Club motorsport The RISKS
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  1. #1
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    Club motorsport The RISKS

    I went to Sandown Racing Circuit for the free Saturday of the weekends activities of the Vic motor racing champ series, while perusing the pit area, i came across the remains of an altercation earlier in the Sports Car race, an Elfin clubman that had been resting on it's ROLL Bar, requiring a full body kit & probably a new Chassis, the other car a Lotus Elise, at a rough guess i'd say a write off, i hope their race car insurance was paid up !!!!!!! All this brought thoughts of the risk involved.
    While the risk of physical injury or death is reasonably remote in sprints & hillclimbs, there is the potential for Serious damage to your pride and joy, The kinetic energy stored in even a small car like my R10 doing 160kph coming into a corner has huge potenitial risk. I know as i was very lucky & had 25 yrs experience when on cup day 2001 at 5400rpm in top gear, i applied the whoa pedal very firmly, and heard a loud snap noise & lost all steering, straight off the end of the main straight & into the dirt, very f----ing scary. Infact i'd broken the eye off the end of the steering rack.
    Fortunately none of the other 7 cars were anywhere near me at the time.
    If driving your road car ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND that it is to be driven home again.
    Two things had stuck in my mind "yes i do have one" that were said during my race license evaluation back in 1974. If you have a $2 Head buy a $2 Helmet (Very profound & spoken by Mr Alan Moffat" the other was until you had your first, 360 degree spin on dry bitumen you're not trying and haven't found yours or the cars limits, this test day was 2x15 lap tests, performance evaluated & discussed after each race and a 20 lap final after which your licence was awarded or you were told to try another time.
    Just to set the scene normally sedans would run seperately to open wheelers, however on this day it was deemed there was not enough of either, to run seperately, so the field of aboul 20 of us consisted of brand new A9X Torana, FJ's, EH's, DB5 Masserati, my R8 road car hehe, F5000, F3's, Fford's, Fv's, on Calder Raceway at the same time, as my chinese mate said, valy intalesting!
    For the 2 x 15 lappers, i diced with the Masserati, i's pass him under brakes, and as soon as we were out of the corner he'd cut me off, literally.
    At the second evaluation briefing he was told he was a mobile chickane and to go away and learn to drive before trying again, that must have killed the poor bugger's ego.
    CARS are not Toys, in the right hands with good training they are an excellent tool. In the wrong hands they're a lethal weapon, & i'd put 60% of all drivers in this latter group. Please don't use this as a springboard to start another go nowhere thread, we're now 1500+ strong & with that many varied opinions on how to fix this situation. That it goes nowhere, i'm simply making a statement that should be obvious to all readers if not believed!
    Cheers cheers!

    <small>[ 20 July 2003, 02:03 PM: Message edited by: Damien Gardner ]</small>

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    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    Damien,

    thank you for that post. I totally agree. I aguess I (and some others) get rather excited about the track days and forget a lot of the forum readers may assume we just go at 101% ability for 100% of the time.
    I am a firm believer that driver education should be mandatory and that is also true for the sport events. Normal licence in no way prepares you for the track sessions. And like on the road some people do not use their heads or rear view mirrors and lead to dangerous situations.
    When on the track (especially during open days) remember that the guy beside you might be totally consumed in his drive and may not even realise you are beside him.
    Take a breather, cool your brakes and give yourself a gap you can try chasing down next lap.

    And finally.
    There is no point proving you are faster if it is going to lead to an accident or loss of friendship.

    cheers
    Voytek
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  3. #3
    1000+ Posts silverexec's Avatar
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    Damien Gardner:
    ... he was told he was a mobile chickane and to go away and learn to drive before trying again, that must have killed the poor bugger's ego.
    tekkie:
    I am a firm believer that driver education should be mandatory and that is also true for the sport events. Normal licence in no way prepares you for the track sessions.
    I thought these track sessions were a way for people to fang their cars around and discover how their cars handle.

    As someone who is yet to discover the limits of my car and how to control it properly, I was hoping that I would learn at one of these events. After reading through these posts, I'm now feeling a bit apprehensive about doing so. I didn't realise everyone went around the track all at the same time. I don't want to get in someone's way and cause damage, if (or more accurately, when) I happen to loose control around a bend or something.

    So if you guys are saying that I should have some sort of experience before getting on the track, where would I be able to get this experience? I guess I need to know someone with a farm paddock somewhere...

