Rear diff for DANGEL
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  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default Rear diff for DANGEL

    I am getting a bit of work done on my 505 4x4 Dangel and the mechanics says he is not happy with the noise from the rear diff (LSD from 505 GTI wagon).
    it has always had a bit of noise from the diff but I have never been overly concerned about it, I just put it down to it being a bit agricultural. The mechanic wants to take the diff out and send it away to have it rebuilt.

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    does anyone have any experience of rebuilding a 505 GTI wagon diff and who would be able to competently do this work in Queensland preferably?

    regards Graham

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts Beano's Avatar
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    You could perhaps ask Lewin at Peugeot Spare Parts.

    Or Peugeotech.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beano View Post
    You could perhaps ask Lewin at Peugeot Spare Parts.

    Or Peugeotech.
    OK, I will ring Lew tomorrow. Thanks Graham

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    I'd think finding a known good spare may be more cost effective.
    Mutual Respect is Contagious


  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    I'd think finding a known good spare may be more cost effective.
    I have access to one which is very quite. I am not convinced that there is too much wrong with the diff in the car but these modern mechanics panic if they hear something unusual. Having driven Peugeots for 40 years I have gotten used to their quirky ways and noises. That said, I might do a swap and see what happens.

    graham

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    Hi
    I am not familiar with that diff so this is a general comment. When diffs get noisy, as in whines or hums, the cause is usually the bearings not the actual gears. The bearing wear lets the gears move from the set position and so they cause noise. As bearings are made to very strict tolerances it is quite feasible to replace them without changing the original shims/settings and that long complicated setup in the books is not really necessary. After all the diff has been running with say a couple of thou slack instead of a preload or the pinion has been even more slack instead of preloaded for ? how long ?

    Just some food for thought. My limited experience. Obviously if there has been a lubricant loss or a breakage or similar this does not apply.
    Jaahn

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaahn View Post
    Hi
    I am not familiar with that diff so this is a general comment. When diffs get noisy, as in whines or hums, the cause is usually the bearings not the actual gears. The bearing wear lets the gears move from the set position and so they cause noise. As bearings are made to very strict tolerances it is quite feasible to replace them without changing the original shims/settings and that long complicated setup in the books is not really necessary. After all the diff has been running with say a couple of thou slack instead of a preload or the pinion has been even more slack instead of preloaded for ? how long ?

    Just some food for thought. My limited experience. Obviously if there has been a lubricant loss or a breakage or similar this does not apply.
    Jaahn
    It is not so much a whine or hum but more a grinding noise. It has been doing it for the 100000 Klms I have owned the car so I have just become used to it. To my knowledge it has never run out of oil but I do know it has covered 100000 Klms of very hard rough sandy driving since I imported it into AUSTRALIA 9 years ago. I will get the guys to pull it out and have a look at it.
    Graham

  8. #8
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    Make sure the ratio is the same as the front diff.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dangel 1 View Post
    I have access to one which is very quite. I am not convinced that there is too much wrong with the diff in the car but these modern mechanics panic if they hear something unusual. Having driven Peugeots for 40 years I have gotten used to their quirky ways and noises. That said, I might do a swap and see what happens.

    graham

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Make sure the ratio is the same as the front diff.
    Good advice Graham.

    i think I will play some think music for a while and try to work it out.

    i have sent a message to the guy I bought it off in France to see what he says. If I do anything I will probably get the rear one done up.
    any suggestions as to who could do that for me when I am ready?

    graham

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    Colin Hague but he is very busy as you know.

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Good point. The Dangel ratio is probably the same as Mi16x4.

    '92 205 Mi16
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  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Roland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangel 1 View Post
    . . . (LSD from 505 GTI wagon) . . .
    Is the LSD arrangement in the DANGEL the same as the Torsen diff in the Mi16x4 mentioned by PeterT?

    Cheers
    Roland

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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roland View Post
    Is the LSD arrangement in the DANGEL the same as the Torsen diff in the Mi16x4 mentioned by PeterT?

    Cheers
    Roland

    i do not know the answer to this question. I am waiting for Dangel in France to wake up and tell me.

    all I know is the Dangel manual says the ratio is 8x39

    graham

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    That's a lot lower than the Mi16x4, which is 13 x 43, 3.307:1

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT View Post
    That's a lot lower than the Mi16x4, which is 13 x 43, 3.307:1
    WOW, 13x43! I would never be able to hang onto the beast?
    Thanks Graham

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    It doesn't really mean anything, as the output of the transfer case is 43x13, cancelling each other out. The 14x62 (4.43:1) cwp in the gearbox does the final reduction.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  17. #17
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    Dangel s Diesel but has much bigger tyres than 405 Mi16.

  18. #18
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    Was this the Dangel that I saw with Mark Dyson in Perth some years back? Good luck with the diff. It seemed a helluva robust car!
    JohnW

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Dangel s Diesel but has much bigger tyres than 405 Mi16.
    France has woken up and the news is interesting.
    the front diff is different from the rear. They are both 8x39 ratio which is unique to Dangel and not shared with any other Peugeot.

    you can't fit a front to the back or back to the front.

    the front diff can either be LSD or not. We are not sure what mine is but I have a reconditioned front diff with LSD coming from France. Need to get an overdraft to pay for it. My front diff is OK, BUT I may as well put a new one in.

    my Dangel expert is not aware of any 8x39 rear Dangel diffs that are available in France so I am going to get mine reconditioned locally by Diff Lapping in Brisbane. Again the cost is out of the ballpark. Never mind Dangel One is worth it.

    8x39 ratio diffs are not used in any other Peugeots, only Dangel's. So there we have it. Suck it up Sunshine. You wanted a unique wonderful vehicle and you have one. I am happy.

    thanks for all the input.

    regards Graham

  20. #20
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    Yep, that was it. Since then I have done about 100000klms of very rough running it has performed very well for me.
    graham

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangel 1 View Post
    i do not know the answer to this question. I am waiting for Dangel in France to wake up and tell me.

    all I know is the Dangel manual says the ratio is 8x39

    graham
    in the danger manuals I have looked at its shows a number of options

  22. #22
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    The front diff is the same as 505 rear just a lot of ribbing ground down to fit

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by craig latta View Post
    in the danger manuals I have looked at its shows a number of options
    I think we have come to the conclusion that we better take the diff centres out and check the ratios before ordering stuff from France.

    i could be that the DIFFS have been changed in the past 25 or so years. So out they come.
    graham

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangel 1 View Post
    I think we have come to the conclusion that we better take the diff centres out and check the ratios before ordering stuff from France.

    i could be that the DIFFS have been changed in the past 25 or so years. So out they come.
    graham
    Just to wrap us this thread here is the latest on Dangel diffs.

    The diffs are exclusive to Dangel and not interchangeable with any other Peugeot. They are 8x39 ratio. The front is different from the back.
    Both diffs are LSD.
    My front diff is OK.
    My source of information and parts from Dangel has a reconditioned front diff. I might get it and put it in my parts department but he does not currently have a rear diff, so he is on the hunt for a good one.
    in the meantime my car is OK to drive just a bit noisy from rear diff-not that it bothers me but best to replace it as soon as I can.
    my Dangel man says it is impossible to satisfactorily re lap a Dangel diff and has supplied an explanation of why he says that and the Diff Lapping company in Brisbane have accepted his statement.
    Thanks to everyone for their support.
    Graham

  25. #25
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    Try a bottle or 2 of Nulon diff treatment in the meantime. It will shut it up and do no harm for less than $20. Ditto the appropriate ones for gearbox and engine.

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