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  1. #26
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overfinch View Post
    Hi mate

    What kind of a coil would I be looking at for this electric ignition conversion?

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    Overfinch,
    I lost my original reply, here goes again.
    A normal 12 volt coil not one for ballast resisted or electronic ignitions. Mine uses a Bosch, the French manufactured Peugeot have Ducellier or SEV.
    Your present coil looks to be a ballast resisted type, this means that they run on 12 volt for starting, switching to 9 volt for running.

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    The air cleaner. Clean any oil from the large clamping area and at the carburetor. Inside and out.
    Make sure the three ? rubber mounts on the main body of the filter aren't perished or broken. [I see a weld repair near the front one] Check that the body of the filter hasn't broken away from its support. This happened on the 404 oil bath filters.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    I lost my original reply, here goes again.
    A normal 12 volt coil not one for ballast resisted or electronic ignitions. Mine uses a Bosch, the French manufactured Peugeot have Ducellier or SEV.
    Your present coil looks to be a ballast resisted type, this means that they run on 12 volt for starting, switching to 9 volt for running.

    The air cleaner. Clean any oil from the large clamping area and at the carburetor. Inside and out.
    Make sure the three ? rubber mounts on the main body of the filter aren't perished or broken. [I see a weld repair near the front one] Check that the body of the filter hasn't broken away from its support. This happened on the 404 oil bath filters.
    Hi there mate,

    Hope you are keeping well. In a conundrum here. I have no clue which kit to buy. I have a colleague who is the USA jetting back on Friday. I want her to get me the conversion. Must be cheaper than shipping. I'm looking at a myriad of conversions online. Which should I order? Does the answer lie underneath my distributor cap? Don't mind, still earning my stripes. Please advise

    NB: This is the hotspark unit.



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    Last edited by Overfinch; 23rd November 2016 at 03:13 AM.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    I lost my original reply, here goes again.
    A normal 12 volt coil not one for ballast resisted or electronic ignitions. Mine uses a Bosch, the French manufactured Peugeot have Ducellier or SEV.
    Your present coil looks to be a ballast resisted type, this means that they run on 12 volt for starting, switching to 9 volt for running.

    The air cleaner. Clean any oil from the large clamping area and at the carburetor. Inside and out.
    Make sure the three ? rubber mounts on the main body of the filter aren't perished or broken. [I see a weld repair near the front one] Check that the body of the filter hasn't broken away from its support. This happened on the 404 oil bath filters.
    This is the inside of my distributor and a picture of the ignition coil as well.

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Car ID-1479840030833.jpg   Car ID-1479840051458.jpg   Car ID-1479840071969.jpg   Car ID-1479840089014.jpg  

  4. #29
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    My unit looks like a 2 piece right hand points vacuum advance. Please advise of indeed it is or if I have it wrong .

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  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Chisholm View Post
    Yes, that's the part I mean. With the proper clamps it should stay in place unless the clamps are faulty or something isn't original and doesn't line up corrrectly. It's very important.

    If it's not too much of a hassle, I'd be interested to see some other photos of the car including the interior to see what the differences between it and my old retired '80 504 are.
    Hi Pete,

    The interior photos as promised.

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Car ID-1479877628937.jpg   Car ID-1479877649708.jpg   Car ID-1479877667133.jpg   Car ID-1479877680954.jpg  

  6. #31
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    Overfinch,
    Looking at your series of ignition parts photos it would appear to be a Bosch distributor with 2 piece points and vac. advance.
    I could get a better idea if the dist. rotor had been lifted off.
    If ordering a kit from HotSpark find the model and make of the distributor stamped on its body. This will help them and your friend.

    The coil is the ballast resistored type. The ballast resistor is attached to the coil. Instruction given will ask you to discard the condenser.

    The interior photos look similar to the early 505 as sold in Aus.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    Looking at your series of ignition parts photos it would appear to be a Bosch distributor with 2 piece points and vac. advance.
    I could get a better idea if the dist. rotor had been lifted off.
    If ordering a kit from HotSpark find the model and make of the distributor stamped on its body. This will help them and your friend.

    The coil is the ballast resistored type. The ballast resistor is attached to the coil. Instruction given will ask you to discard the condenser.

    The interior photos look similar to the early 505 as sold in Aus.
    Here are some better pictures. Couldn't see a number anywhere

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  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    Looking at your series of ignition parts photos it would appear to be a Bosch distributor with 2 piece points and vac. advance.
    I could get a better idea if the dist. rotor had been lifted off.
    If ordering a kit from HotSpark find the model and make of the distributor stamped on its body. This will help them and your friend.

    The coil is the ballast resistored type. The ballast resistor is attached to the coil. Instruction given will ask you to discard the condenser.