    Cheers,
    Richard
    - Richard

    Now: 405 SRI D70 '93
    - 2.0L manual
    Earlier: 505 GTi Executive '85
    - hence "Silver Exec"...
    25 GTX '86
    - manual conversion

  4. #4
    Sense Pug307's Avatar
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    silverexec:
    I guess I need to know someone with a farm paddock somewhere...
    That's probably more useful for motorkhana practise

    Driving on a track is a different kettle of fish -doing both side by side at DECA last year was an experience.

    I guess the tyres last longer if you do it in a paddock

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
    Rendezvous Adelaide 2005

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    Silverexec,

    from my experience (1st time on the track was march this year, and I have since been 5 times):

    1. The insurance is void (unless you get racing insurance) as soon as you enter. If you are not comfortable with damaging your car and paying for it you may not enjoy yourself. Having said that...
    2. I did two trips to Wakefield before doing advanced driving course and at no time did I feel that my car was in any danger. If you drive with people you consider to be responsible and you are in turn you will be fine. Advanced driving course gives you shortcuts and prevents you getting bad habits or injuring yourself whilst learning.
    3. bearing #2 in mind, I have been to the track where cowboys drove like they were on the last lap fighting for bathurst podium. At times like that I take a brake from driving, park the car and watch as the hoons go around and inevitably spin to much enjoyment of others watching. It is in the track owners best interests that everyone gets a safe go and the marshals will quiet often have a quiet word to the offenders.
    4. Passing around corners IS NOT permitted at Wakefield only on straights, and most (NOT ALL ) drivers realise a faster car is behind them and let you pass safely.
    5. Go to one of those events, (entry is free to Wakefield, I am not sure about others) and see if you would be comfortable.

    ***** There is ALWAYS RISK involved with driving a car, and at speed events where you are driving faster than normal it is magnified, but after all thats the point. Otherwise you wouldnt learn. *****

    Does that help?
    cheers
    Voytek
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  6. #6
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    silverexec,
    If you attend a club sprint meeting, they are usually started in groups of 4 with 8 cars on the track at a time, You are NOT Racing each other, it is you & your car against the clock. Event organisers go to lots of trouble to group cars of same type spec's together, and on the warm up lap the faster ones usually pass the slower cars, you are also able to speak to officials and ask to be last in your group, and therefore don't need to worry about traffic, unless your slow enough to have those ahead of you catch up in 3 laps.
    In my first post, i was describing going for my full racing license, not a level 2S club sport license, prior to doing the full licence prac circuit test a full day seminar must be attended to learn, cornering theory, braking points, Flags and driving conduct. All totally different to the advanced driving courses. As i understand it these advanced courses deal with avioding skids, not controlling them once they've happened,as well as other thingssuch as, safe braking to a stop, correct use of ABS etc. Race cars don't have ABS (absolutely bloody stupid) braking, yes they sometimes have traction control but that is totally different.
    I wasn't trying to scare anyone off, it is several hundred percent safer than normal road driving, for a start you're all supposed to be going in the one direction, oooopses excepted. In 30 yrs of club sport, the only damage body wise i've done, has been broken spoilers from excursions off track & a friend put my R8 into the armco railing, at Morwell hillclimb on one occasion, he never got another drive from me lol,
    Next time i'm going to Morwell for a test day i'll post on here for anyone interested in doing som laps, as a member of the club, with a key i can go on any day the track is not booked & take friends for a days fun.
    renault_ cheers! dance cheers! renault_
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts silverexec's Avatar
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    Ok, that does clear a few things up. I'm intending on doing an advanced driving course when I can afford it and when the Pug's brought up to scratch. After my little prang, my confidence has been deflated and I'm worried about doing any more damage to the Pug, which I guess is the reason for my apprehension. You guys are right, I really just have to come along one day and check things out to see how I feel about joining in.

    Definitely keep us posted on the Morwell thing, I'd be very interested in coming along to see how things are done.

    Cheers,
    Richard
    - Richard

    Now: 405 SRI D70 '93
    - 2.0L manual
    Earlier: 505 GTi Executive '85
    - hence "Silver Exec"...
    25 GTX '86
    - manual conversion

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    M8, i am hoping to attend my first track day at Wakefield on the 4th ..... and quite frankly i'm a little apprehensive and very very nervous. I suspect (hope) this is a normal feeling, however i have comfort in the fact that most there will be my M8's from this forum, who i trust will look after me.

