 'engine power' at 122kw/164hp. In comparison, on the same dyno on the same day, a well kept 205GTI put out 105hp, while a 405 Diesel put out about 90hp, all on the money for rated power so I was happy with that.

    The other dyno was a Dynodynamics one which gave 83kwatw, seemed low however Cal's Supercharger Sprinter put out 89kwatw while the turbo 180's were just over 100kw with a few boost mods. In all most people thought it was reading low on the day.

    In any case, I'm very happy with the power my S16 is putting out.
    B to the R to the A from the D
    1994 MX5 Clubman...are you sure it's not French?

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason20
    wow, sure kills my miserly 82kw.
    I wouldn't too disappointed Jason. That dyno reads a bit low. Those figures I quoted are relative to yours though. Remember Owen's engine has big valves, ported, bigger cam, more CR etc.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts purrr-geot's Avatar
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    well done alex, i saw ya bro the other day, the b*tch looks just like you

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! Gak306's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jastanis
    It looks like there's a flat spot between 4000 and 4500 rpm and it seems unusual (with respect to factory spec quotes) that the power peaks at 6000 rpm when it theoretically should do so at 6500. I'd keen on getting my car up on a dyno to see how the curves compare and whether there are those flat spots, I think that's where some proper tuning could improve drivability.


    This is not uncommon, I have seen a GTi6, 206Gti, and my XT all do the same thing with the standard ECU, all 3 of them leaned off around 500rpm from the limiter, the onlt conclusion we came to is that is had to be an inbuild safety feature to protect the engine.


  12. #12
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    This is not uncommon, I have seen a GTi6, 206Gti, and my XT all do the same thing with the standard ECU, all 3 of them leaned off around 500rpm from the limiter, the onlt conclusion we came to is that is had to be an inbuild safety feature to protect the engine.

    Correct me if I m wrong.....but I was under the impression that the last thing YOU need at high RPM is a LEAN mixture....???? Infact, isn t this a major issue at high rpm in high performance engines hence better ecu s, regulators and high volume pumps.....As I see it, the factory set up leaning out at that rpm is NOT EXACTLY protecting the engine.....
    Is it possible the injectors are reaching rated flow capacity....???



    cheers

    dino

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! Gak306's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=dino]Correct me if I m wrong.....but I was under the impression that the last thing YOU need at high RPM is a LEAN mixture....???? Infact, isn t this a major issue at high rpm in high performance engines hence better ecu s, regulators and high volume pumps.....As I see it, the factory set up leaning out at that rpm is NOT EXACTLY protecting the engine.....
    Is it possible the injectors are reaching rated flow capacity....???

    Your probably right about the injectors! But if it's leaning out at those RPM it means the engine can produce no more power, I don't claim that what I wrote is the answer, just something I observed, all I know is all three cars did the same thing, 500rpm from the limiter the power curve took a down hill turn.


  14. #14
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    I understand your observations.....its just....that it seems bizzare that factory spec...would lean at those rpm (not saying your observations are not right)...

    Maybe the "ECONOMY" design restriction ie ecu/injector size vs inlet/throttle body results in a lean mix at top end.....We all know how well the pug motors breathe....maybe a fuelling issue???

    Interesting.....but i m no expert either....



    cheers

    dino

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger! winnie's Avatar
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    The factory rev limit is *usually* set 500 - 800rpm higher than the peak power rpm. The reason for this is sometimes from a performance stand point it is better to rev the engine past max power (so long as it doesn't drop off to quickly) so when you change to the next gear you are dropping the revs right into the meaty part of the torque curve.

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! MondeoST24's Avatar
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    My S16 put out 67kW atw on a Dynodynamics dyno; after chipping it improved to 78kW......

    You have to be careful with the "shootout mode" they sometime use; I've heard it can distort the figures???
    David
    Former 306 S16 owner- now own a Mondeo ST24 V6

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! Gak306's Avatar
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    In the limited time that I have been around a few different dynos, it has taught me 2 things, one is that dynos are like opinions, each one has it's own, and two only use them for fueling and tuning don't take their figures literally. Have a bench mark before and after mods and tuning, that's the only real comparison.


  18. #18
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Hey Vic, where have you been? Welcome back

  19. #19
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MondeoST24

    You have to be careful with the "shootout mode" they sometime use; I've heard it can distort the figures???
    No, quite the opposite. Shootout mode was introduced by Dyno Dynamics to eliminate user inputs, so comparisons could be made between their dynos. Otherwise the user/operator can change variables enormously.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger! Gak306's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    Hey Vic, where have you been? Welcome back


    Hey Lincoln,

    How you going, my work has got me chasing my own tail, and considering I don't have a tail you can see that this exercise is pointless!!



    Vic.

  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! Gak306's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT
    No, quite the opposite. Shootout mode was introduced by Dyno Dynamics to eliminate user inputs, so comparisons could be made between their dynos. Otherwise the user/operator can change variables enormously.


    Unless I'm mistaken one of the few inputs is the calculation to do with the tyre diameter.

    Please circle the correct anwser.....YES/NO!!


  22. #22
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gak306

    Unless I'm mistaken one of the few inputs is the calculation to do with the tyre diameter.

    Please circle the correct anwser.....YES/NO!!

    I would of thought tyre diameter had little to do with it as the dyno is giving you a figure of the tractive power put through the wheels to the ground. The benefit a smaller diameter would have in leverage would be lost to speed, therefore cancelling each other out.
    B to the R to the A from the D
    1994 MX5 Clubman...are you sure it's not French?

  23. #23
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    I'll find out tomorrow when I'm at the dyno. I'm planning to do my race car and the freshly rebuilt Mi16 that made 79kW above. It's just had it's inlet cam changed, so that will be a valid comparison for the cam swap.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    well done alex, i saw ya bro the other day, the b*tch looks just like you
    u reckon he looks like me?

    hahah go up and pretend to car jack him tell him hes "***king dead" or sum shit like that hahaah
    Oi Asanka u emptied ur PM Inbox yet? I cant send u any messages cause it was full

    Umm what size are the Gti6 Injectors?

    I think sumone took Video footage of my car on the dyno so yeah ill try find it and post it up or sumthing.


    ahaha the torque and power curves confused the shit outta me first time i looked at them cause they joined eachother and i got confused which was which

    In the limited time that I have been around a few different dynos, it has taught me 2 things, one is that dynos are like opinions, each one has it's own, and two only use them for fueling and tuning don't take their figures literally. Have a bench mark before and after mods and tuning, that's the only real comparison.

    Agreed....but i was just curious what power id make and for $35 why not.
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  25. #25
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gak306

    Hey Lincoln,

    How you going, my work has got me chasing my own tail, and considering I don't have a tail you can see that this exercise is pointless!!



    Vic.
    Good mate. It's been a while. I feel some mid week bevvies are in order

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