Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed. Need a s/hand replacement fan.
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  1. #1
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    Default Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed. Need a s/hand replacement fan.

    I removed the heater unit from the Laguna 2, V6 today, was a relatively easy job, the heater fan motor would hardly turn, freed it up after removal, and it still didn't work, tried it out of the car with a direct feed from 12 volt and it was obviously cactus, so I took the lower casing cap off it to examine the motor.

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    There was obvious signs of corrosion where water from the blocked windscreen plenum drain, area had got into the unit. Felt the design of the casing actually channeled the water to the bottomof the casing where it collected with obvious results!!

    The markings on the end plate of the motor is - Delphi 52488124, TEMIC (registered name) 01311
    073A35 - RHD-12V 0333 01.02.2002

    Pictures of the removed unit.

    It sounds almost the same as the one that Col removed from his Laguna 1 - after removal of holding screw the unit just twists off the casing below the pollen filter. ( will post some pics later from under the dash)

    Now I just have to try and source a good working secondhand unit, and make sure the windscreen plenum area is clear and drains unblocked.

    If you have, or know of a spare one let me know please.

    Ken
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-036.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-037.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-038.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-040.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-041.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-042.jpg  

    Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-043.jpg  

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    Fellow Frogger! Only19's Avatar
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    Hi Ken - photos a good idea: totally different to the Lag 1 I am afraid.
    Cheers
    Bryce
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    Those brushes aren't just worn out are they ..... Though if it was seized it's likely the commutator is toast

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post
    I removed the heater unit from the Laguna 2, V6 today, was a relatively easy job, the heater fan motor would hardly turn, freed it up after removal, and it still didn't work, tried it out of the car with a direct feed from 12 volt and it was obviously cactus, so I took the lower casing cap off it to examine the motor.

    There was obvious signs of corrosion where water from the blocked windscreen plenum drain, area had got into the unit. Felt the design of the casing actually channeled the water to the bottomof the casing where it collected with obvious results!!

    The markings on the end plate of the motor is - Delphi 52488124, TEMIC (registered name) 01311
    073A35 - RHD-12V 0333 01.02.2002

    Pictures of the removed unit.

    It sounds almost the same as the one that Col removed from his Laguna 1 - after removal of holding screw the unit just twists off the casing below the pollen filter. ( will post some pics later from under the dash)

    Now I just have to try and source a good working secondhand unit, and make sure the windscreen plenum area is clear and drains unblocked.

    If you have, or know of a spare one let me know please.


    Ken
    Measure the motor casing diameter and length. Measure the shaft diameter and note the method fixing.

    Then go to Pick a Part or Jolly's U Pull it and try to find something similar. I would search the later Toyota with ND Electrics.

    You are bound to find something.

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    COL
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    Hi Ken

    Have a look on Ebay UK, you may find a fan the same as yours.
    Regards Col

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    Icon14 Thanks for the advice. All helps!!

    Thanks all for the comments

    Tried for a s/hand unit today, unfortunately all heater fans seem to go fairly quickly. I'm not surprised. I am looking at the possibility of drilling a drain hole in the base, "just in case" water gets into the new fan, might have to add a "drip can" underneath I guess that a drain hole wouldn't interfere too much with directing the wind capacity to its ultimate destination.

    Fortunately the car is warm enough on long drives with just the fresh air entering from outside. Might be a bit different in Summer tho.

    Need to dig out the spare heater fan that I bought with RCCV spares, to see how much it varies from this one, trouble with adapting one is that it wont be compatible with the electronics of the climate control unit.

    In the pics above there is a small copper wire that seems to be detached at one end, not sure if that might have some function in the grand scheme of things. You can just see that wire in the top of the bottom row photo.

    If I get either a new one or a replacement s/hand unit, I will pull the old one completely apart (I enjoy pulling things apart, but no gaurantee I'll get it back together)

    Ken

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    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
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    Looks like every bloody Peugeot/CitroŽn part that I buy from the UK, in ostensibly "good" condition.

    I am guessing that although you "freed it up", the fan does still not spin freely?

    The self-aligning bush at the base has probably fused to the motor shaft and is now gripped by its spring steel fingers. If it held a lot of water the brush contact springs may have corroded and lost tension.

    A cleverly aimed puller will remove the fan from the shaft top, to allow more complete dismantlement.

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    I know of a good place in Noble Park doing a good job rewinding DC motors, new commutator included. I'll find out the details if you are interested.
    The electric PS pump on my Toyota died (commutator worn out) and a new one is $2000.- so i dismantled it and had it had it rewound for $140.-
    "The enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it's the illusion of knowledge"
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    COL
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    Hi Ken

    Another thought is do a ring around the Renault wreckers in this country you maybe surprised at what you may find.
    Regards Col

    1973 Renault R12 Station Wagon
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    Icon14 Some possibilities..

    There are a couple used fans on the UK ebay 30 to 40 UK pounds plus postage - one does send to Australia. will try and source local if I can first. Has a bit of weight to post (but not as bad as some other bits!!)

