Chris's new 205GTI 8 valve thread
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Thread: Chris's new 205GTI 8 valve thread

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Default Chris's new 205GTI 8 valve thread

    New thread due to losing the old one.

    Parts are coming in thick & fast (means money is traveling in the other direction ).

    The project again is a worked 8 valve that Peter Taylor is building up for me. The engine is a DKZ/Mi16 hybrid'y sort of a thing (Peter please correct me if I'm wrong). The block has been machined and a compression ratio of 11.5:1 is what we have decided on. The internals are, and once again please correct me if I'm wrong, Mi16 liners, pistons and rods but retaining the standard crank. To stop oil surge and starvation, one of Peters baffled sumps will be used.

    A DKZ head with one of Peter's larger cams, BBM cam wheel and double valve springs. Also after much ummmm'ing and ahhhhh'ing I'm going to see how I go with a Davies Craig electric water pump (water pump wont be driven off the cam belt).

    I have a Wolf3D ECU that will be running everything in conjunction with a Davies Craig control unit taking charge all thing water temp related.

    I was hoping to be a lot further through this at this point in time but unfortunately I was ran off the road in the middle of last year and incurred some fairly serious suspension damage so I figured it was time for new suspension (quite costly)....

    So, know that I have some money saved up again its all systems go (so to speak) so I can get the motor out of Peters hair and down in Melbourne so I can start putting it all together.

    Graham is kindly supplying me with a series 1 Mi16 gearbox and flywheel (needed for the ECU) and I'm about to order a Quaife LSD for obvious reasons. Its really just a matter of tidying up all the little bits and pieces now, clutch, ECU loom, oil cooler etc.

    Its funny, I drove a friends S1 205GTI with the DFZ bottomend DKZ head setup with one of Peters stage 2 cams and it went very well indeed so I'm a bit antsy as to whether what I have coming is a bit of an overkill hahahaha. Time will tell.

    I've parts arriving next week so i'll get some pictures up asap. Also for those of you that have been to my dyno days that hold, i'll probably be having another one at around easter (probably just after) to show off... hahaha.

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    Either ways, things are happening and look out you 16 valve 205s there is a fairly hot 8 valve coming.





    Chris
    frenchtranstech likes this.

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts BIGRR's Avatar
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    Default 8 valve

    Quote Originally Posted by DjB8V View Post
    New thread due to losing the old one.

    Parts are coming in thick & fast (means money is traveling in the other direction ).

    The project again is a worked 8 valve that Peter Taylor is building up for me. The engine is a DKZ/Mi16 hybrid'y sort of a thing (Peter please correct me if I'm wrong). The block has been machined and a compression ratio of 11.5:1 is what we have decided on. The internals are, and once again please correct me if I'm wrong, Mi16 liners, pistons and rods but retaining the standard crank. To stop oil surge and starvation, one of Peters baffled sumps will be used.

    A DKZ head with one of Peter's larger cams, BBM cam wheel and double valve springs. Also after much ummmm'ing and ahhhhh'ing I'm going to see how I go with a Davies Craig electric water pump (water pump wont be driven off the cam belt).

    I have a Wolf3D ECU that will be running everything in conjunction with a Davies Craig control unit taking charge all thing water temp related.

    I was hoping to be a lot further through this at this point in time but unfortunately I was ran off the road in the middle of last year and incurred some fairly serious suspension damage so I figured it was time for new suspension (quite costly)....

    So, know that I have some money saved up again its all systems go (so to speak) so I can get the motor out of Peters hair and down in Melbourne so I can start putting it all together.

    Graham is kindly supplying me with a series 1 Mi16 gearbox and flywheel (needed for the ECU) and I'm about to order a Quaife LSD for obvious reasons. Its really just a matter of tidying up all the little bits and pieces now, clutch, ECU loom, oil cooler etc.

