Rim-Tyre sizes and failures
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  1. #1
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    Default Rim-Tyre sizes and failures

    Looking to upgrade my rims & tyres, but have been warned not to go to 17's as i'll risk side wall failure...

    Please post up:

    Rim Size:
    Tyre Profile:
    Tyre PSI:
    Number of Side Wall Failures:
    Number of Damaged Rims:

    please try to keep this thread "clean" of unnecessary chit-chat so i can tally it all up!

    cheers

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  2. #2
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I reckon you'll have sidewall failures, and the handling willbe compromised.

    You want stats or people's opinions? Seems a funny way to go about justifying your desire to get 17s on your Clio.

    With very few people on here with 17s, you're probably going to get 5 responses.

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts brenno's Avatar
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    For a car the size of a Cliosport, I reckon 15" wheels are nigh on perfect. Keep in mind though that I have no idea what I'm talking about. I have no real-world experience and have limited social skills. I don't easily fall into the fashion-driven stereotype that would go for oversized wheels.

    You have to weigh up the following negatives;

    * Rotational weight increase (makes you slower, affects braking)
    * Unsprung weight increase (your struts have to work harder to settle wheel oscillations, on a hard drive your dampers will get bloody hot and not be as effective. Will also decrease life of dampers and other suspension components)
    * Initial cost
    * Ongoing cost (good tyres cost heaps more)
    * Possible insurance impact
    * Congratulations, you now own a visibly modified car. Say hello to changed attitudes from other motorists. Oh, yeah.....the cops too.

    In a nutshell, if you appreciate driving then you'll go out and spend good money on nice rubber. The standard wheels are round, strong, light and do the job. If you like Oxford Street, go and get the big round shiny things and soak it all up.

  4. #4
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Not to mention greater chance of aquaplaning, if you go too wide. As long as you stick one or two sizes up in width, you should be OK. The extra weight of the rim should help in dispersing the water.

    I struggle to find the benefits of running 17s on that car, but I'm sure people with 17s can post their comments on it's pros over the 15s.

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    sidewall failure, pfft, not likely.

    17's arent really that big, i'm sure there are clios rolling round on 19's in the UK.

    never had any probs with my 215/40-17's, it's easier to scratch the rim because of the flat sidewall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by macquered
    I don't easily fall into the fashion-driven stereotype that would go for oversized wheels.

    I can think of one aesthetic disadvantage of the 17"s - they make your brakes look really really tiny on the Clio Sport.

    Don't know if Dave172 still frequents AF as he's moved to a WRX after his car drowned, but he did have 17s and raced the car around Sandown and Philip Island. I guess you can PM him.

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    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Just to answer the question, I've had or know of the following failures:

    Focus ST170 - 215/45R17 running Continental ContisportContacts - sidewall blister (failure). 4000kms old.

    Peugeot 307 XSI - 205/45R17 running Pirelli PZero Rosso - sidewall blister (failure). 200kms old. Another guy on the 307 list has had a similar problem.

    RenaultSport Clio (MY4) - 215/40R17 running Kumho Ecsa 711 - sidewall blister, ran high pressures to protect rims. - Again a compromise I would not recommend, as such a change is for looks, not performance. What do you want from your car, Nate?

    Subaru Liberty Heritage 2.5 Estate - 195/50R16 (or are they 15s?) - Avon ZZ1s - Both fronts - multiple sidewall failures after less than 5000kms.

    In my opinion, it's an inherent risk you run with low profile tyres and crap Sydney, pothole ridden roads. Then again, it's not just Sydney city, it's any country road too.
    Last edited by GTI124; 18th March 2004 at 11:30 PM.

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    Fellow Frogger! Andreas's Avatar
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    that's some maor bad luck with your tyres, never had a problem with mine except for punctures caused by nails.

  9. #9
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andreas
    that's some maor bad luck with your tyres, never had a problem with mine except for punctures caused by nails.
    Melbourne's relatively flat roads are in much better condition than Sydney roads.

    Dave's recent sidewall failure, he stopped the car and took photos of the pothole and damage to the tire. I can't be bothered, myself. I prefer to drive. Which is the point Brenno is making, do you want to cruise or do want to drive? That's the difference between 16 and 17", IMHO.

  10. #10
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    What am i after?

    Mainly looks, and of course da Honeyz...
    Want to make it stand out a little more, give it a sportier but still classy look.

    And the speedo is apparently out, so i want to increse my overall wheel size a bit anyway!