    So looks like there are possibilities...

    Might email some friends in the UK and see what they can source there, as there is a couple of other items that I might need too.

    Thanks again,

    Jobo, I'll let you know if I think a rebuild is on the cards, the motor spins o.k., just need to get access to the innards, for a better look, and clean up/inspection.

    Already tried Dave for one, with no success. and also another guy in Coburg who was very helpful about ringing around his sources, but he rang back to say he could not help.


    Ken

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    You should be able to land a used one for about $120. How heavy is it?

    In the case of Fleabay sellers who don't state postage to Australia, I usually phone up and try twisting their arm; if they can agree on a posted total, get them to send you a PayPal invoice and settle it immediately. That way Fleabay is left out and they usually write it up as VAT exempt so there's a double bonus in it for them.

    When all else fails, I have a couple of people who will use their accounts to bid or buy for me, then onforward. I pay them 20% of their gross outlay as a biscuit.

    Make sure if you buy from the UK, that it is well-packaged. Explain to the seller that it will probably be used as a substitute ball in at least one rugby contest before delivery.

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    Default Preliminary success, encouraging.....

    Quote Originally Posted by addo View Post
    Looks like every bloody Peugeot/CitroŽn part that I buy from the UK, in ostensibly "good" condition.

    I am guessing that although you "freed it up", the fan does still not spin freely?

    The self-aligning bush at the base has probably fused to the motor shaft and is now gripped by its spring steel fingers. If it held a lot of water the brush contact springs may have corroded and lost tension.

    A cleverly aimed puller will remove the fan from the shaft top, to allow more complete dismantlement.

    Sorry that I have been diverted from the task, my son seemed to think he could get a new one from a mate in Europe at a reasonable (inside trade) price, so let him try and source a new one. (nothing yet!!)

    I then got involved in some family things that took up my time, but while waiting I got emboldened by your advice Addo, I set about trying to get the old one apart to clean and check it, sprung the back cover off (the one with the Delphi part # details) then very carefully used a pin punch just under the size of the shaft, tapping gently with a fairly large engineers hammer and using the weight of the motor section to slowly move the shaft out of the plastic fan section, disconnected the wires from the housing by using some thin windscreen wiper metal strips to depress the brass spring style retention, noted that the black wire went in the outside of the fitting and the red on the inner for reassembly (eventually) I had also marked the relative position of the fan on the shaft.

    Cleaned as much as I could to get rid of the coating of carbon dust, then probed the workings to see how they could be removed, the main assembly that holds the brushes in contact with the commutator is spring loaded and secured by two brass clips, that can be easily prised open (see pics) and then pulled up out of the way to get to the commutator surface which was black, dirty and roughly worn (not good) I used a small flat fine grade file to roughly even up the commutator surface, then put a drill chuck on the end and spun the rotating parts at a speed that I could use fine sandpaper pressed against the commutator to polish it up nice and clean. I put light squirt of Tal 5 lubricant to soak into both bearings, and it spun nicely to make the polishing up easy.

    I had sprayed some electrical contact stuff inside the motor and then had to use paper towel ( the Aldi's thicker stuff) to soak up the excess, wasn't sure if this would interfere with the brush and commutator contact. it did lubricate the coiled springing system that supplies pressure to hold the brushes in contact, I was perhaps a bit too generous as you can see from the pics. Probably should have used a hydrocarbon cleaner and compressed air if I was doing it again.

    I though what the hell, it may not work anyway and proceeded to replace the brush holders which was quite easy and with the clips protruding I was able to lever then partially into the correct holding position, once both were in position I set up a battery charger with the 12 volt negative to the black and then touched the positive clamp to the red wire and was rewarded with a steady buzz as the motor fired up - so it works.

    Next thing is to reinstate the motor in the housing and replace the plastic fan gently on the shaft, not sure if I will need to apply a smear of araldite to hold it in position. I will probably try it without first. The last thing will be to reinstate the end cap, making sure the housing and motor seats in the hexagonal rubber supports at both ends (that may be a trial and error exercise) I also wonder about drilling a small hole or two in the lower housing to stop water accumulating and corroding the lower part of the motor (see previous pics)

    So I might be lucky!! Ive now tightened the brush clips properly now it runs and will over the next few days (no distractions from the task!!) test it again and return it to the car.

    If this works it will be a considerable saving, perhaps I should set up a heater fan recovery service its seem just so easy if the motor has only seized up and not burnt itself out, seems fairly robust wiring. One other thing that I did to the polished commutator is use a small flat bladed screw driver to reinstate the clearance between the commutator segments, then lightly polish the commutator to remove any raised copper.

