Vedette on Ebay
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Thread: Vedette on Ebay

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    Default Vedette on Ebay

    Hope somebody can save this 'verdete' (sic) from the hotrodders.

    http://cars2.ebay.com.au/SIMCA-VERDE...mZ170578999548

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    the famous 18E pug206gti's Avatar
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  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default Vedette on ebay

    With the scarcity and cost of Vedette parts your bank account would be down at least $15,000 before the car was on the road .......... think the hot-rodders are the only one's with money under the mattress.

    JP - SIMCA MAN

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts bluey504's Avatar
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    Default Simca street machine....

    If I was to attempt to make this into a street machine I'd follow a slightly different path and use a fuel injected flat head Ford, new technology onto an old tech block but with the correct look.
    The problem is going to be the trim and little bits that end up costing the Earth plus a couple of small satellites orbiting a couple of the neighbours!
    Whilst not condoning the idea of the restoration it may not be practical cost wise and a very unique street machine may come out of it yet!
    I'd love to do it but Santa (and SWMBO) aren't going to be that generous!

  5. #5
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    Default vedette on ebay

    Why not a Windsor V8?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vedette on Ebay-pp04.jpg  

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts bluey504's Avatar
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    To keep it true to type, a Ford V8 flathead (Y series from the Customline series) for a French V8 flathead as per the Simca.
    Also it's just a touch stranger, any tatoo'd/mullet owner/wearer can stick a 'modern' V8 in with the available after market go faster bits. It's takes a few more grey cells to actually be unique.
    Plus the fact I can get my hands onto a couple of Y-series flatheads cheap and a Paxton blower for the equivalent of "My weight in beer".

    I'll keep one eye on e-bay and the other on the Lotto numbers!

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! sideways_505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluey504 View Post
    To keep it true to type, a Ford V8 flathead (Y series from the Customline series) for a French V8 flathead as per the Simca.
    Also it's just a touch stranger, any tatoo'd/mullet owner/wearer can stick a 'modern' V8 in with the available after market go faster bits. It's takes a few more grey cells to actually be unique.
    Plus the fact I can get my hands onto a couple of Y-series flatheads cheap and a Paxton blower for the equivalent of "My weight in beer".

    I'll keep one eye on e-bay and the other on the Lotto numbers!
    Y series flathead? Are you confusing the Flathead and the Y block? Customlines had a Y block or an 8BA flathead didn't they?

    Anyways, I think It'd be a cool car to fix up, you could get a V8-60 and gearbox for it easy enough. Apart from the engine and gearbox it looks complete, leave the patina and maybe, you have a pretty cool, rare old car.

    Thanks

    Hayden

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    Quote Originally Posted by sideways_505 View Post
    Y series flathead? Are you confusing the Flathead and the Y block? Customlines had a Y block or an 8BA flathead didn't they?

    Anyways, I think It'd be a cool car to fix up, you could get a V8-60 and gearbox for it easy enough. Apart from the engine and gearbox it looks complete, leave the patina and maybe, you have a pretty cool, rare old car.

    Thanks

    Hayden
    Yes, the Y-Block is an overhead valve engine.
    Fully agree that it needs to have a flathead, when these cars get a late model V8 with auto is when I start yawning.
    For that reason I will never replace the engine in my 203 rally car with anything other than the period engine, don't mind any kind of modifications though.
    Graham

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts bluey504's Avatar
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    Default Sorry...

    Thank you Hayden and Graham for clearing up my faux paus.
    Yes I'd put a flat head in, it would be as late as possible so something out of the post WW2 range.
    On thinking about it the Y block is a very large lump and would take some very serious work to make it fit and then modify the suspension so you could drive it safely.
    Checked my numbers and still no luck!
    But then it would have to wait in line for all the other projects, currently three and the ever expanding wish list.

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default Vedette on ebay

    Hi Guys.

    You have all forgotten that the Vedette gained an OHV Hemi V8 engine when production was transfered to Brazil, plus a four speed box. ............. so what is the big question?

    JP - SIMCA MAN

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts bluey504's Avatar
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    Default Vedette chrysler V8 and 4 speed...

    Thank's for the heads up Panhard!

    The engine is possibly not a Hemi as they Big block motors starting at about 372 cubic inch, with that much torque the doors could fly open when given a large application of throttle.
    Chrysler did smaller engines and the earliest ones here were 273? (I stand to be corrected) In the Valiants, S series onwards.

    Obviously they fit but are getting hard to source nowadays. The four speed would be even rarer as the local product didn't get these until the '70's.

