Used Laguna review from The Age
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! ColinJ's Avatar
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    Default Used Laguna review from The Age

    nothing surprising in this review - a great car (safest car in the world when it was released), appallingly marketed in Aust, is the message - but I post it in case someone is interested

    http://www.theage.com.au/news/review...302827177.html

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    Sometimes I come to the view that Renault should never have bothered launching the Laguna in Australia - they should've tried to develop credibility before moving into the prestige segment.

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    Sometimes I come to the view that Renault should never have bothered launching the Laguna in Australia - they should've tried to develop credibility before moving into the prestige segment.
    Well, the original Laguna was pretty popular, especially considering to get one you had to fight off the salesperson trying to sell you a Volvo.

    ..but the segment had changed a lot by the time Renault came back with Laguna II - people were jumping into 4WD's etc - I think Renault probably thought that the relative success with the original Laguna would be repeated. Not the case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    Well, the original Laguna was pretty popular, especially considering to get one you had to fight off the salesperson trying to sell you a Volvo.
    Aah, how many did they sell of these 'pretty popular' Lagunas?

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    ..but the segment had changed a lot by the time Renault came back with Laguna II - people were jumping into 4WD's etc - I think Renault probably thought that the relative success with the original Laguna would be repeated. Not the case.
    I don't think the 4WD thing is a real issue - the prestige segment had plenty of size in it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    Aah, how many did they sell of these 'pretty popular' Lagunas?
    I have no idea. I was just amazed that they sold any at the time. Did you ever visit a Volvo/Renault dealer during that period?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    I don't think the 4WD thing is a real issue - the prestige segment had plenty of size in it.
    I could have sworn I was reading in the past few years that this segment had changed somewhat (ie. shrunk) between the mid 90's and early 00's. I believe the article mentioned that part of the reason was the movement to 4WD vehicles.

    Do they sell more 407's than 405's?

    BTW, I'm not going to argue with you, I'm as curious as you are.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    I have no idea. I was just amazed that they sold any at the time. Did you ever visit a Volvo/Renault dealer during that period?
    C'mon, remember who I am Of course I visited Volvo/Renault dealers at the time - I've still got the invitation to test drive a Laguna and get a watch in return!

    In Australia, Renault distrubutors have certainly sold more Laguna IIs than Laguna Is. Bigger range, and there were some fleet arrangements - eg. with Budget for rentals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    I could have sworn I was reading in the past few years that this segment had changed somewhat (ie. shrunk) between the mid 90's and early 00's. I believe the article mentioned that part of the reason was the movement to 4WD vehicles.
    The volume of the prestige segment has certainly grown since then - I've managed to see 2001 figures (the earliest I have at hand), 2005's latest segment share figures show prestige cars ahead compared to then.

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    Do they sell more 407's than 405's?
    I'd say so, given the 407 is one of the top performers in the prestige segment now and that Peugeot sales have doubled/tripled since the 405's later days.

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    Default Dealership + marketing issues

    This has all the hallmarks of dealership and marketing issues overwhelming what is a fine and very safe motor car which should have generated volume sales.

    Dealer support and servicing is absolutely vital to the continued enjoyment of the Laguna experience and only time will tell if the automatic will fall victim to heat problems and expensive repairs - the doomsday people allready predict it will have problems based mainly on past actual experience and a million furphies by those that can see into their crystal balls

    Failing to maintain the line by not offering a trade up to a newer model has a drastic effect on pricing and depreciation, but this may be a windfall to owners like myself who can easily afford to buy the car and give it ongoing support and service once it runs out of warranty.

    Then what will Renault do to ensure we are satisfied owners, and then entice us to take the leap to a newer model or are they just happy to allow us to become part of the older renault owners clan until, the vehicle becomes too expensive to service/change things such as air bags - there is already a risk that we may decide to opt out of a renault if there is nothing to entice us into a newer vehicle.

    There are already dealers out there who have for whatever reason decided that older renault owners don't buy new Renaults, a total fallacy, but this head in the sand brigade actually exists! much to the detriment of Renault's desire to build upon a solid base of satisfied owners who want to move into new or newer Renaults.

    Where is the incentive, the aggressive marketing rather than the passive effort so often observed - time to decide this issue and market a replacement for the Laguna style of vehicle and make it attractive for present owners to trade in on those newer vehicles, or is that just too simple to comprehend?

    If not then I hope that the Laguna is as good as my trusty Fuego, still going strong and enjoyable after all those years If it will last like that vehicle perhaps I will be content to wear the Laguna out over the next 30 years - god willing

    That is the challenge for the future IMHO. over to you Renault! make my day!

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    More reason why Renault shouldn't have bothered with the Laguna II when relaunching in Australia

    Nice dealers and fancy ad campaigns aren't going to bring people in to a nothing brand (Laguna) under the umbrella of a nothing, devoid of credibility parent brand (Renault). Lets not forget that Renault had $20,000,000 as an advertising budget, reasonable support for various promotional activities.

    They should've focused on a core group of models, rather than cover the whole market, especially in markets where the badge is even more cruicial.

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    Thanks for posting that review ColinJ. I saw it published in the Age, but took little interest because it was somewhat inaccurate. Suggesting that the timing belt should be changed at 50K kms was a bit sad when the recommended distance is double that. (If anyone knows any different, please tell me!)

