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Thread: Cam & Pat's 205 Race Car

  1. #76
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Thanks Nick,

    Ive been doing a little research into then and it seems the conpbrake stuff breaks! Theres a few uk 205 dudes that have used them with issues.

    Ill have a look at the rally design stuff and check it out.

    We have also been looking at the Wilwood boxes also. They seem like better quality. May have to stick with a hung set at this point..

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  2. #77
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    Cam I would be interested in the Comp Brake item, even though their lower control arms leave a lot be desired.
    No booster, this is one thing that interests me as this will give heaps of clearance for the 16 valve engine.
    So how can you get away without the booster, smaller master cylinder size?
    If you disconnect the booster on a standard car you just won't stop.
    My old 203 rally car now has a pedal box and stops fine, certainly didn't do that with the original cylinder and no booster.

    Quote Originally Posted by 205NUTS View Post
    Hi Cam,

    If you haven't already ordered the obp pedal box why don't you take a look at the compbrake.com dual cylinder conversion.

    Would be a lot easier for you to fit and its cheaper!
    I've not used one before so I can't vouch for it
    As before just make sure you get real master cylinders

    Rally design also used to do one for the 205 20 years ago not in their catalog anymore but could probably still supply (most parts made in house)

    Good luck

    Nick

    Peugeot 205 Brake Bias Servo Replacement Pedal Box Kit ? Hydraulic Dual Cylinder [KIT A] - 205, Bias / Servo replacement, Pedal Boxes, Peugeot - Compbrake Motorsport Parts

  3. #78
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    Parry has the compbrake, had to rebuild it all.

    There is another option that i will talk to you about when i see you

    Adrian
    Adrian Wuillemin

  4. #79
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    How is the Tilton stuff for build quality? They have both floor mount and hung pedals

  5. #80
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Tilton seems good. Super $$ as far as i can tell so far...

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    I have two options one is fabricated to order and uses the existing pedals.
    The other one replaces the pedals but will be more expensive to import due to price and bulkiness.
    These are the OBP items yeah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    If you are going with IPRA compliant you have to go for a over hung pedal box if you are fitting a pedals and cylinders
    We don't want to get too hung up on being IPRA compliant but my interpretation is that either over hung or floor mounted complies but it's about position - from IP 3j 13.2 Controls; "Pedals and pedal boxes are free, but the radial location of the pedal axes must remain within 75mm of the original."

    By the sounds of things it's going to come down to quality and driving position.

    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    No booster, this is one thing that interests me as this will give heaps of clearance for the 16 valve engine.
    So how can you get away without the booster, smaller master cylinder size?
    Yup, change in MC bore - by all accounts racing drivers all have over developed right leg muscles - ask Parry, he's recently swapped over to un-boosted brakes!
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  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by patpug View Post
    "Pedals and pedal boxes are free, but the radial location of the pedal axes must remain within 75mm of the original."
    How do you keep the radial axis within 75mm of original if you move the pivot from above the pedal to below it?

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
    How do you keep the radial axis within 75mm of original if you move the pivot from above the pedal to below it?
    I guess you can't when you put it like that... Maybe I didn't read it right the first time. Damn all these rules - we just want to build a race car!
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  9. #84
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    As far as I can tell the only 3 pedal boxes with a cable clutch are the OBP and this from Compbrake: Peugeot 205 Floor Mounted Cable Pedal Box Kit - Sportline 3-Pedal AP Cylinders [KIT A] - 205, Floor Mounted Pedal Boxes, Pedal Boxes, Peugeot, Sport Line - Compbrake Motorsport Parts

    Both are expensive and have questionable quality from what I can tell.

    Wilwood, Tilton and AP are all hydraulic clutch...

    Maybe we need to consider single brake pedal options - I'd love to find one that keeps the Mcyls in the cockpit to make space in the engine bay... Any ideas?
    205 gti-6

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  10. #85
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    What is it on the Compbrake stuff that breaks, Cam?

    What 205NUTS describes as needing modification or further attention prior to installation is, in my experience, normal. When the V8 teams get their AP pedal boxes, they will strip them down and make them better in any way they can. Unless the kit is made by Peugeot it will need some kind of mods to fit and operate.

    As long as the box and the pedal are properly stiff that's the most important part as the rest can be replaced. If certain parts flex they can be reinforced. If the cylinders and lines leak, budget to replace the cylinders with PBR, Girling or AP and plan on making all of the brake lines. If it needs better bushings in the pedals those can be made.

    Maybe you can buy one of the kits without the bits you want to replace.

    The pedal box I like is this underslung one because it bolts into the standard firewall hole, it is the most simple in design so is likely to be the most reliable and easy to modify if necessary, and it should give you the necessary engine clearance.

    PEUGEOT 205/ 309 UNDERSLUNG PEDAL BOX (COMPLETE) - 205, 309, Direct Replacement, Parts by Car Manufacturer, Pedal Boxes, Peugeot - Compbrake Motorsport Parts
    Last edited by Bluey; 7th March 2015 at 09:07 AM.

  11. #86
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    After having looked at a lot of other more complicated and expensive options I am coming around to this option as well.

    Care will need to me taken with clearances with the 16v before we order but we can measure up.

    Also, we can do all the things that you describe like new bushes etc to the std pedals and they should come up to standard.