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts N5GTi6's Avatar
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    Staying right on topic...........not........

    I looked at downsizing from 15's to 14's to get the shorter gearing, lower unsprung weight, cheaper replacement tyres that go with smaller wheels and tyres. Trouble is, all the 14's I could find looked like poo - so I guess I'm also driven by fashion and not function as well!

    Good luck with the 17's !
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  12. #12
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate
    What am i after?

    Mainly looks, and of course da Honeyz...
    Want to make it stand out a little more, give it a sportier but still classy look.

    And the speedo is apparently out, so i want to increse my overall wheel size a bit anyway!
    Well, get yourself the 17s and a digital camera to stop and take photos of your damaged tyres and rims. Question answered.

  13. #13
    Member Foxman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    Well, get yourself the 17s and a digital camera to stop and take photos of your damaged tyres and rims. Question answered.

    Well ive had 17's on car for about 6 years now and ive never seen or had a damaged tyre. Ive hit some pretty dam big potholes with them and mind you its not a good feeling ive never damaged a rim let alone a tyre. As for looks they look great on the clio's the clio's mags just arnet my cup of tea. As for saying that people with 17's go cruise Oxford street well thats just damm stupid. As for just go and buy good tyres for 15" you can get just as good tyres for 17" tiger!

    So nate go and get your 17"s so we can go for a cruise down to Brighten le sands and hang with our kind as some of you users suggest.

    If you don't want to get 17's just my

    Grant.

    For the record i have 17" Racinghart with Continentals 205/40/17

  14. #14
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    I'm not quite sure I said that. I notice you didn't address any of my other points either.

    Are you sure there is more choice in tyres in 17" than in 15"? That doesn't sound right.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by macquered
    For a car the size of a Cliosport, I reckon 15" wheels are nigh on perfect. Keep in mind though that I have no idea what I'm talking about. I have no real-world experience and have limited social skills. I don't easily fall into the fashion-driven stereotype that would go for oversized wheels.

    You have to weigh up the following negatives;

    * Rotational weight increase (makes you slower, affects braking)
    * Unsprung weight increase (your struts have to work harder to settle wheel oscillations, on a hard drive your dampers will get bloody hot and not be as effective. Will also decrease life of dampers and other suspension components)
    * Initial cost
    * Ongoing cost (good tyres cost heaps more)
    * Possible insurance impact
    * Congratulations, you now own a visibly modified car. Say hello to changed attitudes from other motorists. Oh, yeah.....the cops too.

    In a nutshell, if you appreciate driving then you'll go out and spend good money on nice rubber. The standard wheels are round, strong, light and do the job. If you like Oxford Street, go and get the big round shiny things and soak it all up.

    Well here i go

    The wheels i bought are lighter than the orig wheels and it hasnt affected braking in anyway. Iam not a big fan of the stockies so i was going to replace them anyway. Iam not to worried about spending the money on tyres as you get what you pay. Insurance were fine as long as you only go 1" out. You can go as high as you want.As for changed attitudes havent noticed any and cops havent bothered with me.

    So i hope ive answered all your questions.

    Grant

  16. #16
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    What happened to 16" ???

    Rims, tyres both cheaper.
    Chance of damage over 17" reduced.

    Got to stick to the rules anyway .. have to check NSW but in WA they are.

    (a) Rim width must not exceed the maximum rim width specified by the manufacturer by more than 25mm (1") (for passenger vehicles manufactured after 1st January 1973, the manufacturers rim width shall be taken as that specified on the tyre placard).

    In any event, rim width shall not exceed 177.8 mm (7") unless specified by the manufacturer as standard equipment for the vehicle in question. No increase in rim width is permitted for vehicles fitted with original equipment rims in excess of 177.8 mm (7") width.
    (b) The wheel is contained completely within the body work of the vehicle which includes acceptable flares.
    (c) The wheel does not foul any part of the body or suspension under all conditions of travel
    (d) The vehicle handling is not impaired in any way.
    (e) The tyre to rim fitment must be in accordance with the Tyre and Rim Association Manual.
    (f) Rim diameters must be the same as specified by the manufacturer.
    (g) The wheel must be one designed for use with the vehicle with respect to bolt pitch circle and wheel nut tapers
    (h) The track must not be increased by more than 25mm (1") over the maximum specified by the manufacturer.etc.
    (i) All wheels must be the same size, profile and bolt pattern.
    (j) Vehicles required to comply with Australian Design Rule 24, "Tyre & Rim Selection" must continue to comply with this Design Rule (contact the Department of Transport and Regional Services for more details).
    (k) The fitment of so called "plus one" and "plus two" and tyres is acceptable providing :
    the overall diameter of the large rims fitted with the lower profile tyres do not exceed the overall diameter

    all tyres and rims fitted to the vehicle are of the same size and profile

    with the exemption of item (f), the tyres and rims are in conformity with the requirements specified above in items (a) to (j).