    The interior photos look similar to the early 505 as sold in Aus.
    Here are some better pictures. Couldn't see a number anywhere on this contraption 😂. The only thing I saw was 'Made in France' on the fuse like golden coloured attachment.

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Car ID-1479923500054.jpg   Car ID-1479923526167.jpg   Car ID-1479923612486.jpg  

  9. #34
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    Overfinch,
    The points fitted are Bosch, note the symbol. The rest of the distributor mechanism looks like Bosch also.
    The "golden coloured" attachment is the condenser.

    On the "HotSpark" Google site it shows good fitting instructions. I'm surprised yours doesn't have any make and model markings?
    It will definately help when ordering.
    If it were the Ducellier kit there is only one type specified .

    All the best to You and your Friend.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    The points fitted are Bosch, note the symbol. The rest of the distributor mechanism looks like Bosch also.
    The "golden coloured" attachment is the condenser.

    On the "HotSpark" Google site it shows good fitting instructions. I'm surprised yours doesn't have any make and model markings?
    It will definately help when ordering.
    If it were the Ducellier kit there is only one type specified .

    All the best to You and your Friend.
    So it's definitely the 2 piece point with vacuum advance?

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  11. #36
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    Overfinch,
    Yes. As per picture no 3 in your post *27.

    You'd better get a move on if your friend has to order/purchase the unit for you.

    I await the outcome. Will offer further assistance if required.

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    Its sadly become an impossible job. I'm looking towards the UK now with the hope that Powerspark (through Simonbbc - UK) can help me get the unit and a suitable coil. I might pull through a DHL shipment. I've read something about positive earth and negative earth. Does this have any relation to ignition system in the 504? Thanks for the guidance thus far.
    Last edited by Overfinch; 25th November 2016 at 02:03 AM.

  13. #38
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    Overfinch,
    The 504 is a negative earth system.
    Simonbbc UK [PowerSpark] have a good fast postage and quick e-mail replies.
    The same applies when ordering, give them all the model details. The coil they advertise should remove any doubts you may have.
    They can do you a new rotor to complete the package.

    Once again,
    Regards, Wildebeest.

    PS. You could point out to them the "HotSpark" illustration No 3 when ordering ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    The 504 is a negative earth system.
    Simonbbc UK [PowerSpark] have a good fast postage and quick e-mail replies.
    The same applies when ordering, give them all the model details. The coil they advertise should remove any doubts you may have.
    They can do you a new rotor to complete the package.

    Once again,
    Regards, Wildebeest.

    PS. You could point out to them the "HotSpark" illustration No 3 when ordering ?
    Hi guys,

    Liaising with Simon on the conversion kit. They are quite thorough. I'll have a mechanic take the distributor off tomorrow as they want those pictures as well. In the meantime, new wheel bearings going in tomorrow. The old ones were shot.

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    Overfinch,
    I didn't want to complicate the issue when posting earlier.
    Before removing your distributor have the rotor point to No 1 cylinder on the dist. body.* Also mark the distributor position before removing from the block, scratch mark or paint dot. Also mark the front pulley with paint.
    Remember No 1 cylinder is at the rear [flywheel] end of the engine. All this will simplify the basic timing for start up.

    * If I recall Bosch distributors have a notch on the body indicating No 1 cyl.
    Once again,
    All the best.
    Last edited by Wildebeest; 27th November 2016 at 09:22 AM. Reason: dotting t's crossing i's

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    I didn't want to complicate the issue when posting earlier.
    Before removing your distributor have the rotor point to No 1 cylinder on the dist. body.* Also mark the distributor position before removing from the block, scratch mark or paint dot. Also mark the front pulley with paint.
    Remember No 1 cylinder is at the rear [flywheel] end of the engine. All this will simplify the basic timing for start up.

    * If I recall Bosch distributors have a notch on the body indicating No 1 cyl.
    Once again,
    All the best.
    Not complicated at all Mr. Wildebeest . I'll leave that untouched until I get someone who won't cock everything up. Meanwhile, removed a shot gear seal and stabilizer with eroded Bush.

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  17. #42
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    New bushes for the stabilizers and the oil seal procured. Only missing thing is the broken rubber ring. Can't seem to get it anywhere at the dealers'. Also came across a new 'used' brake master cylinder in better Nick than mine.

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    Attachment 91555Car ID-1480617698173.jpg

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  20. #45
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    Overfinch,
    "Broken rubber ring". Isn't that the seal pictured top left post #43 I presume it is the grease seal for the front hub?

