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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
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    Default Peugeot 404 Utility Project

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0860.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0861.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0862.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0863.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0864.jpg

    I'm now the new owner of Adrian Wuilleman's Peugeot 404 utility. Man, that was an interesting drive from Sydney to Geelong with a thumping load on the trailer. Everything went well thanks in part to Adrian's skill at tying Gordian knots with my elastic ropes.

    I've admired these things for many years and am looking forward to doing a sympathetic resto.

    The first challenge is to get it off the trailer- both rear brakes are seized and the tyres have "ceased to be".

    Well you have to start somewhere so I will start with the wheels: sandblast, paint (Sage Grey) & new tyres. Are 165x15 cross-ply appropriate?

    I am aiming for a European style canopy. Can someone put me onto to a contact that has one? About 10 years ago, I restored a 1960 VW single cab ute with an original canopy & from photos they are very similar: i.e. U-section steel hoops & hardwood slats. I'd like someone to do me a template so I can bend the hoops.

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    Last edited by geodon; 11th January 2015 at 06:54 PM. Reason: typo
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    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  2. #2
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    The original size for tires was (in France...) 17x380, means 175x80x15.
    Maybe it's easier to find 185x75x15 or 185x75x15C if you want to put heavy load into the bed!
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    Default Electrolytic Paint & Rust removal

    Although I have gone to the trouble of making a sand blasting cabinet,

    My Home Sandblaster

    the amount of work to be done with both projects (eg10 wheels!) has led me to look for something easier & faster.

    A bit of on line research:

    http://www.fergusonenthusiasts.com/r...%20Charger.pdf

    Rust Removal with Electrolysis

    Paint Removal By Electrolysis - Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk

    And, doubtless there are more.

    So I decided to use 2 1000 litre tanks that were water storage for our chook sheds in a previous life. They are easily got for about $100 each. I cut the tops off but kept the lids to prevent possums falling in & drowning. Warning! The tanks seem UV stable but the tap assemblies are not. Both disintegrated & leaked. I got around it via big rubber plugs ex Clark Rubber inserted from the inside so they are pushed in by the water pressure.
    Drainage, if nec, will be by siphon & bailing. There will be residue so the orig outlets will be useless anyway

    The articles go thru the science so I won't bother.

    The sacrificial anodes are scrap plate from the shop- $1.80/kg- but the gal 25x35mm is new. 25mm bar is used to suspend the anodes & baling wire does for holding the work BUT it can't conduct well so I attach a multi-strand wire to the work as well

    I bought a 20amp charger on eBay for $40- a ripper! Fan cooled! Plus a watt meter so I could follow what is happening.

    12V Battery Charger Power 20 AMP 3 Stage CAR Boat Caravan ATV 4WD Motorcycle 20A | eBay

    AU FOR Analyzer AMP Ammeter Watt Meter LCD Wattmeter 60V 100A Power Volt | eBay

    A few articles said to put a battery in as some chargers don't deliver pure DC. I did this with the Landy battery- a whopper!- and when I hooked up via the battery, it blew my 20A inline fuse. Bypassing it, I pulled 25+A & the wires got hot so I just went with the charger only. It worked judging by the bubbles & only drew 12-14 A but, interestingly, only 6-9 volts. No biggie, it's bubbles I want- they get under the paint & rust.

    Each tank hold about 800 litres & I used 7kg of Sodium Carbonate & 1 kg of Sodium Hydroxide. The latter is pure EVIL! Be very careful- goggles & gloves- but, it's the key to getting paint off. Best place to buy is Advance Chemicals in Altona 03 9398 4444. I also get my degreaser, paint stripper, penetrating oil, phosphate rust inhibitor etc. there.

    I used a 404 rim with rust damage around the valve hole as an experiment.

    After 24 hours, wow! Just WOW! The paint came off in sheets & my Karcher, a baby, just blew it away. The rust was gone & only the pits remained. There are stubborn bits in the crannies so I put it back for another day to see how we go.

    Anyway, I'd rather sandblast a few bits than the whole rim!

    I will blast the stressed things like springs. The process embeds hydrogen & so can make stressed steel brittle. The effect can be removed by heating & goes away with time

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0932.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0931.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0930.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0929.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0928.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0927.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0926.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0925.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0924.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0923.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0922.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0921.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0933.jpg


    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0920.jpg  
    Last edited by geodon; 24th January 2015 at 10:32 AM.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    Default Progress

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0934.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0937.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0936.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0935.jpg

    After satisfying myself that my parts won't dissolve, I treated 4 more rims overnight.