    I've just gotta give it a go!
    ashleyt

    --------
    1993 205GTI Sorrento Green
    1990 205GTI Red - Track Car ("431")

    EC:2:02.18, WP:1:16.07, OP 54.27, OPGP 1:28.83, Huntley 32.34

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    Don't worry M8's the butterflies are normal and are there b4 each & every event, they dissapear the moment the light goes green or the flag drops, go for it & have a great time!!!!!!!!!
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! MYT205's Avatar
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    Ashley.

    I was as nervous as anything before I got on the track with everyone in March. But as soon as I hit that first corner adrenalin and concentration took over and then its drive like you wished you could every day.

    I had an absolute ball and found out twice what happens when things go astray. I had 2 spins but because its in such a controlled environment I was able to not sustain any damage to the car or myself.

    Track days are hard on your car, and there is always the possibility that something may happen ending in a dented ego and dented panels. That is why a number of us now have a 2nd car/race car to do these sorts of things in. That way we can still drive to work the next day without having to worry about fixing the car first.

    After one time I am hooked and absolutely dieing for my next time out.

    Darren

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    I agree Darren, motorsport takes driving to a level unachievable on the road, And the adrenaline rush is one ripper of a high, i'm usually very exhausted after a days competition, however i intend to go for as long as my health hangs on.
    renault_ dance renault_ dance renault_ dance renault_
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  12. #12
    Member McPug's Avatar
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    I was at Sandown on the weekend also, and I've got pictures of those two cars that got damaged. (just don't know how to put them up here )

    That Elise has been worse than that before, he smashed it at Sandown a year or two ago in the wet. I think the driver has a bigger wallet than brain...

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    Darren has hit the nail on the head. I was exactly in the same boat as him with regards to track days. Needless to say one Wakefield was enough to hook me right in.
    There is always a chance of damage to the car that is being driven hard. Last week during a track day a Honda driver is facing a large bill after he went from 4th to 1st eek! and promptly stuffed up his car.
    but...
    I have spoken to marshalls on the Wakefield track and they remember 1 accident this year where a car sustained a large amount of damage during an open day and it involved two mates passing each other in the middle of the corner. As the rules stipulate that is not allowed and those two paid the price. So I would say the odds are in your favour if you keep your head on.

    I get butterflies each and single time I am coming up to Wakefield. They dissapear as soon as the 1st corner comes up and adrenalin kicks in. And I imagine the aprehension will double for speed events in competition mode.

    Voytek
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  14. #14
    XTC
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    Does anyone have copies of the type of disclaimer forms that people usually sign for these days ???

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
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  15. #15
    XTC
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    parry:
    “I have read the Supplementary Regulations issued for this Meeting and agree to be bound by them.”
    Cheers - does anyone have any sup regs for a gymkhana, motorkhana or other like events ???

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    I have the car regulations and the entry form for the last two CSCA events in NSW (Wakefield and the upcoming Eastern Creek). Also included is the car class regulations for the CAMS supersprint events.
    <a href="http://www.users.on.net/vboehm/regulations" target="_blank">HERE</a>
    Some additional information can be found <a href="http://www.pau7l.com/csca/calendar.htm" target="_blank">HERE</a> (following links on right hand side)
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  17. #17
    XTC
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    tekkie:
    I have the car regulations and the entry form for the last two CSCA events in NSW (Wakefield and the upcoming Eastern Creek
    Cheers .. Thanx for the links I'll PM you.

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    Don't know about Calder & Winton prac days, the hillclimb free prac days ie. available only to club members & friends, as long as the club member is present, there is no disclaimer. Your there because YOU wanted to be, the only requirement is that there are at least 2 people & you have a mobile phone in case of problems, You are there of your own volition and no insurance of any type covers you. club events are covered by a set of Suplementary regulations as laid down by CAMS and cams & the clubs public liability applies, this of course only covers injury to the public, oifficial or competitor involved in any incident with a vehicle.

    <small>[ 23 July 2003, 12:58 PM: Message edited by: Damien Gardner ]</small>
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  19. #19
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    Clubs with a web site, usually publish Sup regs on the site, for downloading for entry purposes. cheers!
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

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