    Would make for some very interesting discussions down at the local registration branch when you turned up with a Portuguese or Spanish language workshop manual to prove the point!

    p.s. The car hasn't turned back up on e-bay so I might check Carsales.

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default vedette on ebay

    Hi Guys.

    Guess I was stirring the pot. The Brazilian built Vedette did have an Ohv V8 hemi, those guys over there converted the Vedette 2.3ltr side valve engine into a OHV Hemi with a capacity of 2.6ltr. They had also produced a twin carb version of the old flat head which was fitted into what they called the "Rallye" and this was the first model with the four speed box, it even performed well on the race circuit.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vedette on Ebay-vedeng01.jpg  

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts bluey504's Avatar
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    You learn something new everyday! Simca Hemi headed V8's, who'd have thunk it. Actually not that unreasonable as during the pre-WWII racing days all sorts of weird go faster bits were made for the Model T type engines.
    Multiple carbies, additional camshafts (so you got a sidevalve and OHC/V set up), superchargers, replacement heads that Ernst Henry would of been proud of and replacement transmission parts galore.
    It would be interesting if any articles could be un-earthed as they would have been quite a formidable car for the time.

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by panhard View Post
    Hi Guys.

    Guess I was stirring the pot. The Brazilian built Vedette did have an Ohv V8 hemi, those guys over there converted the Vedette 2.3ltr side valve engine into a OHV Hemi with a capacity of 2.6ltr. They had also produced a twin carb version of the old flat head which was fitted into what they called the "Rallye" and this was the first model with the four speed box, it even performed well on the race circuit.
    Panhard,
    Could be a senior moment but, weren't the Brazilian Hemi Vedettes an "Ardun" design?

    Ardun = Zora Arkus Duntov of Corvette fame.
    Last edited by Wildebeest; 23rd December 2010 at 04:16 PM. Reason: glitch

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Panhard,
    Could be a senior moment but, weren't the Brazilian Hemi Vedettes an "Ardun" design?

    Ardun = Zora Arkus Duntov of Corvette fame.
    The Vedette was developed into the Chrysler Esplanada in Brazil, this had the hemi heads based on the Ardun design.
    Only 2.4 litres though and had 130 Hp.
    Was detuned from 140 Hp after durability tests were carried out by Chrysler in the US.
    Don't know whether Vedettes made in Brazil had the OHV engine.
    http://www.carroantigo.com/foto_asso..._esplanada.htm

    Another source states 2.5 litres and 140 Hp, the perfomance figures are very good for the time.
    http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...NADA/1968.html
    Graham
    Last edited by GRAHAM WALLIS; 23rd December 2010 at 04:34 PM.

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! sideways_505's Avatar
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    On the H.A.M.B forum there was a guy who got a bunch of those Simca heads from somewhere in south America. He was selling them off for some astronomical amount ($6K springs to mind), he sure had plenty of takers! If only I had the money! V8-60s are just as expensive though.

    Thanks

    Hayden (traditional hot rod enthusiast)

  17. #17
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    Default vedette on ebay

    Pix of the Emisul engine which was a conversion of the Vedette flathead.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vedette on Ebay-emisul01.jpg  

  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger! petitepoupée's Avatar
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    And if you want to do a comparison with the ARDUN, here 'tis...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vedette on Ebay-ardun_monterey.jpg   Vedette on Ebay-ardunhead_1.jpeg   Vedette on Ebay-ardunhead_2.jpeg  

  19. #19
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Default Vedette...

    Sideways,
    The V8/60 enjoyed a very short run in the Fords of the late '30's.
    They were snapped up by midget speedcar builders into the 1950's. Their small capacity fitted the regulations at the time.

    The Ford V8/60 engine while having a similar capacity to the Simca V8 differed considerably in its build.
    Evidence of this can be seen in part on Panhards post showing the Emisul engine.
    The lower part of the Simca block had an aluminium section. The distributor was vertical instead of the 'crab' type. The valves were adjustable, under the central inlet manifold.

    None of these features figured in the Ford V8 side valve engines up until the the CustomLine, these engines had a vertical distributor.

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default vedette on ebay

    Illustration of the Vedette flathead.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vedette on Ebay-flathead01.jpg   Vedette on Ebay-flathead02.jpg  

  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    Not much better than the sound of a flathead.
    I was brought up as a boy admiring the antics of the boys down the street with their '34 Fords (Australian ones looked slightly different Sideways) One was stripped down for parts in the space of an afternoon , driven around in chassis form then junked . Only worth about 40k now !

    The Vedette engine certainly always looked a bit different but common 'street lore' claimed it had a small capacity Ford engine which was obviously incorrect.
    '04 Megane
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