    To determine the m/cyl condition it will need dismantling [you knew that ].
    To remove the pistons etc from the cylinder. First remove the plastic reservoir and the two rubber grommets. Looking down into the two holes you will see a roll pin in each. To remove these to enable the piston to be withdrawn, I use a small self tapping screw that will fit inside the roll pin. Screw this in until it grabs then withdraw the screw and pin with pliers.
    Now you can remove the piston, clean out the bore with rag and hot water. Inspect for rust/corrosion etc. [hot water OK at this stage].
    If the bores are ok, an overhaul kit will do. If corroded they may need honing out or at the extreme, resleeving.
    To final clean use methylated spirit or Brake Kleen. Re-assemble with rubber grease.

    I trust all this hasn't filled your head too much!

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    "Broken rubber ring". Isn't that the seal pictured top left post #43 I presume it is the grease seal for the front hub?

    To determine the m/cyl condition it will need dismantling [you knew that ].
    To remove the pistons etc from the cylinder. First remove the plastic reservoir and the two rubber grommets. Looking down into the two holes you will see a roll pin in each. To remove these to enable the piston to be withdrawn, I use a small self tapping screw that will fit inside the roll pin. Screw this in until it grabs then withdraw the screw and pin with pliers.
    Now you can remove the piston, clean out the bore with rag and hot water. Inspect for rust/corrosion etc. [hot water OK at this stage].
    If the bores are ok, an overhaul kit will do. If corroded they may need honing out or at the extreme, resleeving.
    To final clean use methylated spirit or Brake Kleen. Re-assemble with rubber grease.

    I trust all this hasn't filled your head too much!
    Hello Wildebeest,

    The broken rubber ring was removed in the vicinity of the drive shaft connection to the gears. The original seal was half metallic but my mechanic says a rubber seal would still work, which I got. The issue is that broken rubber ring. The parts shops know what it is but no one has it. I may need to have someone craft one. We have guys down here who make rubber parts that cannot be found by hand from old tyres. They make bushes from the tyres and all manner of other rubber fittings.
    I didn't know what you told me about the master cylinder. My mechanic checked whether it had smooth travel and it did and he passed it fit. I'll ask him to service it as you prescribe. Always a pleasure...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Overfinch View Post
    Hello Wildebeest,

    The broken rubber ring was removed in the vicinity of the drive shaft connection to the gears. The original seal was half metallic but my mechanic says a rubber seal would still work, which I got. The issue is that broken rubber ring. The parts shops know what it is but no one has it. I may need to have someone craft one. We have guys down here who make rubber parts that cannot be found by hand from old tyres. They make bushes from the tyres and all manner of other rubber fittings.
    I didn't know what you told me about the master cylinder. My mechanic checked whether it had smooth travel and it did and he passed it fit. I'll ask him to service it as you prescribe. Always a pleasure...

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    The broken rubber ring is on the right. It's was removed from the drive shaft region n together with the seal on the left. The seal is half metallic and half rubber. It's identical in shape to a bearing seal. The mechanic told me that the rubber seal would still work. The broken ring is what's becoming a bother to trace.

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  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overfinch View Post


    The broken rubber ring is on the right. It's was removed from the drive shaft region n together with the seal on the left. The seal is half metallic and half rubber. It's identical in shape to a bearing seal. The mechanic told me that the rubber seal would still work. The broken ring is what's becoming a bother to trace.

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    Overfinch,
    I had a look through my 504 parts book today.
    The seal at the rear of the gearbox is Part Number. 2362.05.
    The measurements are. 38.8x58.2x 10 mm.

    There is no sign of two rings/seals in the parts illustrations.
    I'm wondering if they are one and have just come apart? The measurements may answer the question.

    Regards.
    Wildebeest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    I had a look through my 504 parts book today.
    The seal at the rear of the gearbox is Part Number. 2362.05.
    The measurements are. 38.8x58.2x 10 mm.

    There is no sign of two rings/seals in the parts illustrations.
    I'm wondering if they are one and have just come apart? The measurements may answer the question.

    Regards.
    Wildebeest
    Thanks mate. We got stuck. In earlier today returning the propeller and the drive shaft. Had grease as old as the car itself. Oiled up the differential, and gave the old gal a spin

    You can see the 'engineering' team hard at work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Overfinch,
    I had a look through my 504 parts book today.
    The seal at the rear of the gearbox is Part Number. 2362.05.
    The measurements are. 38.8x58.2x 10 mm.

    There is no sign of two rings/seals in the parts illustrations.
    I'm wondering if they are one and have just come apart? The measurements may answer the question.

    Regards.
    Wildebeest
    Hey there mate. We eventually got the part off a shredders'. It is a doughnut shaped part and barely resembles the sample. That's how worn the sample was. Anyway, everything fit back apart from the drive shaft which really took some muscle to fit into the propeller with the new seals in.

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