    I think the firewall will need a bit of reinforcement around the mounting though because of the extra pedal effort required.
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

  12. #87
    1000+ Posts pgti6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    "rollcage extensions into the engine bay".
    IPRAVIC seem to allow the rollcage to extend to the front suspension turrets. A 405 running in the series a few years ago was fitted with them and passed scrutinneering.
    Track car-Steel Grey 405 Mi16 172hp atw


    405 Track car build thread moved to-
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  13. #88
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    Why would you have 1 cylinder? This would be the same as standard, the original pedals are already placed perfectly so no advantage that I can see.

    .

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    What is it on the Compbrake stuff that breaks, Cam?

    What 205NUTS describes as needing modification or further attention prior to installation is, in my experience, normal. When the V8 teams get their AP pedal boxes, they will strip them down and make them better in any way they can. Unless the kit is made by Peugeot it will need some kind of mods to fit and operate.

    As long as the box and the pedal are properly stiff that's the most important part as the rest can be replaced. If certain parts flex they can be reinforced. If the cylinders and lines leak, budget to replace the cylinders with PBR, Girling or AP and plan on making all of the brake lines. If it needs better bushings in the pedals those can be made.

    Maybe you can buy one of the kits without the bits you want to replace.

    The pedal box I like is this underslung one because it bolts into the standard firewall hole, it is the most simple in design so is likely to be the most reliable and easy to modify if necessary, and it should give you the necessary engine clearance.

    PEUGEOT 205/ 309 UNDERSLUNG PEDAL BOX (COMPLETE) - 205, 309, Direct Replacement, Parts by Car Manufacturer, Pedal Boxes, Peugeot - Compbrake Motorsport Parts

  14. #89
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    That compbrake one is what I fitted to parrys car. You have to run really short master cylinders. The quality of the balance bar was poor. The cable supplied didn't work and we had to replace it. You also have to cut away some of the steering column support to clear the balance bar and cable.

    It fits in amongst the column and is really hard to do any work on due to no clearence.

    It works but is not great.

    You can buy the obp one without any cylinders. This would be my preference.

    We bought the cylinders from summit in the states when we did an order to aero quip oil hoses and saved heaps over ordering locally.
    Adrian Wuillemin

  15. #90
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    After seeing Parry's, which in effect is just a modified standard pedal box, I decided it was easier just to modify by own.

    '92 205 Mi16
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  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Wuillemi View Post
    That compbrake one is what I fitted to parrys car. You have to run really short master cylinders. The quality of the balance bar was poor. The cable supplied didn't work and we had to replace it. You also have to cut away some of the steering column support to clear the balance bar and cable.

    It fits in amongst the column and is really hard to do any work on due to no clearence.

    It works but is not great.

    You can buy the obp one without any cylinders. This would be my preference.

    We bought the cylinders from summit in the states when we did an order to aero quip oil hoses and saved heaps over ordering locally.
    What's the issue with the balance bar? Rubbish bearing? Sloppy threads? Cable binding?

  17. #92
    1000+ Posts parry's Avatar
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    My pedal box works well now.... Shame my throttle is not the same
    90 205 Gti Cherry Red(Track Car)
    1985 505gti (Shitbox Rally)

    PBs:

    Oran Park: 1:27:9
    Wakefield: 1:05.6 (July 2015)
    Eastern Creek: 1:54 (8v)
    Mt Huntley: 34.44 (2004 stock 205)
    Ringwood: 35.06 (30/10/2005)

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by patpug View Post
    Wilwood, Tilton and AP are all hydraulic clutch...?
    Maybe you should investigate if a hydraulic clutch 206 BE4 bell housing will fit on the BE3 casing. I know it's a bit left field and an additional expense but if people can't get the Compbrake/OBP boxes to work it will allow you to use something with known reliability.

  19. #94
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    All of them bluey
    Adrian Wuillemin

  20. #95
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    Interesting... It is very tight in the engine bay around the exhaust and head - see attached. I say it would be nice to keep MCyls in the cockpit. Some of the big name gear isnt much more expensive than OBP and Compbrake either. I'll have a look and report...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Cam & Pat's 205 Race Car-1425816434027.jpg  
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Maybe you should investigate if a hydraulic clutch 206 BE4 bell housing will fit on the BE3 casing.
    Anyone know about this? Adrian - you're the gearbox guru!
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

  22. #97
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    Anything is possible pat.

    Soem of them do cable clutches

    Have a look at the wilwood catalogue
    Adrian Wuillemin

  23. #98
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    Be4 bell housing fits onto be3 cases. But you will need to find an Xu/xud be4 hydraulic housing as ew/dw/tu/ep will all sit at an incorrect angle.
    patpug and lion5 like this.
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  24. #99
    1000+ Posts parry's Avatar
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    Pat, here are my shorties, they are Ap racing MCs, plenty of room.

    Cam & Pat's 205 Race Car-377624_412829455473484_3665434_n.jpg
    90 205 Gti Cherry Red(Track Car)
    1985 505gti (Shitbox Rally)

    PBs:

    Oran Park: 1:27:9
    Wakefield: 1:05.6 (July 2015)
    Eastern Creek: 1:54 (8v)
    Mt Huntley: 34.44 (2004 stock 205)
    Ringwood: 35.06 (30/10/2005)

  25. #100
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    Thanks Parry, any chance you could tell me which ones they are? Bore sizes?
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

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