    The results were pretty good.

    I ditched baling wire for gal chain to suspend them because it needed no supplementary electrical connection & could conduct current without getting hot. But, I had to wire brush the point where the chain bolts to make sure current could pass.

    I believe the reason the crevasses are hard to clean is that the paint is very thick there. The rim that has had 48 hours has improved & the paint can be slowly winkled out with the Karcher nozzle up real close.

    Results depend on how much paint is there- I counted 5 layers on one rim!

    With 5 rims in one tank, the amps dropped to 10-12 & the volts are down to 5-7. It's drawing about 100 watts so it's costing as much a light globe to run.

    I suspect when I commission the 2nd tank I may need another charger to drive it.

    *That's LuLu the Wonder Dog AKA the Scourge of the Bellarine Bunnies*
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    If cross plies they would be 5-90 by 15 and no definitely not, why put yourself through the misery?
    Also, you where would you buy such a thing, maybe Indian Excelsior tyres would be available.
    You can get Nexens in 195 70 15 this would be a suitable choice and good value I think.

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    I'm now the new owner of Adrian Wuilleman's Peugeot 404 utility. Man, that was an interesting drive from Sydney to Geelong with a thumping load on the trailer. Everything went well thanks in part to Adrian's skill at tying Gordian knots with my elastic ropes.

    I've admired these things for many years and am looking forward to doing a sympathetic resto.

    The first challenge is to get it off the trailer- both rear brakes are seized and the tyres have "ceased to be".

    Well you have to start somewhere so I will start with the wheels: sandblast, paint (Sage Grey) & new tyres. Are 165x15 cross-ply appropriate?

    I am aiming for a European style canopy. Can someone put me onto to a contact that has one? About 10 years ago, I restored a 1960 VW single cab ute with an original canopy & from photos they are very similar: i.e. U-section steel hoops & hardwood slats. I'd like someone to do me a template so I can bend the hoops.

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
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    Default Graham is Dead Right!

    Spot on, Graham.

    I can get the orig tyres via Antique Tyres but at $230 each, I'm not that anal.

    The local Bob Jane's have been very helpful. They measured a rim & said the 195x15's will fit & work fine & I can get a set for not much more than a per of the previous.
    They even stripped & got rid of the old ones gratis & no deposit required in anticipation of my business
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    Good to see some progress on the old ute
    Adrian Wuillemin

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    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    I'd be interested to know how you intend to dispose of 1600 litres of dodgy liquid after you've finished with it? Are you proposing to make it chemically safe?
    It's another lovely day! Again!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I'd be interested to know how you intend to dispose of 1600 litres of dodgy liquid after you've finished with it? Are you proposing to make it chemically safe?
    If molasses was used it could be recycled on toast.

    Kim, not too many car restoration pursuits are without by products.
    Mutual Respect is Contagious


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    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    I'm merely suggesting that smart people don't tip chemicals down the drain...........
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    It's another lovely day! Again!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I'm merely suggesting that smart people don't tip chemicals down the drain...........
    Unless it is the Government or big business chasing royalties and profits.

    I live in a toxic wasteland called Gladstone where companies put much worse than this down the drains and straight out I to the harbour.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I'd be interested to know how you intend to dispose of 1600 litres of dodgy liquid after you've finished with it? Are you proposing to make it chemically safe?
    Ye Gods & Tin Fishies!!

    Sodium Carbonate is washing soda & is a common ingredient in laundry detergent.

    The NaOH is the main ingredient of dishwasher detergent.

    It's what is discharged from a domestic washing machine & dishwasher.

    The gases coming off are oxygen ( can I have a few carbon dioxide credits for that please??) and hydrogen both of which quite benign unless you were on the Hindenburg

    For the record, the liquid does not need changing. Only the water needs topping up. I can use it indefinately.

    When it's time I'll pump it out onto my paddock (which is what is happening with countless septic tanks around the country) and then scrape the residue into bins for the tip.

    Judging by how it grows over our septic drainage network, the grass will love it.

    Dodgy?? Hey! Read the refs I posted.

    Some of the guys prefer stainless steel as an anode because it lasts forever. A byproduct of that is hexavalent chromium. Google Erin Brokovich if you want to know about that.

    Now, who's putting dodgy stuff down drains then?
    Last edited by geodon; 27th January 2015 at 09:12 AM.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
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    Oh! And alot of the paint that comes off may contain lead.