    Whatever the story is with the size of the market segment in which the Laguna competed for sales, it was up against some quality competition from the other French importers, plus Italy, Germany, Japan and Australia. And returning from the wilderness was always to be a difficult business for Renault when the perceptions of luxury buyers are so strong and can easily overwhelm logic.

    Today is the third birthday of my Laguna and the end of its lease. The residual has been paid out, the warranty extended, and we'll spend some more time together. Or at least as long as I can resist the force that's now pulling me towards a 407.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Le Hughes
    And returning from the wilderness was always to be a difficult business for Renault when the perceptions of luxury buyers are so strong and can easily overwhelm logic.
    With heavy depreciation, the Laguna was never going to really succeed in the prestige segment - high depreciation sends leasing costs through the roof.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    C'mon, remember who I am Of course I visited Volvo/Renault dealers at the time - I've still got the invitation to test drive a Laguna and get a watch in return!
    To the best of my knowledge, I have never met you - all I know is your forum alias and avatar, both of which indicate a preference for Peugeots.

    I have neither the time, patience or industry knowledge to dispute your observations, I can only offer my opinion on the situation.

    I'll leave it up to the others to continue the thread
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    To the best of my knowledge, I have never met you - all I know is your forum alias and avatar, both of which indicate a preference for Peugeots.
    I thought my Volvo standing here was rather infamous

    Have a careful look my avatar, btw

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    I thought my Volvo standing here was rather infamous

    Have a careful look my avatar, btw
    Shouldn't that say VW and all other sympathizer??
    Thought you were Mantras best mate?
    Where is he? Not knocking renaults when there is a thread with a negative point in it is out of character even for him. Oh I bet VW have a great prestige car and he is just gathering knowledge on it to bash us with
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    I thought my Volvo standing here was rather infamous
    you're not still keen on Volvos are you? you sweet old-fashioned thing!

    (for those not in on the private joke, I knew Pug307 in the real world where I bagged him for three months plus on how boring Volvos were and what owning one said about the age of the owner - until he discovered that i actually drove one myself - a situation now remedied, I have two renaults now but old-fashioned Pug307 seems not to be as young and dynamic as me...)
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    There was a weird comment in that article about finding gears in the auto and having toal disconnection from drivetrain.
    It was pretty funny.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    With heavy depreciation, the Laguna was never going to really succeed in the prestige segment - high depreciation sends leasing costs through the roof.
    In which case one would argue that NO car should be leased until it's three years old because all cars suffer their greatest depreciation within the first two to three years of ownership...........

    The balancing factor for depreciation in a lease is often the discounting that it is possible to negotiate in the showroom when new, in addition to how the individual lease is structured. When I reflect on the alternative deals that were available to me with other comparable cars three years ago, there would be little financial difference in absolute terms now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Le Hughes
    When I reflect on the alternative deals that were available to me with other comparable cars three years ago, there would be little financial difference in absolute terms now.
    Really? Can you expand on that a little? That really surprises me.

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    Here are the retained value/resale figures (Redbook - after 3yrs)

    Renault Laguna 4cyl: 48%
    Renault Laguna V6: 47%

    Peugeot 407 ST: 57%
    Peugeot 407 SV: 58%

    Mitsubishi Verada: 44%

    Subaru 3.0R (someone mentioned this in the wagon thread?): 68%

    Mercedes-Benz C200 Kompressor: 74%

    Depreciation is the biggest cost of motoring, no question. If you intend on selling your car, that is.

    I think Renault's Laguna gets a bad reputation in this regard in that many of the new ones were bought by rental companies, which then means large numbers are dumped on the market at once. Recent discounting can't help either.

    This means that its a SENSATIONAL used buy though!!

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    Why the negativity re. Laguna? My brother in law (a Audi V6 owner) drove one and thought it was fantastic to drive.
    He hasn't sold his '94 Audi because he'd only get 3 to 5 on atrade in. so who says only Renaults depreciate out of sight?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinJ
    I have two renaults now but old-fashioned Pug307 seems not to be as young and dynamic as me...)
    Aah, shouldn't that be Dynamique for a Renault man

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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pug307
    Aah, shouldn't that be Dynamique for a Renault man
    I'll pay that Authentique Expression (I know, a really weak response, that...)
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinJ
    I'll pay that Authentique Expression (I know, a really weak response, that...)
    ...what a privelege to pay that! (even lamer!!! )
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinJ
    I'll pay that Authentique Expression (I know, a really weak response, that...)
    *Shudders*

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    Default Bare your financial details to the World??

    Dr Le Hughes I would not bother if I were your in expanding on your statement, some people will be never satisfied (haven't been in the past) so why bother bareing your good fortune and canny dealing for what - you won't change their minds. I'm quite happy to accept what you say, but then I am an owner of the same Laguna and very happy with it These guys are sweating on the Laguna hoping for a "bad report card" Lets wait and see

    Pug 307 geez have you slipped - a volvo - last of the sedated drivers

    Must be an aberration as I thought you had more in you or was that your clone I met!!

    Cheers

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego
    Pug 307 geez have you slipped - a volvo - last of the sedated drivers
    My Volvo credentials have been known on AF for a long time

    Gee these Renault people, so slow!

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