    Now see if I got the pictures in....

    Thanks again addo!
    Ken
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-001.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-004.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-007.jpg   Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-008.jpg  

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    I don't think you need to credit me personally - it's more about the old school approach of exhausting your practical options for minimal outlay.

    Besides, were you to source another working fan, I doubt you would relinquish the old one - it would be stored away "just in case". So, you may have saved a little space, too!

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    Quote Originally Posted by addo View Post
    I don't think you need to credit me personally - it's more about the old school approach of exhausting your practical options for minimal outlay.

    Besides, were you to source another working fan, I doubt you would relinquish the old one - it would be stored away "just in case". So, you may have saved a little space, too!
    Shoosh, mother might hear you!! I though I was in reforming mode, but last week dragged home a lot of useful junk. Love to sell some of it, but so far can only try to give it away, and I was sweating on you to deliver some bits in your travels, or even take the freeby tee shirts I grabbed for you!!

    Still got that job to do too but that might have to wait until after I recover from a knee replacement (that I am not looking forward to!!) unless you get to do it yourself!!

    Ken

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    Icon7 Tis working in car.

    Well today, I put everything back together and the fan is back in the car and working correctly - I was concerned that it might not work properly with the variable speed fan arrangement as that is much different than hitting the main wires with direct 12 volt (but it was nice to hear it respond )

    I have taken a few photographs to illustrate where the fan sits in the car and also the importance of how the wiringis connected - main thing is that the connector with the red wire is the key identifier as it is possible to connect either end to the unit and the controller unit, and if connected the wrong way, it will not respond properly to the variable speed control - fortunately it doesn't seem to do any damage to connect it the wrong way around

    There is a picture showing the correct connection sequence between the blue controller unit
    (A/C resistor Renault part # 77 01 206 541) and the fan unit, the other pictures show the location where the resister unit sits in the fan housing, I found it much easier to fit the blue unit in place before you replace the fan as it is easier to see what you are doing and to get the 5.5mm hex headed screw back into those lugs.

    The fan unit was then placed back in the fan housing, and twisted to lock it after locating the front lug towards the cabin interior and lock it in that location with one of the 5.5mm hex screws, the other photos give a good indication of the effect of water overflowing from the plenum chamber of the windshield (next job!! to clear the drain_) and rusting from the water splashes.

    Note if anyone has done that job recently and has some tips to easy clearance of those drains, let me know On the Fuego you just located the lower part of the plenum drain pipe and blew compressed air up the pipe and this also cleared the plenum area - nice and easy) I can't seem to find anything easy and similar to that on the Laguna, but then I haven't looked that hard!!

    The other closeup shows the metal clips that secure the end cap of the motor unit, easy to remove and replace they just snap into position. Incidently I did anticipate that there might be some fiddling around to position the hexagonal ends of the motor in line with the rubber hex mounts in the housing, but they went together nicely.

    The fan was replaced on the shaft by the simple method of first locating the upper casing on its rubber mount, then putting the fan on a flat surface, inverting the motor and lining up the plastic boss and the shaft and then using a few hand thumps on the bottom of the motor to get it properly seated in position, then I replaced the end cap, I didn't drill any extra holes in the bottom cap at this stage as you can puncture the Delphi product lable where it fits over a hole in the base and achieve the same enhanced draining effect, if needed! Best to cure the plenum overflow problem instead.

    All in all I guess you could do the removal, disassembly, clean up of commutator, test, then re-assembly and refit to car in under a couple of hours once you know what you are doing (probably less once familiar with the unit design).

    Hope that this helps other to tackle the job or refurbish the fan you ditched!

    Ken.

    Laguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-001.jpgLaguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-002.jpgLaguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-004.jpgLaguna 2 V6 (2002) Heater fan removed.  Need a s/hand replacement fan.-006.jpg

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    Default Drain holes unblocked. Easy job... replaced wiper blades too.

    With the weekend coming up, and likely to be wet, and needing to travel to Echuca on Friday, I bit the bullet and removed the windscreen wipers and the plastic shrouds below the windscreen, fairly easy job, and found that lumps of mud and bits of plastic had built up and obstructed the quite large drain holes on each side of the plenum chamber, hence entry of water in the vicinity of the air opening to the heater fan cabin filter as the rain water built up in that area.

    Almost easier to vaccumn the leaves and possum Sh*t off the top off the filter than remove it, drove to an from Echuca today plenty of rain, heater fan worked well - lovely!!

    Only one minor thing the TAL 5 has a strong sweet oil smell, and of course that filled the car, but no complaints from the Missus, she likes the smell.

    Yep nice to have an operating fan and no wonder it was "bl@@dy" cold with the fan and the resister unit removed that spurred me on to fix the fan ASAP....