    Soooooo, the residue that I take to the tip will have safely removed an environmental toxin; better and safer than a wire brush blowing it into the air.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    I was looking at the stainless steel anode in one of the links you posted and wondered about Chromium deposits.....as you won't be using stainless anodes you shouldn't have a problem. What other toxins could be dissolved and in suspension in the electrolyte?
    It's another lovely day! Again!

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    Only what's on the parts that would be otherwise flung/blasted into the atmosphere via whatever type of abrasion is chosen to clean them.

    As you probably know, the main chemical reaction is to convert rust to a more stable form of iron oxide while the bubbles of gas from the hydrolysis of water dislodge loose rust, paint & whatever else is stuck on and which either forms a sludge on the bottom of the tank or is washed off.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

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    Default A Pop-Up Spray Booth

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0948.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0949.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0959.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0964.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0961.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0950.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0963.jpg

    The ute is STILL on the trailer due to having no wheels. The rims are in bare metal but are unpainted due to the weather not being conducive to painting outside- too windy.

    4 yrs ago, I painted the Land Rover indoors. Whilst not being all that skilled & only being able to work with acrylic, it turned out Ok due the finish on early LR's being, errrrm, a bit agricultural. But, I'm still cleaning up overspray so I won't do that again.

    Faced with wanting to paint the underside, engine bays etc. on 2 vehicles, I thought I'd better get ready. This is the result.

    70x22 TP decking (~ $1.90 pm) frames with Grunt clear builders film ($100 for a 50x2m roll) stapled on. It's 6x3mx2.6m high so it will fit a complete car on a rotisserie. It has an exhaust fan. I worked with 3m modules as that's what one man can handle easily, but the ceiling is 6x3 & permanently suspended by baling wire at ~ 12 points. It's very light. I will store the 3m panels outside when not in use but in a shady area as the film is not UV stable.

    Meanwhile electrolysis keeps working its magic: that's a Dauphine fuel tank holder-upper.
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    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  17. #17
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    Default Progress!

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0968.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0970.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0966.jpgPeugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0969.jpg

    La Camionette a cinque boutons nouveaux!

    This was also an appropriate time to make sure there were enough hub caps.

    I plagiarized the idea used by VW to remove hubcaps without damaging my pristine rims. I cut a slot in some steel rod to take a nail then welded it in place to make a T-handled tool to engage a small hole on the rim of the hub cap.
    Last edited by geodon; 19th February 2015 at 04:30 PM.
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    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  18. #18
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    There are at least two sets of hub caps.

    Looking good
    Adrian Wuillemin

  19. #19
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    Default Finally!

    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0982.jpg
    Peugeot 404 Utility Project-img_0984.jpg
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  20. #20
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    Default A Question or two.

    I just spent time going under and over.

    I'm delighted with the sheer simplicity of the thing! It makes the Dauphine look very sophisticated.

    I'm certain that once I release the torque tube mounts at the front & detach the spring shackles from the frame the entire rear end should just roll out on its wheels. Correct?

    At the front, I've never worked on McPherson struts. Am I correct that the procedure is to compress the springs, release the 3 bolts at the top & remove the spring. Then I can detach the cross member mounting bolts & out rolls the front end complete with the rack & pinion.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  21. #21
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    Just undo the three bolts. There is a centre nut under the plastic cover.

    There is a spring retainer

    Correct assumption about the rear suspension also.
    Adrian Wuillemin

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Wuillemi View Post
    Just undo the three bolts. There is a centre nut under the plastic cover.

    There is a spring retainer

    Correct assumption about the rear suspension also.
    Thnx Adrian.

    Ya gotta love the 'net:



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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEaevAxA8Gc
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  23. #23
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    Yes, don't try to work on the front struts on the car, pull the complete strut out first.

    Take the inner control arm bolt out before letting the suspension drop as there is a rebound section of the arm which will put pressure on the bush at full droop. Also, you need to put the weight of the car onto the strut before refitting this bolt.
    Pretty tricky, a good trolley jack on the brake backing plate is your friend.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Wuillemi View Post
    Just undo the three There is a spring retainer There is a centre nut under the plastic cover.



    Correct assumption about the rear suspension also.
    Last edited by GRAHAM WALLIS; 21st February 2015 at 10:02 AM.
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  24. #24
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    Fairly sure the stunts are rebuild able. graham?
    Adrian Wuillemin

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    You can pull them apart but of course you need the replacement parts to be able to rebuild them
    Colin H could probably do it if he had the time.
    Good chance they have been replaced by aftermarket inserts anyway.



    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Wuillemi View Post
    Fairly sure the stunts are rebuild able. graham?

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