    Its funny, I drove a friends S1 205GTI with the DFZ bottomend DKZ head setup with one of Peters stage 2 cams and it went very well indeed so I'm a bit antsy as to whether what I have coming is a bit of an overkill hahahaha. Time will tell.

    I've parts arriving next week so i'll get some pictures up asap. Also for those of you that have been to my dyno days that hold, i'll probably be having another one at around easter (probably just after) to show off... hahaha.

    Either ways, things are happening and look out you 16 valve 205s there is a fairly hot 8 valve coming.





    Chris
    As dyno figures are all over the place, when you get the car going, post a standing 400m time, you know what they say "when the clutch drops the bull ___t stops!

    Good Luck with the 8 valve .
    Present fleet:-
    Peugeot 93' 205 Gti 16v
    Peugeot 73' 504 Ti from new
    Peugeot 08' 407 Hdi Coupe from new

    Previous fleet:-
    Peugeot 95' 605 Sv
    Peugeot 92' 205 Gti
    Renault 72' 16TS from new
    Renault 69' 10
    Renault 71' 10s
    Renault 68' 10 from new

    "Be reasonable do it my way!"


  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIGRR View Post
    As dyno figures are all over the place, when you get the car going, post a standing 400m time, you know what they say "when the clutch drops the bull ___t stops!

    Good Luck with the 8 valve .
    That's an excellent idea. There is a ripper country drag strip near Bendigo (Heathcote Raceway). I'll give it a flick down there I think.


    Chris

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    Should be fun. Would also be nice to see another 205 around with a wolf3d running it. They do the job just fine. If your in melbourne you could get Robbie from WolfEMS to tune it too.

    GL with it
    Lets just say we have a few pugs about!

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hipcrostino View Post
    Should be fun. Would also be nice to see another 205 around with a wolf3d running it. They do the job just fine. If your in melbourne you could get Robbie from WolfEMS to tune it too.

    GL with it
    Cheers....

    You wouldn't have a wiring diagram of the loom you setup for you 16V ??



    Chris

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    Mines running quad throttle bodies, Ls1 coilpacks and a custom timing pickup from the cam shaft, so I'm not using much of the original loom im afraid.
    Lets just say we have a few pugs about!

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    It's a shame you have the Wolf3D already. Given a clean slate, I'd use a Haltech Sprint 500, fired off the standard crank sensor, along with four LS1 coils.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Picked up a series one Mi16 gearbox and flywheel today. Also got a racing bucket....... Its all good fun.

    As for Haltechs, would love to run one (that way you could set up a map for me Peter). What are they worth? If I could sell my Wolf maybe I'd think about it.



    Chris

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    Haltech Sprint 500 retails (online) for between $900 and $1,000. Not sure how much the flying lead kit is to buy.

    2005 Renault Clio Sport 182 Cup
    1983 Peugeot 505 SRDT

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    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Latest RRP is $1089 including flying loom.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT View Post
    Latest RRP is $1089 including flying loom.
    Whats a flying a loom? I might have to look at selling my Wolf.


    Chris

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    It's terminated on the ECU end only.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  13. #13
    I might be slow... DRTDVL's Avatar
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    How does the haltech compare to the Link Atom or Storm?

  14. #14
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    What version of the Wolf ECU do you have? It should have a built in MAP sensor ready to rock and roll. Main advantage of a Haltech over anything else is that its been done before, so heaps of knowlegde to pull from (which is always good).
    Lets just say we have a few pugs about!

  15. #15
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    I was thinking more of the advantage of not needing a home trigger.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    I don't think you do, I just have one so I can run sequential ignition and injection.
    Lets just say we have a few pugs about!

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    I think just because I still have it and need to buy a Quaife I'll stick with Wolf. I spoke to Wolf and they said they can refurb (and for quite a reasonable price too) and stick the current software on too. So that will be done before I take delivery of the 8V.

    Does anyone have a diagram of an 8 have loom? Maybe even labeled? Where is the best place to track down plugs for he loom (injectors and what not)?

