R12 Camshaft grind
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! R8philSA's Avatar
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    Default R12 Camshaft grind

    Hi there all Renault Techo people.

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    I need your advice please.
    I am contacting you in regards to choosing a sensible better performance camshaft grind for my R12 Type 842-01 engine.
    I am completely rebuilding the engine at the moment and it is to be fitted into my 1964 R8 coupled up with a R10s clutch etc. I'm not looking to race this engine, simply club events but would like to give it a bit more poke 'as to speak' and still use the Weber 32DIR, if possible, with jet sizes increased. I will be using the R12 inlet and exhaust manifolds coupled up to a twin pipe Gordini Muffler. Also, if you could advise me on what should be done with the distributor curve and tappet settings I would also be very grateful.
    Thank you for the time taken to read this and I look forward to any advice you can give me.
    Cheers - R8philSA

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    Phil,
    have a look for a thread I started about modifying a 1.4 engine earlier this year. There is a lot of good information in there as a starting point. For what you want, it would seem the Cosworth A3 grind might be best. I went with the Cosworth A6 which is too wild a grind for the sort of engine it sounds like you want. R12 Exhaust may be fine for you, but you may want to consider a single DCOE sidedraft weber or similar.
    KB

    Edit - Actually Phil, it was YOUR thread on wanting to buy Extractors. Some good input from people like Alan Moore and Frans in there.
    Last edited by renault8&10; 24th July 2012 at 11:49 PM.
    KB


  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! R8philSA's Avatar
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    OK, thanks for the reply KB.

    I'll go back through the threads and have a look.

    Cheers

    phil

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R8philSA View Post
    Hi there all Renault Techo people.

    I need your advice please.
    I am contacting you in regards to choosing a sensible better performance camshaft grind for my R12 Type 842-01 engine.
    I am completely rebuilding the engine at the moment and it is to be fitted into my 1964 R8 coupled up with a R10s clutch etc. I'm not looking to race this engine, simply club events but would like to give it a bit more poke 'as to speak' and still use the Weber 32DIR, if possible, with jet sizes increased. I will be using the R12 inlet and exhaust manifolds coupled up to a twin pipe Gordini Muffler. Also, if you could advise me on what should be done with the distributor curve and tappet settings I would also be very grateful.
    Thank you for the time taken to read this and I look forward to any advice you can give me.
    Cheers - R8philSA
    What sort of "club" events. If you are staying with the Weber downdraft and the stock manifolds I would suggest a few steps down in cam from the A3 Cosworth that was originally discussed. Obviously not looking for an all out road burner.

    If you look at the Ford 1600 range of cams on the Tighecams site, I would recommend the 113 or the 102 as still a good upgrade from stock, and with only a bit of a lope at idle with the 113. I am running either a 113 or 102 (can't remember as it was a cam I was given) in my 16TS powered 4CV with a 16TS downdraft as a detuning from the 293C cam and twin sidedraft Webers. Certainly it has lost a lot of top end above 6000, but is truly a much better and useable machine allround, and still not slow.

    In this case though my 16TS still has 11.3 comp ratio, big valves and porting and reasonable set of pipes. Don't know what the power is (maybe 110Hp) but the torque is glorious.
    '56 Renault 750 (16TS Power)
    '62 Renault Dauphine Gordini
    '89 Renault Alpine GTA V6 Turbo
    '08 Renault Megane sedan

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! stew's Avatar
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    I'll have a go for you. Gee those grind numbers bring back memories!

    A new shaft would be best but a regrind done on a std cam can be worked around.
    You will need new valve springs.
    I need bore and stroke, inlet and exhaust valve head size and static compression ratio.

    A picture of the exhaust manifold at the engine and a picture of the inlet manifold you will use and I'll have a go! Bare in mind that this will change the engine. The carb may need tuning. I'm confident, if we both get the figures right, that an ignition curve can be designed and run in the the old dist. The one thing that must happen is that the points and condenser be deleted and electronic triggering employed. In other words, chuck the points and condenser to the shit house!
    Keen to have a go!