    (l) Reducing the wheel track less than the original manufacturers specification is not permitted, as this may reduce vehicle stability.


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  17. #17
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I think you're lucky that you've hit potholes and not had tyre damage. What tyres are you running? What PSI are you running? I know Dave runs very high pressures to protect his rims.

    I, personally, think that if Renault's biggest size they chose on their 182 Clio Cup are still 16s, it says something about the best size on that car.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    I think you're lucky that you've hit potholes and not had tyre damage. What tyres are you running? What PSI are you running? I know Dave runs very high pressures to protect his rims.

    I, personally, think that if Renault's biggest size they chose on their 182 Clio Cup are still 16s, it says something about the best size on that car.
    Ive had tyres from dunlop,yoko's,falken,toyo and now i have Conti's. Iam running 32 psi in the front and 30 in the rear. Ive never had a problem. My dad has 18" RS4 rims on his A4 Quatto and he doesn't have a problem either. Maybe iam just lucky.

    Grant

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    Fellow Frogger! Andreas's Avatar
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    Foxman bro, now that you've got fully sik 17's yous should come down to chapel st, we do laps all night hey re....why else would you want 17's?

    i got a spare set of neons and led's for you.

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts brenno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foxman
    The wheels i bought are lighter than the orig wheels and it hasnt affected braking in anyway.
    Are you sure about that? How did you weigh them and what were the figures?

    A rotational weight increase will affect braking whether you like it or not. You can't escape physics.

  21. #21
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foxman
    Ive had tyres from dunlop,yoko's,falken,toyo and now i have Conti's. Iam running 32 psi in the front and 30 in the rear. Ive never had a problem. My dad has 18" RS4 rims on his A4 Quatto and he doesn't have a problem either. Maybe iam just lucky.

    Grant
    Maybe I'm the unlucky one. I have seen so many cars with sidewall blisters, I find it amazing that you haven't had such an experience. I'm only giving my first hand experience with tyres of such low profile.

    I'd be interested to know how the Clio rides with 17s at 32 PSI. You'll have to come up for the next meet up. Are you in Sydney much?

  22. #22
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    Clio Super 1600 rally car runs 17" wheels for tarmac rallies. As for side wall failure, it may just require more frequent preventative maintenance, make sure the pressures are right etc. I would like 17s on my clio but only after a lot of other little details are taken care of, and that's not going to happen for a while yet, if at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    I reckon you'll have sidewall failures, and the handling willbe compromised.

    You want stats or people's opinions? Seems a funny way to go about justifying your desire to get 17s on your Clio.

    With very few people on here with 17s, you're probably going to get 5 responses.
    I have a friend in Adelaide who's running 17s on his 205 GTI. I could ask him if he's got an Aussiefrogs login...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    Maybe I'm the unlucky one. I have seen so many cars with sidewall blisters, I find it amazing that you haven't had such an experience. I'm only giving my first hand experience with tyres of such low profile.

    I'd be interested to know how the Clio rides with 17s at 32 PSI. You'll have to come up for the next meet up. Are you in Sydney much?

    She runs great on that psi. Ive never had a problem with them. The ride feels the same as it does on stockies its not harsh or sloppy.

    I live in lane cove so when ever your ready give me a yell id be more than happy to take you for a spin.

    But as some people have said we can only cruise oxford st thoe

    Grant

  25. #25
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by winnie
    Clio Super 1600 rally car runs 17" wheels for tarmac rallies. As for side wall failure, it may just require more frequent preventative maintenance, make sure the pressures are right etc. I would like 17s on my clio but only after a lot of other little details are taken care of, and that's not going to happen for a while yet, if at all.
    Well, as a self confessed tyre freak, I can say that I do look after my tyres.

    Grant, I thought you were in Wollongong...maybe you should update your profile. I thought you lived up here, from Nate's reports, but your profile threw me out.

    Meet you at the Burdekin and we'll cruise up to Paddington. Pop down to Bondi Beach, and then back for another pass?

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