    And with the new wiper blades, much easier driving in the quite heavy rain, especially on the return trip to Melbourne tonight - very heavy traffic heading to Echuca, not much coming to Melbourne (must be all the anti football people e3scaping the AFL grand Final this weekend!!.


    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post

    ....And with the new wiper blades, much easier driving in the quite heavy rain, ....

    Ken
    A bit OT but I was driving the Estima today (first time in pelting rain) and even without wipers the rain seemed to part and turn to blobs on the front screen and front door side windows. It really makes a difference to visibility.

    It's like the car has a coating of Rainex on it.

    After RTFM (translated version) I discovered it has a "silicon- titanium window treatment" and I need to avoid any scratching, especially when removing mud.

    I've never seen this before can anyone elaborate?

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    Digging up an old thread, I know, but just wanted to say thanks to the OP - I had the same problem in my car's heater fan, followed almost exactly this path (not quite so thorough with the motor clean-up) and voila, we seem to have a good result! And, as stated by OP, quite a simple job - I was done in about an hour. Thanks again!

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    Thanks Mark r

    Funny thing the heater fan is still going strong, and it is nice to do it yourself, more the time saving than the ,money as the spares do not seem to be obtainable and new ones are just too expensive for the value of the car.

    It is one helluva vehicle, I still love driving it, but getting a bit long in the tooth.

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post
    Thanks Mark r

    ........ I still love driving it, but getting a bit long in the tooth.

    Ken

    hmmmmm........

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post
    Funny thing the heater fan is still going strong, and it is nice to do it yourself, more the time saving than the ,money as the spares do not seem to be obtainable and new ones are just too expensive for the value of the car.
    5 years - that's reassuring Ken! Our grand plan is to keep the car for about another 3-4 years, long story short (it's only got about 137,000 km - for a long time we did very little commute driving) so if this solves one of the myriad of small nagging faults they suffer from, that'll be great!

    Now, being negative for a minute and presuming it doesn't: for about $AU190 (as I type) you can pick up a brand new fan/motor assembly to your door ex-UK on eBay - search for (worldwide) "RENAULT LAGUNA INTERIOR CABIN HEATER BLOWER FAN MOTOR REPLACEMENT" or combo thereof (not going to put in a direct link coz eBay ads are ephemeral). Each will need to decide on their own merits whether their car is worth the $190 investment.

    And, bottom line, I certainly prefer the much cheaper investment of a few squirts of WD40 and some elbow grease, while that works!

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    Cabin fan blower is still working well as at April 2018, interior plastics starting to degrade a bit, but Laguna is still going strong. I keep using the philosophy to at least try and fix anything myself and so far that seems to work for me.

    Not used as regularly as the Megane is the daily driver. Washed the Laguna last week, but drew the line at polishing it..!! Don't want to mozz the car. Last fill of fuel the odometer turned over at 315882

    Ken

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    Last fill of fuel the odometer turned over at 315882
    It owes you nothing at this time and has been a very good purchase.

    Most "modern" cars in the wreckers at around 200,000

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    Icon11 Cars and spare time...

    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    It owes you nothing at this time and has been a very good purchase.

    Most "modern" cars in the wreckers at around 200,000
    That was my intention Rob, it also has towing capability for my trailer, Last tow job was to carry away the remains of Dianne's million kilometre original Fuego. I did strip out most parts that could be recycled to other Fuego's, sadly there were some parts that I would have liked to salvage, but I lacked the time and yes the energy these days. Did remove the engine and transmission for some future Forensic examination of its durability in service too.

    In those days she used to sink quite a bit of money into new parts while she could and those were available over the counter. Car had been sitting unused after it had started to scrub out the expensive original tyres that were fitted and rust appeared in the junction of serious rear end collision repairs (accident was not her fault) and her fight with her then comprehensive insurer as to fixing it properly.

    Took a few years but in the end they capitulated and it was fixed, but the rust above the rear hatch line ensured it never went back on the road. So endeth the million mile/km? Fuggie story. Now I need to get to my Fuego and fix a wiring gremlin that is interfering with night lighting system. Looking for a round..tuit. and they are hard to find these days...

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post
    Cabin fan blower is still working well as at April 2018, interior plastics starting to degrade a bit, but Laguna is still going strong. I keep using the philosophy to at least try and fix anything myself and so far that seems to work for me.

    Not used as regularly as the Megane is the daily driver. Washed the Laguna last week, but drew the line at polishing it..!! Don't want to mozz the car. Last fill of fuel the odometer turned over at 315882

    Ken
    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    It owes you nothing at this time and has been a very good purchase.

    Most "modern" cars in the wreckers at around 200,000
    Looks like mine has a bit of life left in it, having only done 131XXX Km
    Regards Col

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    1976 Renault R12 Station Wagon
    2002 Renault Laguna V6
    1973 Alpine A110

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