    Last edited by stew; 25th July 2012 at 10:29 PM.

  6. #6
    Simon's Avatar
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    When it comes to setting the car up, have a chat with Kent Town Autotune, who are old Renault friendly. He should be able to help with re-graphing the dizzy and setting up the carby to suit the cam you choose.
    1963 Renault R4 Van
    1964 Renault R4
    1967 Volkswagen 1300 Deluxe
    1969 Renault 8 Gordini 1300
    2002 Land Rover Defender Td5 130 - ex-CFA Region 4
    2005 Renaultsport Clio 182 Cup

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! Chopper Bob's Avatar
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    Phil, I used to run the A6 grind in my old R8 1100 and it was a very good, useable camshaft. The engine would pull strongly from 2000 rpm and the top end was improved. From memory I had double valve springs fitted and the engine would rev happily past 6000 rpm The A6 Cosworth grind was very similar to the Lotus engine Escorts of the same era. Recommended.
    Regards
    Chopper Bob

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! R8philSA's Avatar
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    Thanks Bob

    Talk to you more about this on Sunday Morning at the swap meet.

    Cheers mate

    Phil

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger! R8philSA's Avatar
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    Thanks Stew
    Have to have a re-think after our Club Metting the other night. If you can get a hold of a copy of the Government of South Australia CODE OF PRACTICE for Historic Vehicles, it's almost like if it is not original specs, then forget trying to do much else!! It's now about signing a Stat. Dec. every 12 months to say the vehicle is as the original manufacturer made it.

    Thanks anyway Stew.

    Phil

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! stew's Avatar
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    I reckon by using the vastly improved, computer controlled "machining" due to the
    " unavailability" of new genuine valve timing/ train componants added to the fact that one needs to "optimise" the tuning of ignition and fuel for use with the very much different "Clean, Modern Fuels" our Mighty Australian Government insists will regreen the planet, one blade of grass/one broken hearted Australian at a time, and the fact that purely ensuring tha,t the build specifications of the engine are to more exacting tolerances completely unanticipated during the Dawning of the Modern French Motor Car Industry , 50 friggin years and 1000 000 kms ago. The engine is a f###in' beauty! Of course I'll sign!
    Stop me before I start to dribb........Oh s###, I'm dribbling again............................................. .................................................. ...........

    Any way If you want to run single valve springs we can "machine to tolerence" a cam to do as Renault intended with modern "techniques " developed by scientists who dicovered the earth was flat and warming.....
    Here I go again! !

  11. #11
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    When it comes to setting the car up, have a chat with Kent Town Autotune, who are old Renault friendly. He should be able to help with re-graphing the dizzy and setting up the carby to suit the cam you choose.
    Kent Town Auto Tune. Wow. Is ??? Hurley STILL there? He was absolutely excellent last time I needed help in 1988. The workshop then had a 16TS and a MG K3 Magnette under a dust cover. Wow wasn't the word.
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
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    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  12. #12
    Simon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    Is ??? Hurley STILL there?
    Yes, John Hurley still runs the place. It is about the only place you would go with an old school car with ignition or fuel problems.
    1963 Renault R4 Van
    1964 Renault R4
    1967 Volkswagen 1300 Deluxe
    1969 Renault 8 Gordini 1300
    2002 Land Rover Defender Td5 130 - ex-CFA Region 4
    2005 Renaultsport Clio 182 Cup

  13. #13
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    Yes, John Hurley still runs the place. It is about the only place you would go with an old school car with ignition or fuel problems.
    I'm gobsmacked. John was excellent, but it is a long time for that business still to be there...

    I'll be in Adelaide mid-September - Perhaps a catch up? I'll try also to drop in to see John again.

    Thanks Simon.

    Wow.
    Last edited by JohnW; 29th July 2012 at 05:27 PM.
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

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