    I have access to dyno which is ace. This will make the tuning process very easy.

    The Wolf in question -






    Chris

  18. #18
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    This should be a pretty good, and sensible project. I see lots of idiots putting clapped out old Mi16 donks with 200,000 km on them into their 205s, and expecting some sort of magical result, when all they have is a box of badly assembled trouble.

    If you are going to rebuild an engine, which is a given, or should be, it should be a bit cheaper to rebuild the 8v. The path to good gains is now well known, thanks mostly to Owen Wuillemin, who discovered it by accident, but ensured it didn't remain a mystery.

    Before this discovery, a long time before, when nobody in this country knew anything about these cars, I must have sunk about $50k into trying to get a DFZ to go, with very small returns. The car was reasonably competitive in Targa trim, provided it was driven appropriately, but was uncompetitive on a race track until the 16v was installed, at which point it was still fairly uncompetitive because of the Targa, rather than race, suspension set-up. However, we had a lot of fun, and learnt a LOT, most of it to the benefit of those now building competition 205s in this country.

    I would not go overboard with the project. There are limits to how hard the 8v can reasonably be made to go. They pull pretty hard, too, if you don't go mad with the cam timing. Have a definite, and quite precisely defined, goal in mind, and keep it in mind, and seek, and follow, appropriate advice about achieving that goal. If you end up achieving some totally different goal, it won't, or certainly shouldn't be, somebody else's fault.

    Good luck.

    Tim

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    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Thanks Tim.

    As far as plans go, I don't have a power figure in mind, instead just keeping up with/ being able to get round more modern hot hatches and 16V 205s.

    This engine will be seldom run at 100%. I would rather build an engine and run it at 80% or 90% for the sake of reliability.


    Chris

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    Quote Originally Posted by DjB8V View Post
    I think just because I still have it and need to buy a Quaife I'll stick with Wolf. I spoke to Wolf and they said they can refurb (and for quite a reasonable price too) and stick the current software on too. So that will be done before I take delivery of the 8V.

    Does anyone have a diagram of an 8 have loom? Maybe even labeled? Where is the best place to track down plugs for he loom (injectors and what not)?

    I have access to dyno which is ace. This will make the tuning process very easy.

    The Wolf in question -






    Chris
    Get components from EFI Hardware in Mitcham, think the name has changed, get in touch and I'll tell you where.
    Petroject has changed their name to something meaningless that I can never remember.
    Went there the other day and they were hopless, had nothing in stock.
    You can modify the existing Jetronic loom but you would want to get rid of the Tachymetric Relay, possibly best to start afresh.
    Graham

  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Yep....

    Starting new and making a really tough one. I've had a budget loom made up once before and it was a nightmare. Thanks for that Graham


    Chris

  22. #22
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    Just for giggles I fitted my newly aquired racing bucket and my new front struts arrived today. Just need to sort out some springs for them.

    Enjoy -






    Chris

  23. #23
    1000+ Posts Isis's Avatar
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    Chris,

    I have two (old) Cobra's in my car that are the same style. Is yours the metal scaffold and padding type? it doesnt look like the plastic tub option. how did you decide what to buy? What suburb of Melbourne are you? I am in Glen Iris.

    cheers
    Ice
    S3 205 GTI x 4 and getting lower
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  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    Padded it is. Plastic it isn't I think. I bought it off an Aussiefrogger. I'm in Rowville.




    Chris

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger! DjB8V's Avatar
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    So a bit of an update.

    After a bit of break away from it, the motor is in the closing stages. I was going to use the standard inlet manifold but decide to use twin dcoe weber style throttle bodies.

    These to be precise

    I'm waiting for the double valve springs to arrive so I can send the bbm cam wheel, sump and springs up to the motor so it can all get screwed together.

    Hoping to pick the motor up in May and start the fitting in winter.


    Chris

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